First: Which time frame are you talking about? OKW has a Panther for heavies and a JP4 for medium AT. Late game AT is not the issue. The only issue is that with the current LV meta OKW is forced to get a Puma, since Raketenwerfer is very mediocre and you always need two to be really threatening. This and the lackluster infrared-light is also why few people play the med-HQ. One Raketen will only allow to delay the enemy but not destroy the LV if the LV is played properly. I think the Raketenwerfer suffers most from rng wipes due to bad spacing (also on retreat, which is its most important gadget - take a shot or two and retreat to stay alive), but that discussion is in another thread. Puma is like a AEC - meant to counter LV and maybe take a peeking shot at a medium. After that, the most valuable asset becomes the stun shot.
Why should OKW be better in everything than the Allies? As SOV, you might have decent AT but bad team weapons (especially a lacking MG against an infantry-aggressive faction like OKW) and no fortifications. USF has okay-ish team weapons, bad fortifications compared to OKW and good AT. UKF is slightly OP, but is very immobile due to the lack of high DPS AT.
Only OKW has the ability to set up a complete forward base (reinforcing, healing, even auto-repairs and defense). The only faction that can do that is UKF, but only with the right commander choice and at way higher cost.
Don't want your trucks destroyed? Place them in the base sector like absolutely every other faction. OKW has the option of a forward base (and can also spawn units there), not the obligation.
I think the problem with the SU76 is that it was meant to be build at the mid/end of the LV phase to first fight light vehicles and then scale into the midgame to be a decent contender to out-of-position-P4s or just take a shot at an attacking P4 to force it back before the P4 gets too close. Following the Soviet theme of multi-role, non-specialized units, it also had an arty function to make up for it's relatively poor AT performance compared to the StugIII. Since it was very spammable against Ostheer that needs to rely on a fast P4, the SU76 became too potent and got double nerfed. Since the barrage costs now 35 mun, it does not make sense to buy it early, even if your opponent did not have a vehicle yet, because the barrage costs quite a lot of ammo. The barrage (same for the ZiS AT gun) is usually not worth it unless you're desperate of can force retreat a super important unit, usually a MG42. So you build the SU76 only as a reaction to enemy vehicles, otherwise it is practically useless.
Now there are two problems:
Against OKW, you either run into a Luchs or a Puma, or a P4 that can be penetrated only unreliably. While it is okay against a Luchs, you're still better off with a T70 that also fights the Luchs but kills infantry as well. If the enemy has a Puma, the SU76 is risky because it is slow and has no turret. And the OKW P4 has too much armor, so it's just better to save the fuel and wait for a SU85 instead.
Against OST the SU76 is an okay-ish option only if you're behind on fuel and the enemy already has a P4. But due to the AT nerfs the SU (which was actually meant to be Soviets AT option) is not THAT cost-effective on the AT departement anymore, even against a P4 (you need 5 pens plus a snare to kill it and the SU76 hits unreliably). If you're not behind on fuel, just get a T70 instead or wait for a T34 or SU85. You don't need a dedicated AT vehicle for Ostheer's "Super light" vehicles (251/222), PTRS or a single ZiS will do fine.
Like I said in another thread, I would lower the barrage ability to about 20-25 mun. That makes it affordable to use, but not spammable and should still shut down the SU76 spam like it was pre-nerf.
Wind up/Wind down are stats you should consider as well.
Slightly off topic:
What exactly are the stats that one needs to account for to calculate time to shoot at a target?
I know there is "aim time" (or so) that needs to pass each time a new unit is targeted but not between successive shots at the same target.
Then there is the reload - quite obvious.
There is some post-firing time (=weapon cooldown?) if I recall correctly. Not sure if it applies to vehicles though.
I don't know about more. Could someone please elaborate and tell me where to find them in the game data? Maybe via PM to not clutter the thread.
But su76 can camo with doctrine. It's a cheaper alternative and before de barrage price nerf it was used in the meta. A su76 comes early enough to fight P4 and even though it can't solo them, coupled with a zis you could repel and even kill it.
