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Panzerfüssilier snare range

MMX
26 Jan 2020, 12:22 PM
#21
avatar of MMX

Posts: 999 | Subs: 1


On top of that I think only Grenadiers should have the extra range snare because of their vulnerability against vehicles. A 6 man Füssilier squad should not have this privilege.


wasn't the vet3 damage reduction put into place to remedy exactly that?


other than that i agree pfusis should either lose range on their (techless) snare or lose the vet bonus.
27 Jan 2020, 09:13 AM
#22
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1

P.F. do not need any nerfs. The are designed to start slow but get better vet bonuses.

They are where underused in last tournament and that is an indication that are currently UP as an alternative mainline infatry.

They could used a redesign.

On the issue of AT rifle grenades they take too long to fire. They have minimum range that should be removed.
27 Jan 2020, 09:19 AM
#23
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243

give Panzerfu an AT satchel like penals.
27 Jan 2020, 09:21 AM
#24
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

give Panzerfu an AT satchel like penals.

The moment shrecks will do 40 damage with half of current penetration value, you can have it.
27 Jan 2020, 09:57 AM
#25
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2020, 09:21 AMKatitof

The moment shrecks will do 40 damage with half of current penetration value, you can have it.

Install the game, you will that PF with shrecks do not have access to AT grenades so this hole thread is about G43 PF...
27 Jan 2020, 10:16 AM
#26
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2020, 09:57 AMVipper

Install the game, you will that PF with shrecks do not have access to AT grenades so this hole thread is about G43 PF...

Pay attention before screaming random things.
Shrecks doesn't exactly need long aim time and contrary to PTRS, you can easily get off a volley before vehicle gets close to you, taking it down to snare threshold.
And G43 already got sufficient snare and have no excuse to use anything else.

Such big brains, so little room for common sense.
27 Jan 2020, 10:45 AM
#27
avatar of Serrith

Posts: 783

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2020, 10:16 AMKatitof

Pay attention before screaming random things.
Shrecks doesn't exactly need long aim time and contrary to PTRS, you can easily get off a volley before vehicle gets close to you, taking it down to snare threshold.
And G43 already got sufficient snare and have no excuse to use anything else.

Such big brains, so little room for common sense.


The implication I got from ullu's post (and I assume Vipper as well) is to replace the rifle grenade with an AT satchel, not add it in addition to the rest of their kit.

While lulu didnt directly state this was the case, I simply inferred it from the context of the thread being that the AT grenade has too much range, therefore replacing it with AT satchel would be a fix.



That said I dont agree with lulu's suggestion anyway- seems like a case of grass is greener.
27 Jan 2020, 11:09 AM
#28
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2020, 10:16 AMKatitof

Pay attention before screaming random things.
Shrecks doesn't exactly need long aim time and contrary to PTRS, you can easily get off a volley before vehicle gets close to you, taking it down to snare threshold.
And G43 already got sufficient snare and have no excuse to use anything else.

Such big brains, so little room for common sense.

Actually you are the one "screaming random things".

Install the game and you will see that Axis schrek units do not have access to snares contrary to allied infantry.

Comparing allied AT sqauds with access to snares with Axis AT squad without axis to snares on the basis of snares threshold simply does not make any sense. The first have access to snare they other do not, and in addition AT satchel will snare most vehicles even if PTRS do not fire a single shot...

I suggest that you silently acknowledge that fact that your comments "The moment shrecks will do 40 damage with half of current penetration value, you can have it." " before vehicle gets close to you, taking it down to snare threshold." was off target and simply move on, I have.
27 Jan 2020, 11:15 AM
#29
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

u forgot they cost 295 and 80 munition vs 300 of penal and have worse dps at max range

so no they don't need 1 less g43, keep bias out please


Yes I’m top 100 okw in 1v1 and biased against my fav faction.

You do realize you can argue against something without claiming bias, right?

Also max range G43 dps was buffed with the G43 changes, I doubt they lose at max range.
27 Jan 2020, 11:21 AM
#30
avatar of Vipper

Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1



Yes I’m top 100 okw in 1v1 and biased against my fav faction.

You do realize you can argue against something without claiming bias, right?

Also max range G43 dps was buffed with the G43 changes, I doubt they lose at max range.

When did that happen?

Paying 80 mu for 2 g43 would make it one of the worse upgrade in game...

And as I have pointed out usage of PF in the last tournament indicates that PF are UP in their role as alternative mainline.

But this thread is about their snare and not their overall balance.
27 Jan 2020, 12:25 PM
#31
avatar of blvckdream

Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1

Panzerfüssiliers UP now? I have heard it all on COH2.org.

I wonder what Vipper's opinion was if Panzerfüssiliers were an Allied unit.

So just to summarize: a unit that has 6 man, 3 G43s, longest snare in coh2, grenade without call out, flare, sprint, cheap reinforce cost and overall much stronger combat performance than Volks are considered UP.

Vipper time and time argues that Penals are OP but at the same time thinks Panzerfüssiliers, which are objectively just better, are UP. This must be the absolute definition of ridiculous double standards.
27 Jan 2020, 12:36 PM
#32
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

Panzerfüssiliers UP now? I have heard it all on COH2.org.

I wonder what Vipper's opinion was if Panzerfüssiliers were an Allied unit.

So just to summarize: a unit that has 6 man, 3 G43s, longest snare in coh2, grenade without call out, flare, sprint, cheap reinforce cost and overall much stronger combat performance than Volks are considered UP.

