After some more extensive 1vs1 testing here is a list of problematic units.
Su76:
Before the barrage nerfs it was completely obvious that the unit was batshit op, but after the nerfs the true problem emerged. The unit itself is just too accurate. Out of 20 shots at max range maybe 1 or 2 misses against a p4. Paired with the high rate of fire the penetration nerfs don't matter. Even if every second shot bounces you can deal massive damage thanks to accuracy and rof. I would never build a su85 considering the low armor of the Tiger and the low cost of the su76. On top of that, the su76 has a good barrage. All in all the only weakness is the 400? HP pool. So it gets two shotted by the new Panther and Tiger.
The stug in comparison looks like complete garbage. It has lower range, is less accurate and slower. More health doesn't mean anything if you can kite all day with the su76.
What I suggest:
I really like the support oriented approach for the su76. It should have decent at and decent ai for cheap.
With that in mind, I think you could rebuff the barrage, but make it so, that it requires planning. First, it should not instantly activate and second, there should be a punish by driving up to the su76 and shooting it. The barrage can be powerful, but only if it's punishable. So introduce a setup and tear down time for the barrage ability. Maybe 2-3 secs for setup and 1-2 for tear down. Of course, the values should be tested but I think you get a general Idea.
Then it's time to nerf the far accuracy, and maybe even the penetration could go down a bit as well. Every 3-5 shot should bounce on the p4 so closing in would be rewarded. (same approach as the stug).
Finally to address the annoying two shoot potential late game I would change the vet 2? reload buff with a +40HP buff, so it survives two panther/tiger shots but still gets down to 3 pak/stug shots. And maybe add some barrage cooldown/shots fired buff.
After this changes, there would be a clear role for the su76 and the su85 and not much overlapping. Su85 would be pure hard AT perfect for countering heavy armor with good damage and accuracy, and the su76 would be a mixture of light AT, and a mobile Howitzer, perfect for killing light vehicles and holding mediums at bay.
Penals:
Penals are still problematic thanks to their vet. If you loose a grenadier squad later on you have almost no chance of revetting it. Penals at vet 3 just walk up to anything and annihilate it. Also Mg dont stand a chance once one or two vet 3 Penals attack it. The nerf to moving dps was a good first step, but in the light of buffed conscripts, far dps should go down a bit, so grens have more of a chance at long range. (It shouldn't be something drastic, only a few percent)
Another problem is the availability of the targeted satchel charge without buying Ptrs. Before this change, Penals had a clear weakness, Vehicles. Right now this weakness is more or less gone. With the pathing as it is, one single mistake can cost you your vehicle. This makes light vehicles extremely frustrating. More than once my 222 got stuck in a hedge, wall etc. Also you cant be aggressive with a 250 against penals, onc satchel and its gone.
I would suggest locking the targeted satchel behind the Ptrs upgrade so you have to sacrifice firepower to get some AT. After all, that was the designed weakness of T1. Or at least lock it behind the AT nade upgrade.
Repair Vet
I dont think this is the right approach. To damage a vehicle should be rewarding for you and punishing for your opponent. Not giving him a chance to vet up his pios, so that future mistakes he makes (in letting his vehicles get damaged) are less punishing by decreasing the time he needs repairing.
What I suggest:
For a start, just decrease the vet requirements. And then start to split the boni over vet 1 and 2. Same as the PG received accuracy split. If that's not enough make the sweeper activatable, like the sturmpio one, so they have more dps and more chance to vet up.
