Considering there is a balance patch coming up:
Panzerfüssiliers are already very strong with their G43 upgrade + flare + grenade + snare.
IMO they shouldn't have the longest range snare in COH2.
At vet 0 they have 18 range on their snare.
At vet 2 they get a 25% range buff so it ends up at 22,5
In comparison: Volks, Riflemen and Conscripts snare range is 15. Grenadiers 18. None of them have a veterancy snare range increase.
22.5 snare range is insane considering (most) medium tanks have a range of 40.
IMO just remove the snare range veterancy buff.
(Edited to correct the numbers)
Panzerfüssilier snare range
26 Jan 2020, 00:34 AM
#1
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
26 Jan 2020, 01:30 AM
#2
Posts: 4474
I think u may eb ms8atken about he snare range someone did some test and found out that the range 8n the stats haa nothing to do with the ability range
katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
26 Jan 2020, 01:40 AM
#3
Posts: 3046 | Subs: 3
something about your numbers must be wrong. I highly doubt that fusi vet 2 snare range is higher than the range of their rifles
I do agree however that the vet2 range is kinda ridiculous
I do agree however that the vet2 range is kinda ridiculous
26 Jan 2020, 08:11 AM
#4
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Could be that the numbers are wrong. Even though these are the only ones that can ne found in cruzz database. It doesnt change the fact that Füssiliers and their vet 2 snare range are absurd. It would be one thing if Grens as a 4 man squad get this snare range with vet but for a 6 man squad it doesnt make much sense.
26 Jan 2020, 10:47 AM
#5
Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6
Could be that the numbers are wrong. Even though these are the only ones that can ne found in cruzz database.
Those numbers are the weapon's maximum range, a stat that isn't used.
The ability cast range is a different value.
Cast ranges are:
- Pfussie AT grenade 18 (22,5 at vet 2);
- Volks Panzerfaust 15;
- Gren Panzerfaust 18;
- Riflemen AT grenade 15;
- Conscripts AT grenade 15;
- Sappers HEAT grenade 15.
26 Jan 2020, 10:51 AM
#6
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Those numbers are the weapon's maximum range, a stat that isn't used.
The ability cast range is a different value.
Cast ranges are:
- Pfussie AT grenade 18 (22,5 at vet 2);
- Volks Panzerfaust 15;
- Gren Panzerfaust 18;
- Riflemen AT grenade 15;
- Conscripts AT grenade 15;
- Sappers HEAT grenade 15.
Thanks for clarifying. My point still stands. Füssiliers should lose the vet 2 snare range buff.
On top of that I think only Grenadiers should have the extra range snare because of their vulnerability against vehicles. A 6 man Füssilier squad should not have this privilege.
So Make Füssilier snare 15 like all the other regular snares and remove the veterancy buff. Füssiliers are already very strong if not borderline OP as it is, they don't need this sniper snare.
26 Jan 2020, 11:12 AM
#7
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
On top of that Füssiliers also have sprint as a vet ability. Which is another reason why they shouldn't have this super long range snare.
26 Jan 2020, 11:26 AM
#8
Posts: 3588 | Subs: 3
Drop one of the G43s as well.
26 Jan 2020, 11:30 AM
#9
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Drop one of the G43s as well.
They are currently slightly stronger than Penals in combat while at the same time having long-range snare, flares, sprint, relatively cheap reinforce cost and a grenade. I agree something has to be changed.
On top of that their grenade has no audio warning for whatever reason.
26 Jan 2020, 11:37 AM
#10
Posts: 4474
u forgot they cost 295 and 80 munition vs 300 of penal and have worse dps at max range
so no they don't need 1 less g43, keep bias out please
so no they don't need 1 less g43, keep bias out please
katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
26 Jan 2020, 11:39 AM
#11
Posts: 556
For god sake don’t fix what is not broken.
Grens are finally good.
26 Jan 2020, 11:40 AM
#12
Posts: 306
Snare range definetly is ridiculos, and should be changed.
However if i recall corectly the pen and dmg used to be inferiour to other snares.
While i think dmg got normalized i feel that if they nerf the range they should also do the same pen as rifle snare.
Does anyone have exact numbers on this?
However if i recall corectly the pen and dmg used to be inferiour to other snares.
While i think dmg got normalized i feel that if they nerf the range they should also do the same pen as rifle snare.
Does anyone have exact numbers on this?
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26 Jan 2020, 11:42 AM
#13
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
u forgot they cost 295 and 80 munition vs 300 of penal and have worse dps at max range
so no they don't need 1 less g43, keep bias out please
Penals also cost more to reinforce and bleed MP like crazy in late game. Füssiliers are way cheaper over the course of an entire game.