Vipper time and time argues that Penals are OP but at the same time thinks Panzerfüssiliers, which are objectively just better, are UP. This must be the absolute definition of ridiculous double standards.

Inb4 lengthy explanation why "this is simply incorrect" comes, explaining you that no amount of utility and combat flexibility(nades, flares, AT nades etc) ever will come close to a bit more dps of penals.
27 Jan 2020, 12:37 PM
#33
avatar of Alphrum

Posts: 808

Panzerfüssiliers UP now? I have heard it all on COH2.org.

I wonder what Vipper's opinion was if Panzerfüssiliers were an Allied unit.

So just to summarize: a unit that has 6 man, 3 G43s, longest snare in coh2, grenade without call out, flare, sprint, cheap reinforce cost and overall much stronger combat performance than Volks are considered UP.

Vipper time and time argues that Penals are OP but at the same time thinks Panzerfüssiliers, which are objectively just better, are UP. This must be the absolute definition of ridiculous double standards.


If pfussies wer an allied unit, axis would have an easier time then going up against inf like riflemen and penals. Pfussies are weaker then volks in early and mid game, but only in late game ther better, overall combat performance i prefer volks but pfussies do have some nice utility and i dont agree ther up but i disagree with your statement saying pfussies are straight up better then penals. Penals utterly destroy pfussies except when in the lategame.
27 Jan 2020, 12:38 PM
#34
avatar of Alphrum

Posts: 808

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2020, 12:36 PMKatitof

Inb4 lengthy explanation why "this is simply incorrect" comes, explaining you that no amount of utility and combat flexibility(nades, flares, AT nades etc) ever will come close to a bit more dps of penals.


funny, i remember u saying the same thing about cons
27 Jan 2020, 12:47 PM
#35
avatar of Mr Carmine

Posts: 1289

Panzerfüssiliers UP now? I have heard it all on COH2.org.

I wonder what Vipper's opinion was if Panzerfüssiliers were an Allied unit.

So just to summarize: a unit that has 6 man, 3 G43s, longest snare in coh2, grenade without call out, flare, sprint, cheap reinforce cost and overall much stronger combat performance than Volks are considered UP.

Vipper time and time argues that Penals are OP but at the same time thinks Panzerfüssiliers, which are objectively just better, are UP. This must be the absolute definition of ridiculous double standards.


I think its because of how cost efficient and efficient overall volks are that pfussies feel up to some. Same with falls, they where nearly never used but fine as a unit. They had to buff falls insanely to make them see more use.
27 Jan 2020, 12:54 PM
#36
avatar of blvckdream

Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2020, 12:37 PMAlphrum


If pfussies wer an allied unit, axis would have an easier time then going up against inf like riflemen and penals. Pfussies are weaker then volks in early and mid game, but only in late game ther better, overall combat performance i prefer volks but pfussies do have some nice utility and i dont agree ther up but i disagree with your statement saying pfussies are straight up better then penals. Penals utterly destroy pfussies except when in the lategame.


If you spend your first muni on Füssiliers G43 they become better than Volks in infantry combat after around 5 minutes in the game. Plus they have a snare without needing a set-up truck which ruins Soviet M3 strats that could otherwise be a big problem for OKW. Not sure how Volks could be considered better in mid-game unless you completely ignore stats.

27 Jan 2020, 13:01 PM
#37
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post27 Jan 2020, 12:38 PMAlphrum


funny, i remember u saying the same thing about cons

Oh do you?
Then you also remember low DPS was never cons problem, but utter lack of any scalability into late game and unreliability of said DPS(high dmg, very low accuracy), both of which eventually were addressed and guess what?
Cons still have tons of utility, low DPS and are now actually used.

PFs always had what cons always dreamed off.
27 Jan 2020, 13:07 PM
#38
avatar of T.R. Stormjäger

Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3

Volks cannot chase wipe. G43 Pfusies wreck shop with chasedown wipes due to G43 moving accuracy, hence why I want them to lose a G43, because the amount of wipes they get while chasing retreating units is too much.

Penals are irrelevant to this, as is standoff dps at max distance.
27 Jan 2020, 14:23 PM
#39
avatar of Mazianni

Posts: 785

Volks cannot chase wipe. G43 Pfusies wreck shop with chasedown wipes due to G43 moving accuracy, hence why I want them to lose a G43, because the amount of wipes they get while chasing retreating units is too much.

Penals are irrelevant to this, as is standoff dps at max distance.


What really needs to happen is the G43 moving accuracy meme needs to be replaced with some other function. One of the stupidest aspects of this game - units running around with scoped G43s firing accurate, rapid shots on the move with sniper rifle tracer fx...

Unfortunately I don't know how I'd rework it otherwise since the LMG42 already fulfills the role of the long-range model killer over on the Ost side, where this weapon carries over from. Subject for another thread.
27 Jan 2020, 14:29 PM
#40
avatar of ullumulu

Posts: 2243



What really needs to happen is the G43 moving accuracy meme needs to be replaced with some other function. One of the stupidest aspects of this game - units running around with scoped G43s firing accurate, rapid shots on the move with sniper rifle tracer fx...

Unfortunately I don't know how I'd rework it otherwise since the LMG42 already fulfills the role of the long-range model killer over on the Ost side, where this weapon carries over from. Subject for another thread.


oh..u mean like a panel could throw a satchel over 100m to a fast forward driving tank....only because he was 1sek in range of his max trow range? And then the satchel fly with magical accuracy..even in curve and trough houses to the tank and never misses and never fall from the tank ? do you mean this magic?
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