Thats it for now, hope it was somewhat understandable
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Post History of 0ld_Shatterhand
Thread: Eastern Front Armies Revamp 5 Jun 2017, 10:56 AM
In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: (4) Operation Sonnenwende1 Jun 2017, 19:33 PM
Ok after playing a few rounds on this map, let's give some feedback. I really liked the symmetrical abroach, there both sides have an equal chance to win. Still, the resource layout is problematic. With all munition on top, there is no reason to go anywhere else. The battle revolves around the top for the majority of the game, which is boring and frustrating if one team manages to lock out the other. Also, retreats are very punishing due to the time it takes to get back on the field. My suggestion would be to move the bases closer to each other, get rid of a few territory points and move some resource and maybe vp points into the middle, so where is actually a reason to fight where. Also rework the cutoffs, so that you have a clear one for each side. All in all, you have a promising foundation for a really good competitive map, so thank you for your work, and hopefully you can get something out of this. In: Map Sharing |
Thread: Eastern Front Armies Revamp 24 May 2017, 14:24 PM
When I would say its the penals fault, not the PGs. In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: Eastern Front Armies Revamp 24 May 2017, 13:46 PM
I think Panzergrenadiers are in a good spot right now. No need to change them anymore. They are viable and with the recent vet change, they also scale very well. The only things that might be candidates for a change are reinforcement time, and the g43 upgrade. But this is a matter of fine tuning, not completely changing the behavior of a unit. In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: Eastern Front Armies Revamp 21 May 2017, 12:44 PM
Great changes so far, really appreciate the work you guys put into this. One or two points about some Ostheer stuff: -The changes to the Artillery Officier are great, however, I don´t think its enough to make him really viable. He desperately needs another vet 1 ability -Ostwind also needs something else, Blitzkrieg is great, but it doesn't help to set it apart from the p4. A stationary mode there it suppresses would maybe be a great idea -250HT changes are great, but still the cps are to high for a Grens squad with basically a M3 without mgs. Also its the only Ostheer unit which cant vet. Maybe give it the ability to act as a forward retreating post. -Ambush Camouflage, bug fixes are great, but why cant the pioneers get upgraded with it. Its the one unit there it would be really good. -Close Air Support AT Loiter needs a nerf. Its way too good in what it does, so to nerf the strafe from CAS and dont touch the Loiter seems inconsistent. -Pak 40 TWP nerfs are justified, but you should add sight loss to the penalties. Right now you only slow the target for half the damage and a munition cost. In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: Redesign Penal battalions11 May 2017, 12:32 PM
I think what Vipper wants to say, is what each unit should excel at a special range, not at every range. And I have to partially agree with him. The gren/ rifleman engagement is a good example for it. Grens win long range, but loose close to mid, so you can calculate the outcome of a fight (given that rng doesn't screw you over). This consistency is something that got partially destroyed by the Volksgrenadier Stg upgrade, Tommies and Penals. Because they are good at all ranges, so you can't predict an outcome reliably because rng plays a way bigger role. But I dont think Penals are the worst offender in this category. After all, this nerfs and changes they are in a somewhat decent spot, sure they could get some fine tuning but the Volksgrenadier STG should be priority nr. 1 Because right now with the Stg upgrade Riflemen don't win reliably in close combat anymore, how it was design to be. I would favour a role change upgrade, the mp40 comes to mind. Future patches should focus on reinforcing the clear role of infantry relative to each other (if relic allows it of course ). So what you always know how you should position your units then approaching different opponents. In: Lobby |
Thread: Ægion's Doctrinal Adjustments10 May 2017, 12:25 PM
I like generally like your ideas, especially for USF, so I took a quick look at some of the changes in CheatMod. That's the list of Bugs, Inconsistencies I found: USF: IR Marksmen: -Their ability range is too high -Then ordered to attack (right click and attack move) something they move close in, so what the guy with the carbine can shoot, completely negating the long range Greyhound: -The IR Sweep ability is available at vet 0 -Pack Howie for 100 mun is too cheap, for the power it has WC51: -Wrong Icon then upgraded with 50cal (it shows mg42) same thing with Sherman -A firing arc is shown then clicking on the vehicle, but there is no suppression -> confusing Sherman: -105 upgrade has Icon of arty barrage -sherman keeps it mobility even then upgraded to a bulldozer - you can invest now 260mun in a single tank -> change some upgrade cost to fuel -wrong voice line then upgrading (always says "mount that 50") Soviet: Shock Army: -Revolver has no shooting animation and flows behind the back -Red Banner T34 are way too cheap for what they offer also wrong call in icon Ostheer: 250 Halftrack: -Wrong voice line then call on to the field (announcer always says something about mortar halftrack) -even then not upgraded the mortar is still in it -then upgraded the mortar has no crew, so it fires on its own -then upgraded to mortar halftrack wrong icon So yea that's it for now, your mod needs a lot of refining, but the concept behind it sounds great, so keep it up! Also, you shouldn't split your mod in two parts. First it's confusing what exactly changed (due to unclear patch notes) and second many changes only work if you have them all at once. |
Thread: DOW3 review round up9 May 2017, 14:00 PM
Game is running fine, never had a Bugsplat in 25 hours playtime. In: Other Games |
Thread: Cleaning up the 1v1 map pool(again)6 May 2017, 19:18 PM
One of the major problems is, that almost nobody is playing custom games with custom maps on a relatively high standard. The same problem applies to Balance Previews. So the main game has to be used as a testing stage. I think it would be a great Idea, to create a part of coh2.org dedicated to map testing. It should work kinda similar to replay reviews. Mapmakers would send in their maps and would receive quality feedback. Because let's face it maps are the only new content coming to the game, so they should be good. I am willing to participate in such tests, but as a single person, I can´t achieve much. Edit: One thing to add, is that the map makers perspective is also really important. His vision of the map and how it should be played is really helpful for giving feedback and making suggestions in how to improve it. In: COH2 Gameplay |
Thread: buggy infantry behaviour when placing sandbags2 May 2017, 10:26 AM
Experienced the same thing, but it only happens with que orders. It started after the the Integration of the winter balance patch. In: COH2 Bugs |
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