Su76 =/= drugs
Simply because the units they have to face.
The problem with pre-nerf SU76 was that it could force a retreat on a P4 Due to range and high pen and that the barrage was free, so it could displace crew weapons and kill 1-2 models of attacking infantry with no extra cost. Also it was quite cheap, so by the time the enemy got a P4, you already hat ~SU76 out, which made the P4 quite useless.
Since it got a double nerf, nobody builds it anymore. It has become mediocre at best at it's AT and can't really fight infantry anymore (35 ammo is quite pricey, especially if you use it against a moving target). I think the SU76 should get back a little bit of far pen or the cost of the barrage should be reduced to ~20 mun.
Reload is 5 seconds at vet 0, versus Jackson's 6.55s and SU-85s 5.65s.
But the real fun begins when it gets veterancy, as its reload with vet decreases to 3.523s at vet 4.
(SU-85 has 4.57s and Jackson 5.054s at vet 3)
In addition to that it also gets 800HP at vet 2, so it will out-DPS (versus hp) all Allied TDs with ease.
Where do you have those numbers from?
I looked into the game files and Jackson has a reload of 4,375-4,975 (avg 4,675), SU85 has 5,4-5,4. Did I look up the wrong category?
Why not give it more close range pen and higher speed and acceleration?
The concept of the T34 is flanking, this would feed into the aggressive playstyle of Soviets as a cheap throw away unit that pushes into enemy lines to force a break through. The only problem I see atm is that the T34 will always be suicided for rocket arty.
Sorry but what do you mean by "intended"? Axis TDs intended to deal with mediums and allied TDs intended to kill heavies? The point of this topic is not their penetration performance against mediums.
JP4 does self spot at VET2, not by default.
The durability of JP4 is not enough to protect it against the INTENDED allied Super-TDs. 230armor vs 220/240/260 pen of M36. They can penetrate each other with every shot.
Targets of StuG and JP4 are light vehicles and mediums. Allied medium tank is usually 160 armor, making Stug and JP4 pen with 100% chance.
Unlike Axis, with the expection of Soviets Allies do not have access to another tier of tank destroyers that can deal with heavies. This means that their TD must be able to deal with the heaviest armor, otherwise we go back to the "I win"-King Tiger button.
Also, Allies usually don't have much heavy armor, so the Panther is an additional option as a brawler tank or against heavy call ins or heavier British tanks to reliably deal with them. That's why Stug and JP4 don't need the pen to deal with heavy armor.
Also, JP4 has 45 base sight which enables it to spot mediums for itself without being fired back on.
No matter how many time you repeat the same argument it will not become true.
psst, load the game you will see that only 2 out of 5 faction have 2 dedicated TDs stock in 2 different tiers. (actually one since SU-76 can barrage)
Of course this is true.
Without M36 USF could only fight mediums at best, because Stuarts and the US Pak do not have the pen to deal with anything heavier than a Stug. So the M36 needs the pen to damage a Panther and even heavier. It's not well designed, but that's what we got.
I am not suggesting to buff the Panther and nerf the Su-85.
I am simply making some points:
1)Unit should have role in the game.
2) Units should be balanced both in vet 0 and at higher vets. The relationship could change if there is a reason. A unit vetting slower might need to have superior vet bonuses.
3) Unit should be priced according to their role if the role of the JP is to counter enemy mediums and enemy tank destroyer the unit should cheaper than those units.
4) Tds should not have 100% chance to hit and penetrate enemy vehicles at range 60. Else they have little reason to engage in other ranges.
Since you said that SU85 vets faster and better than a Panther, this would destroy the balance from vet 0 units and that Allied TDs would be OP in general, it heavily suggested that you want to nerf/buff some units.
Apart from point 3 I do agree on the rest. Especially for point 4 I would like the game to be slower with bigger maps in general so that tank battles can be drawn out a bit. But for CoH2 it's too late, we need to tweak the current system to the best status possible.