High moving accuracy on Panzerfusilier G43

before that us just get more expensive worse volks

No, before that you get a squad that can't be bullied around by a clown car... They can't have everything

and im saying something bad ? what are u here just to respond to any post i make

im saying simply pf g43 are fine

u are free to say u opinion ?

btw u only get penal like performance after tier 1 and after decking out 90 mun, before that us just get more expensive worse volks

You sre paying in munitions instead of map control. Couldn't possibly imagine penals with snares backed by Sturmpios with no tech being remotely balanced.

No, before that you get a squad that can't be bullied around by a clown car... They can't have everything

remove at nades from rile they already get zook and bar they can't have everything, do u realize that u bring no argument ?

You sre paying in munitions instead of map control. Couldn't possibly imagine penals with snares backed by Sturmpios with no tech being remotely balanced.

u forgot doctrinal penals

remove at nades from rile they already get zook and bar they can't have everything, do u realize that u bring no argument ?

What the hell are you talking about...... That comparison could not be more ridiculous. Magically forgetting 300mp and 30 fuel I have to spend just to unlock the ability to spend muni on weapons and nades? I also need vet 1 before I can use snare?

Why do you make literally every balance conversation into an axis v allies debate? Can't you for once just talk about the unit itself without saying "what about _______ that the allies have"????? For the rest of us who actually play all 5 factions, its pretty fucking annoying

BTW I hate the design of rifleman having everything. But thats what you get when you have to choose between AT guns and MGs almost every game, which was also a dumb design choice in my opinion. You're aware of fucking faction assymetry, stop comparing squads and ignoring the fucking context

u forgot doctrinal penals

U forgot fussiliers requiring a tech up that leaves out AT guns, MGs, and indirect fire. Maybe take the fucking hint that you should stop comparing these squads like their identical units on identical factions.

Good jk , I can make comparisons exactly cause I play all factions

And it's y who ignore context, penal are doctrinal squad, like all doc squad they have abilities and upgrade not gated by tech but time

And do u even eat ur own word ? Maybe take the fucking hint that you should stop comparing these squads like their identical units on identical factions.

The discussion litteraly started comparing SMG with g43

For once try to not act like a victim, I compared penal and pfusi cause op asked why g43 exist when there are similar weapon profiles

And was asking for a nerf

And it's y who ignore context, penal are doctrinal squad, like all doc squad they have abilities and upgrade not gated by tech but time

Penals? See your point is so convoluted that even you are losing track of what you're talking about. Fairly certain you meant fussies...

For once try to not act like a victim, I compared penal and pfusi cause op asked why g43 exist when there are similar weapon profiles

Acting like a victim? What are you talking about? All I'm doing is disagreeing with you and pointing out how useless "whataboutism" is

And do u even eat ur own word ? Maybe take the fucking hint that you should stop comparing these squads like their identical units on identical factions.

I'm not, you're the one who brought penals AND Riflemen into this. Which again, why the fuck are you talking about rifles? That's a complete nonsense comparison, they require so much more investment and they are entire core of USF...

cause the op asked "Why do we have such high moving accuracy values on semi-auto rifles? "
well because they are common , penal, rangers , hell guards rifle have the same moving bonuses

Guards makes sense, they have 6 models by when upgraded only 2 shoot on the move, thus the high output from those rifles. Perhaps swapping them with SVTs would be a nice change, even if just a cosmetic one

cause the op asked "Why do we have such high moving accuracy values on semi-auto rifles? "
well because they are common , penal, rangers , hell guards rifle have the same moving bonuses

?

Gren/PF G43
Moving
Accuracy multi
0.8
Burst duration multi
1
Cooldown duration multi (lower is better)
0.5

Penal/Guards/Conscript SVT
Moving
Accuracy multi
0.5
Burst duration multi
1
Cooldown duration multi (+0.25s wind down)
0.75

Riflemen M1 Garand
Moving
Accuracy multi
0.6
Burst duration multi
1
Cooldown duration multi
1.25

Ranger/Para M1 Carbine
Moving
Accuracy multi
0.5
Burst duration multi
1
Cooldown duration multi (+0.2s wind down)
0.25

Guards Mosin Nagant (closest, but not a semi-auto; wind down makes the cooldown decrease less useful)
Moving
Accuracy multi
0.75
Burst duration multi
1
Cooldown duration multi (+1.625s wind down)
0.5

No, before that you get a squad that can't be bullied around by a clown car... They can't have everything

But penals can clean the floor with pfussies faces... both options come from T1 so its more than a fair opening matchup between OKW and SU

U forgot fussiliers requiring a tech up that leaves out AT guns, MGs, and indirect fire. Maybe take the fucking hint that you should stop comparing these squads like their identical units on identical factions.

Do you realize that penals and pfussies are far different from each other apart from being alternative mainlines infantries? One is doc vs other stock, late game oriented vs early domination, Adaptative upgrade vs only AT upgrade and so on...

