Profile of shadowwada

Swift, I don't think we disagree at all as everything you said leads to similar conclusions.

In regards to CoH2 players not understand DoW3 or would come with preconceived notions, this is the point to putting them into the beta. They could provide a unique perspective on balance. From an esports perspective, this is why they should be in the beta; our pros should be given the beta so they can train & learn dow3. while their coh2 POV may make their thoughts on balance or strategy different or "wrong", they have the skill to become pro. For example, DevM is a master ranked LoL player. I've had a top 10 clan in the RTS WiC, Diamond Rank 1 in HotS & plat in LoL. If one is able to be pro in one type of game, their skills can transfer to others, especially of the same genre. Reynad started as a Magic player, Dr. Disrespect was a COD player, some of the overwatch pros come from tribes & TF2.

This leads to my point about the esports scene: while an esports scene will naturally develop, we should be trying to maximize growth. Instead of letting things grow naturally, we should be injecting steroids into it or pouring fuel onto the esports fire. DoW3 is where Relic's focus is so it will be the bigger esport scene compared to CoH2 (it helps to have the Warhammer 40k IP). For all intents and purposes, the coh2 esports scene is dead compared to DoW3. We shouldn't be wasting time when top tier players could be training and practicing. Also from the balance perspective, the pros could find if there is anything broken. The Frontline Network's beta tourney showed how insanely broken clowncars were so Relic had the info to patch it before/at launch. Also my point about hearthstone, hearthstone & overwatch had HUGE esports scenes before the games even came out. (the beta aspect is a bit problematic sine reynad & a seagull became as big as they did because they were in beta; they might not have been as big if they had to wait until release)

As for your point on inviting people, you merely need to reverse your perspective; instead of saying X shouldn't be invited because caeltos or *insert dow2 pro* wasn't, we should be saying they both should be invited. If there is a pro from dow2 or coh2 who wants to compete in the dow3 scene, they should be invited.

The major point is WE NEED PLAYERS. Look at coh2's playerbase. There hasn't been any new blood in a long time. Most of the top tier players have been playing since the beginning of coh2 or even coh1. The last group of pros were with me: momo4sho, talisman, and space hamster. While we had this new blood participate in ESL, we lost most people by warpaint and definitely afterwards. With the release of DoW3, it will be one of the highest, if not the highest, playerbase numbers so to retain & grow off of that size, esports & competitive scene needs to be strong out of the gate. Also we need the casters & tourney organizers. We had Ami and Romeo but they left because of the above problems. Lack of pro playerbase & lack of support from relic. When DoW3 comes out is when playerbase and relic's support will be at the highest so WE NEED TO BE CHARGING OUT OF THE MOTHAFOOKING GATE!

@Relic, since they might not see the point of "esports", there is a simple equation of big esports = big $$$. Look at League of Legends, they produce content at a extremely high rate because of their esports scene. The bigger your esports scene leads to the game getting bigger which leads to bigger money. I've said before that Relic's problem is their leadership and, by extension culture. They live in a bygone-era where you came out with a kool single player & a casual funz multiplayer but we live in a new world, an esports world. They rather cling to the past and make a "good" game instead of going outside their comfort zone. IF YOU WANT TO HUNT WITH THE BIG DOGS AND PEE IN THE TALL GRASS, you have to go outside your comfort zone.

Lastly, the coh2 pros & casters should have been invited into the beta because of their year(s) of service since it would be an easy way to show appreciation. If you watch my stream, you know i do a joke about how me or tightrope or whoever hasn't gotten a relic/coh2 t-shirt even though we've done so much. Juxtaposed, Excessive Profanity streamed the coh2 for 1-2 weeks and got a large carepackage: signed copy of the game & poster and other swag. I'm not against giving streamers free stuff to incentivize them to play the game thus get more exposure but I have a problem when a dude who streamed the game for a week got shit tons more than a lot of our dedicated community members. I had a longer response on the dow3 forum about the idea of loyalty & fairness but i think you guys get my point.

In closing, I am the shadowwada and we need more real mothafuckas like me if we want the #ESPORTS dream.

I've posted this in the DoW3 forum but it also needs to be said here since DoW3's success is vital to the longevity of CoH2. A rising tide raises all ships so if Relic prospers with DoW3, we might see more content for CoH2. CoH2 & DoW3 are different enough to have unique esports scenes. Also the DoW3 scene could be a much needed source for new players for our esports scene. Simply put, DoW3's success could be CoH2's.

Now onto the problem at hand, we are less than 6 weeks from launch and besides Helping Hans, the entire CoH2 scene isn’t included in the beta. The CoH2 community needs to be included for two main reasons:

1. Give balance feedback since the top tier players are able to ascertain potential balance problems that the general pop. won’t notice.

