I would second this, I don't typically find rifles lacking too much vs comparable infantry, but once tanks and indirect fire come with explosives that ignore RA, the cost to maintain 4-5 rifles(inluding officers in this), RE's any support weapons can be quite prohibitive.
Additioanlly when you get to late game, if you have gone say 2 officers that's 37 popcap, 6 for vet 3 Re's, 1 major 3, ambulance 3, without any support weapons that's 52 popcap. Limiting your tank pool (IK there is decrewing) and decreasing your manpower income. For example the other day i got 2 officers and 2 support weapons, then I was popcapped with 2 vehicles, a sherman/priest. It's hard to make decisive pushes with limited vehicles and even if successful reinforcing may still drain your reserves.
TLDR: Popcap sucks when you gotta spam rifles
1 if 5 men are weak to explosive immagine using gren
2 USF can surpass the pop cap limit thank to the crew mechanic, if u have pop cap problems with USF immagine any other faction whom can’t use crew mechanic |
1 the is no recoil or spray mechanic it got debunked
2 got my stats from https://www.coh2db.com/stats/#86 |
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the problem people have is the stg and the early flood of volks, cut stating mp of okw and replace stgs with mp40 package from fire doc, buff the volks vet accordingly, so they can survive till close range (like cons with 40% ra) |
I've played more USF recently to find out how riflemen trade, since I also thought they were a very decent unit. Feelings are a little bit more mixed now.
Initially, they trade alright in early game. You pay more, but get more damage close range and the balance seems fine.
Problem comes when Volks upgrade to StGs, because they get incredibly efficient vs Riflemen. Maybe it's also a combo of StG upgrade and the vet bonus difference at the early/mid game, hard to tell apart.
But to trade efficiently, you basically MUST side tech weapon racks which nullifies the fuel advantage in starting resources you have over OKW. Also I'm not sure if one BAR is enough then, I get the feeleing that StG Volks and one BAR Rifles are somewhat ewual, maybe still an advantage for Volks. Still, for 15 mun more you trade at least model for model, so way betfer MP trade and MP concentration.
This comes on top of the stronger Sturmpio start for OKW which OKW can use to even out their resource disadvantage, combined with good map presence of the cheaper Volks.
Then basically your sherman comes out at the same time OKW has a P4, meaning that you're better off buying the Jackson right away since your AT gun does not help much vs OKW P4 and you don't have mines.
So to play against OKW you're not allowed to make many mistakes, ozherwise you'll not make it into late game where USF gets some very good stuff. 2 stg < 1 bar dps this not even counting the extra m1 garand that rifle keep |
I don't get how you can spend this entire thread arguing with people when you agree that the StG needs to go. That is a nerf to volks and you spend the entire time criticizing OP
He usually deserves the criticism, but take a break every once in a while
he is asking for a base nerf or buff to units, not a nerf to stgs
quote: As far as I can tell this just means Riflemen preform poorly at both long and short ranges. I mean how do you tell what "mid-range" even is?
BARs aren't even all that great. Riflmen don't hold territory well at all.
he does deserve crit as it's the 3rd time we post dps curve, and he just ignores it once again
and keep feeding the propaganda of the ubermech volks and the virgin rifles, when all it's in his head canon |
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then the problem is not volks but the stg, give mp 40 adjust vet, put stg in the fire doc |
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could work, still don't put 7th men on tier 1 or we will never see tier 2 |
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HAIL LELIC |
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Then what does contribute to ? ban him too, he literally occupies server space for propaganda faction and not constructive arguments |
1. About OKW P4 i already said - it can be seen in every game OKW, while t-3485,E8 only in doctrines.
2. Vet3 means ACE (for OKW vet 5). It vet 5 actually.
I used stats from coh2db and recent patchnote (for pen and acc of SU-76), if target size is 17 i will change it.
Stug comes 0,5 tier later (some players give to T3 OST 3.5 value). But ally mediums comes to Tier4, while SU-76 comes on t3. We have equal situation, when t3.5 Stug fights against T4 mediums and t3 Su-76 against T3.5 medium. Any disagree? T-3476, Sherman, Cromwell comes more later than stug too (if we consider that both player have equal fuel income and no one didn't have both fuel points).
About mediums - read notes, OST P4 not bad at all. And it cost, more than right as for me. In theory we could make the same comparsion between mediums.
Yes i could recalculate for 55 range. I'll make new column.
that does not change it only gets 30% reload speed even at max vet, the db stats are probably wrong about that one
osther and ukf literally spend the same fuel to reach tier 3 if they rush (ukf skips side upgrades, osther skips tier 1 and 2 buildings)
OKW p4 is still a premium medium, it's not the doc that make it a premium medium, it's the price and stats, it cost 30 more fuel than a cromwell and comes later too |
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