Also almost all of my posts in the last days were about nerfing OP Allied stuff. Not sure how it is possible to call me biased against Axis. I guess common sense is not your strongest suit?
This forum is more and more degenerating into a low IQ wankfest of one faction warriors shouting bias at everyone that wants to touch their favourite faction. It's pathetic. USF and Soviet fanboys calling me Axis-biased and Axis fanboys calling me Allies biased.
26 Jan 2020, 11:44 AM
#14
Posts: 4474
i was talking to storm jager for the g43 part not the at nade, u can literally see i highlighted the g 43 part
Penals also cost more to reinforce and bleed MP like crazy in late game. Füssiliers are way cheaper over the course of an entire game.
Also almost all of my posts in the last days were about nerfing OP Allied stuff. Not sure how it is possible to call me biased against Axis. I guess common sense is not your strongest suit?
This forum is more and more degenerating into a low IQ wankfest of one faction warriors shouting bias at everyone that wants to touch their favourite faction. It's pathetic. USF and Soviet fanboys calling me Axis-biased and Axis fanboys calling me Allies biased.
andf btw they are not stronger in combat then penal, penal beat them at long range with eqaul vet
katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
26 Jan 2020, 11:44 AM
#15
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Snare range definetly is ridiculos, and should be changed.
However if i recall corectly the pen and dmg used to be inferiour to other snares.
While i think dmg got normalized i feel that if they nerf the range they should also do the same pen as rifle snare.
Does anyone have exact numbers on this?
Füssilier snare
Damage 100
Penetration 100
Deflection Damage 80
Volks snare
Damage 100
Penetration 150-140-130
Deflection Damage 80
Grenadier snare
Damage 100
Penetration 160-150-140
Deflection Damage 45
Conscript snare
Damage 100
Penetration 100
Deflection Damage 80
Riflemen snare
Damage 100
Penetration 100
Deflection Damage 80
So in conclusion: Riflemen, Conscripts and Füssiliers all have the same damage and penetration on their snares. Volks have more penetration. Grenadiers have more penetration but less deflection damage.
IMO this is not relevant anyway due to deflection damage. It doesn't matter if you do 100 damage or 80 damage because of how the HP are set up.
For example medium tanks have 640 HP: so to kill them you need 3 ATG shots + 2 snares. It doesn't matter if they penetrate or not because 2x 80 is enough to finish them off.
26 Jan 2020, 11:53 AM
#16
Posts: 3118 | Subs: 2
Are you sure about those numbers?
I always though that snares do 80 damage with 100% pen chance across the board except of the satchel. But I've never put much thought into it.
Can you really snare a T70 to death with 4 Fausts?
I always though that snares do 80 damage with 100% pen chance across the board except of the satchel. But I've never put much thought into it.
Can you really snare a T70 to death with 4 Fausts?
26 Jan 2020, 11:56 AM
#17
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Are you sure about those numbers?
I always though that snares do 80 damage with 100% pen chance across the board except of the satchel. But I've never put much thought into it.
Can you really snare a T70 to death with 4 Fausts?
No snares can be bounced. But it doesn't matter because the engine crit works anyway no matter if they penetrate or not.
And as I said the difference between penetrating and not penetrating is 20 damage which is mostly irrelevant because of how HP works. (for medium and up it's always (usually?) 160 HP steps).
In case of T70 it would matter but it doesn't have enough armour to bounce snares anyway. T70 has 70 armour and all snares have at least 100 penetration.
Numbers are from coh2db.com, they haven't changed recently so should be up to date.
26 Jan 2020, 12:06 PM
#18
Posts: 306
No snares can be bounced. But it doesn't matter because the engine crit works anyway no matter if they penetrate or not.
And as I said the difference between penetrating and not penetrating is 20 damage which is mostly irrelevant because of how HP works. (for medium and up it's always (usually?) 160 HP steps).
In case of T70 it would matter but it doesn't have enough armour to bounce snares anyway. T70 has 70 armour and all snares have at least 100 penetration.
Numbers are from coh2db.com, they haven't changed recently so should be up to date.
if a snare bounces or not means a hell lot, a bounced snare does no engine DMG!
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26 Jan 2020, 12:06 PM
#19
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
if a snare bounces or not means a hell lot, a bounced snare does no engine DMG!
Of course it does.
26 Jan 2020, 12:11 PM
#20
Posts: 3046 | Subs: 3
Yes a bounced snare still causes engine damage
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