2. Allow the esport scene to start forming. Give players more experience since waiting would be wasting time. For reference, The Frontline Network organized the first CoH2 tournament before the beta’s end and they wouldn’t have been able to do so if the players & casters/organizers weren’t given adequate time to prep. Another example is Tempo Storm as founder Reynad became one of the first & most successful Hearthstone players during the beta. If he wasn’t in the beta, chances are Tempo Storm wouldn’t be what it is today.

With the three DoW3 & the one CoH2 community managers, I’m sadden that this hasn’t already been done. With the mixed response to DoW3 (being more like a MOBA & SC2), it would be imperative to get our pro players’ perspective. Recently on Generals Gentlemen’s podcast, Hans was the only one who gave a favorable appraisal of DoW3 since he was the only one who played it. Despite being one of CoH2's lead balance patchers, GG The Machine didn’t get an invite. Neither did ESL/Warpaint caster and tourney organizer Stormless. If they played it, they would probably have a more favorable impression. Once the NDA is lifted, our competitive scene would be more experience thus provide better matches & entertainment for viewers. As such, most of the negative perception surrounding DoW3 would dissipate.

Here is a list of some of the major CoH2 community members:

Luvnest, Helping Hans, Von Ivan, DevM, Momo4sho, Ciez, Siberian, VindicareX (also pro DoW2 player), Stormless, GGTheMachine, Tightrope, and Shadowwada.

If I forgot someone, comment to let Relic know. This is only a partial list of our top players, streamers, and content creators. Also I'm not familiar with DoW2 pro scene, so i can't give specific names, but their top community members & pro players should be included for the same reasons.

Relic is between Blizzard and Valve. We are now moving into RIOT stage.

PD: IF you think you can do better then please present us a mod. If it's good and popular Relic will make it into the live game. IF not, the words are just gonna be blown up by the wind.

Relic aint moving into the riot stage because riot actually balances a game. CoH2 has a ton of bugs and poor "number" type balance(such as increase/decrease cost of unit or buff/nerf unit performance), which is stuff that can be easily fixed. However Relic's big picture philosophical balance is extremely poor. For example, their asymmetrical balance has many flaws. Take the armor and AT difference between allies and axis. Axis has some of the best late game armor AND the best AT. The pac40 has high pen and a stun shot, which can deal with most of allies' weaker armor. pgrens get two schreks while USSR doesn't get any handheld AT and the USF equivalent is significantly weaker then schreks. If you're going to give axis the best armor, allies should have the best AT.

There is also the blatant missing of key component "asymmetrical balance": Flamers are the hard counter to buildings but USF, brits, & OKW (volks atleast have nade) dont get them, USF lack of late game arty (took years for T0 mortar), usf lack of sniper & sniper counter, USF lack of mines, USF lack of late game armor, USF weak AT nade, brits lack of AT nades, brits lack of early & late game arty, OKW lack of early game arty(this is why maxim spam owns them), ect. There is a reason the most competitive factions are OST & USSR since they are the ones with the most components. If you want to be cynical, they leave the gaps in the factions so they can sell commanders to plug up the holes but you run into the problem that you can only go one commander so youre still stuck with holes.

Also the dumb RNG, which is 100% counter intuitive to balance, is still in the game. Random weapon drops, vehicle crits, and vehicle abandons are still in the game. Model drop is still inconsistent.

Lastly your point of "if youre a better balancer, make a mod and prove it", it is Relic's job to balance their game. I'm against the whole idea of having community members creating balance mods & balancing the game since Relic should HIRE devs instead of exploiting free labor from the community. Even if you think community mods & balance is a good idea, the winter balance patch isn't out when there is only two weeks left of winter so even if your ideas are good, it will take forever to get into the game. Personally I've offered my insight to Relic, which they've never accepted, and it doesnt matter since the competitive community is pretty congruent with the current problems and how to fix them but they remain unfixed. We can quibble about the big picture philosophical issues but when there are countless bugs & simple "number" issues that takes HALF A YEAR TO FIX ONLY SOME OF THEM, the game be dead or at the very least, the esports scene is dead.

One of the biggest problems is how the USSR doctrine cloak makes the non-retreatable AT gun move slower than retreatable rekens with their non-doctrine cloak. No consistency. Very low risk high reward play with cloak rekens sneaking up to volley armor then retreat.

wow, what a thread. dangerous bob crying about UP axis and aaa the allied fanboy #1 in one single thread. enough internet for today.

USSR dominates ost tbh