Profile of Dangerous-Cloth

Damage reduction for Grens

Are you fucking kidding me? Are grenades just supposed to be fucking worthless versus grens now?

Jesus Christ, reduce their reinforcememt time and cost at vet 3 if you want, but this damage reduction nonsense, especially after we literally just got done removing it from Rangers, and right after all the indirect fire nerfs to USF and Soviets.

Why would anyone think this is a good idea? I mean, its a four man squad nondoc, sure. It's also 240mp.

It is the core mainline infantry unit of the faction, with only 4 models, that gets wiped way too easily.

You can't if you keep it 6 men.

the panzerwerfer is great for fighting vehicle and artillery spam... plus the only real arty that poses a threat to grens are either rocket arty... tanks scotts... or pack howis...

rocket arty can be suicided at by panzers along with scotts...tanks can be pushed back by AT guns... and the pack howi can be counterbatteried by the panzerwerfer...

the best strat to do when the enemy builds 2 SU/jacksons is to either

1. get MG-42s and creep em forward with panzerwerfers to kill enemy arty

2. creep grens forward but keep them separate to cap territory...

3. move the AT gun forward to dissuade tanks from killing ur stuff

4. laugh how at least 30% of their popcap is consumed by AT... while you counter em with basic infantry and artillery

Great in theory, anything but sound in practice. This sounds like a 4v4 strategy. How is this supposed to work on 90% of the 2v2 maps? Most of them are close quarters with many sight blockers, this teamplay strategy will get rekt easily...

How does this work if your enemy does the exact same thing, but with their superior infantry, rocket artillery and TDs?

Grens are great damage dealers when vetted up. I think the biggest problem for them is their terrible early game power.

Yes and then lose that vet in the blink of an eye because 4 men lol. Ostheer's problem is facing superior squad sizes, whom lose perhaps 1/5 or 1/6 (or less if upgraded) of their fire power when losing a model. Lose a model as ostheer and you are down 25% in most cases (pgrens or stormtroopers), unless upgraded grens. However, with upgraded grens, you lose one model and are in a very dangerous situation, one good hit from anything can wipe that squad easily. Not to mention that retreating with only 2 models left is risky, as you can get wiped very easily. Compare this to to losing 2 or 3 models and retreating on a 5 or 6 model squad.

Then we get to the point where we have tier 4 with powerful units, which just don't work in most 1v1 scenarios. The needed investment to get 1 panther, which will then get swamped by everything else the enemy has build up in great quantity, is not worth it. You still need to crutch on tier 3. There is no way around it. However good stugs may be, fighting jacksons, fireflies or multiple mediums with a stug or 2 and a p4, is very frustrating, as your mediums get shutdown pretty easily by those long range tank destroyers, who have turrents mind you. Not to mention the easily accessible handheld at for infantry of other factions, such as bazookas and ptrs. Althoug ptrs and bazooka aren't the best handheld at, they do add up against tier 3 units pretty easily, especially when considering all the other stuff facing your tier 3 units.

You're missing the point. I fully understood your comment. You know, you could have asked for what exactly he meant with "free" or just accept the fact that a probably new player was not super specific in his wording. You also did not adress his question with a single serious word. Just mockery.
You know, you could have been helpful instead.
Disappointing.

Now, before this gets further derailed, let's get back to topic. Write me a PM if you really want to drag this on further.

Fair enough.