Lets not lose our minds for a single argument.

Do you realize that penals and pfussies are far different from each other apart from being alternative mainlines infantries? One is doc vs other stock, late game oriented vs early domination, Adaptative upgrade vs only AT upgrade and so on...

I already said that in this thread, on page 1:

Penals are much stronger in beginning, later on vehicles can bully them unless you change their role. Fussies are pretty much only good for snaring light vehicles in the beginning, and scale up

well because they are common , penal, rangers , hell guards rifle have the same moving bonuses

Rangers and guards? Check the CP and cost there dude. Penals aren't even similar enough to compare imo, rangers and guards certainly aren't

Like armadillo said, the reason for guards moving acc. could not possibly be more unrelated to g43s. That's only cause they have 4 weapons they can't fire on the move...

cause the op asked "Why do we have such high moving accuracy values on semi-auto rifles? "
well because they are common , penal, rangers , hell guards rifle have the same moving bonuses

There's not a single other weapon that even comes close to the percentages of moving DPS that the G43s have. Penal SVTs only have 50-60% moving DPS. Only the Guards Mosin comes close, but an upgraded squad only gets two of them so the weapon is mostly irrelevant. The G43s are quite unique with their excellent moving DPS, and that's fine.

There's not a single other weapon that even comes close to the percentages of moving DPS that the G43s have. Penal SVTs only have 50-60% moving DPS. Only the Guards Mosin comes close, but an upgraded squad only gets two of them so the weapon is mostly irrelevant. The G43s are quite unique with their excellent moving DPS, and that's fine.

The weapon might be better but it not available at all squad member so the moving DPS of squad can be comparable even if the G43 is superior.

The weapon might be better but it not available at all squad member so the moving DPS of squad can be comparable even if the G43 is superior.

Moving DPS of a full Panzerfusiliers squad is ~23 at close range (10) down to ~8,5 at max range. G43 Panzergrenaiders have at least ~32,2 and ~10,5 (probably a bit higher because of the latest buffs).
Hell, even cheap Grenadiers have ~18 and ~6,3.

Compared to Penals that have ~14,3 and ~6,3, that is a significant advantage. Especially considering DPS is consolidated in the G43s down to the last two-three models, while Penals straight up lose 17% DPS with every model drop. Only Paratrooper and Ranger elite carbines have comparable total DPS, purely because of raw strength by numbers. But they are elite squads, suffer from the same straight DPS per model drop loss as Penals, and they lose it as soon as they get their weapons upgrades.

TLDR the G43's high moving DPS is a unique and deliberate trait, and no other weapon or more specifically weapons upgrade is really comparable. Some weapons come close, namely elite Carbines and Guards Mosin, but the comparison for those is artificial at best as elite Carbines are replaced by mandatory weapons upgrades, and upgraded Guards only have two Mosin rifles, and both are the first weapons to drop when the squad loses models.

remove at nades from rile they already get zook and bar they can't have everything, do u realize that u bring no argument ?

Yeah pfusies are clearly underpowered. 6 man squad with flares, AT nade, HE nade that is still bugged and has no callout, super high moving accuracy, weapons that are good at all ranges, and an optional AT package is clearly just not enough. They need to start the game with stgs.

Yeah pfusies are clearly underpowered. 6 man squad with flares, AT nade, HE nade that is still bugged and has no callout, super high moving accuracy, weapons that are good at all ranges, and an optional AT package is clearly just not enough. They need to start the game with stgs.

just for ur knowledge, vet 3 penal = pfusi vet 5 in dps

with penal better at long and pfusi better at close

and im just saying that 1 pfusi are not OP as the OP claims they scale as much a penal with more utility and deal similar damage, on the moving part they are a better, but they are still comparable

i think they are mostly fine, they could use a bit more power early as right now they are doctrinal conscripts that cost 35 more mp and come with base at nade , maybe start with 1 g43 ? and just add 2 with the upgrade ? the dps mid would increase by 14% and 28% at close in the early game but long range remain the same , or maybe just shift some CD/acc bonus form vet to base (so they will be the same at max vet)

this would be removed with the pazersherck obviously

And PF have seen their price reduced because they were too expensive. Obers have finally seen OKW T3 more affordable for their deployment.
And both unit are good at vet0, PFs have utility volks are lacking when hitting the field and this solely make for their initial price. In definitive every unit is designed to be better with vet, nothing new here.
...

You might want to debate PF with the MOD team that clearly explained their design in the patch notes:

Panzerfusilliers

The way Panzerfusiliers are deployed has been changed to better match their role as an alternative mainline infantry to Volksgrenadiers. They will be slightly weaker than Volksgrenadiers at the start but have access to the Anti-Tank Rifle Grenades, slightly better combat veterancy, and more powerful upgrades, giving them increased power in the late game. This should make for interesting choices and compositions.

And my point is quite clear if this design has made it the game it can be applied to other units also.