1 simple slot with buildable pak40 or call-in Infantry squad with upgradable 2 shreks will solve OKW AT problem and you will still have 4 slots left. Don't think that's gonna be waste of a commander, to be honest it will be probably totall opposite of that. Most player hate rakketens, they want unit that is more efficient and reliable. Sturmpio aren't upgraded with shrek becouse you really need a sweeping squad, especially in high lvl game so you basicly have to count on your own tanks.
Pak40 or pantherjeager squad with AT weapon will be enough to fill that role.
Why not just buff raketens instead of creating a new commander that fills a gap in an existing lineup and leave actual abilities and new upgrades to the commander? Infantry with an anti-tank package is fine since OKW doesn't get Pgrens, but throwing in a Pak40 for the sake of it doesn't fix the reason that people want, of all things, an anti-tank gun from a commander. |
Doctrine Name: Guard Rifle Elite Tactics
(2 CP) DP-28 Light Machine Gun Package for Conscripts.
Allows Conscripts to upgrade to 1 DP-28 LMG for 50 munitions (or 2 for 90 if programming 1 DP is too difficult or buggy). This ability allows Conscripts to scale better into the late game without eliminating the need for more elite squads like Guards and Snipers. Conscripts would not be able to button enemy vehicles like Guards. Even lesser infantry of guard battalions would be equipped with superior weapons to allow them the firepower necessary to break German formations.
(2 CP) Guard Rifle Infantry squads unlocked for call-in.
Guard Rifles form the core of the Guards Battalion as a dependable and powerful infantry unit that can defeat both infantry and light vehicles.
(5 CP) Conscript Repair Tactics.
There is little time to stop during the organized pushes of the Guards Battalion. This allows Conscripts to keep vehicles moving for operations.
(8 CP) Mark Target.
Works as the existing Soviet ability. Aircraft mark an enemy vehicle for destruction, displaying the Guards' skill, prowess, and organization.
(17 CP) IS-2 Ace.
Allows for the requisition of an IS-2 Ace, displaying the Guard Battalion's elite prowess. Manpower income drained by 25% until the IS-2 Ace is destroyed. The IS-2 Ace is a veterancy 3 IS-2 that is similar in price to the Tiger Ace.
Flavor Text:
Guard Rifle battalions relied on equipping their units with top-of-the-line equipment to employ combined arms tactics. Conscripts armed with DP LMGs are capable of suppressing enemy squads, while Guard Rifle Infantry are capable of dealing with armor. The IS-2 Ace acts as a breakthrough tank, while aircraft also marks enemy tanks for improved precision in their destruction.
Author's Reasoning
Soviet Commanders are largely homogenized, sharing a relatively small pool of generic abilities. This commander would provide a new experience to Soviet commanders using in-game assets, combining traits from existing units to create a strange Soviet-Wehrmacht hybrid playstyle. The IS-2 Ace would be balanced similarly to the Tiger Ace in that it is incredibly expensive but provides a final push in a longer match, and given its CP cost regular Soviet units would also see play with this doctrine, including a scaling Conscript squad that many players have yearned for for years.
Programming Concerns
Programming the DP-28 onto Conscripts and the IS-2 Ace both might be difficult, but they are key to the doctrine's unique playstyle and use existing assets, so hopefully should not be all that difficult to implement. |
Doctrine Name: Beutepanzer Doctrine (Captured Tank)
(0 CP) Beutepanzer T-34/85.
Unlocks production of T-34/85 tanks at the Support Armored Korps (T3) at standard Soviet price. The Beutepanzer T-34/85 gains the Blitzkrieg ability of the Panzer IV in place of the standard ability of the T-34/85 to capture points, and loses the ability to ram enemy vehicles as well.
(2 CP) Panzer Tactician.
Identical to other Wehrmacht commanders. Emphasis is placed on preserving existing armored vehicles as they are in short supply, and allows for flexible tactical operations as well.
(3 CP) Osttruppen Reserves.
Identical to the ability of Mobile Defense Doctrine. Works thematically with the idea of a struggling Wehrmacht pulling Osttruppen reserves alongside captured tanks.
(0 CP) Pioneer Scavenging.
Gives Pioneer Squads the ability to do advanced salvaging like the ability from Scavenge Doctrine for Oberkommando West. Like the Osttruppen Reserves, this fits thematically with the idea of desperate defensive tactics on the eastern front.
(12 CP) Sector Artillery.
Identical to the Wehrmacht Commander ability of the same name. This resembles the idea that support has finally arrived for the beleaguered defenders to finally break attacking forces.
Flavor Text:
The German Army relied on a number of captured vehicles to fuel their tank operations at all stages of the war. Captured T-34/85 tanks add extra firepower to the Wehrmacht's medium tank corps while the commander deploys emergency defensive tactics with captured equipment.
Author's Reasoning:
A number of heavy tank doctrines exist for Wehrmacht, but none exist that give them access to a medium tank available for production at a crucial stage in the game: the unlocking of the Support Armored Korps (T3). The T-34/85 would exist as a powerful, but a bit more expensive option compared to the Panzer IV. This would allow for the Wehrmacht to utilize the 34/85 at a point when normally they are the ones having to face powerful medium tanks such as the 34/85 itself, as well as the SU-85, M4 Sherman, M4C Sherman, and the Easy Eight. Pioneer Scavenging allows Wehrmacht tank production to match the Allies, allowing for a truly different Wehrmacht playstyle. Price of the T-34/85 might need to be adjusted for when it comes out--especially with the fuel cost given that Pioneers can scavenge fuel using this doctrine.
Programming concerns:
Reassigning the voice set to the T-34/85 might take some time as well as its abilities, and I am not sure how difficult it would be to give Pioneers the ability to scavenge like Sturmpioneers. Otherwise 3 of the abilities already exist and do not require modification whatsoever. If it would be too difficult to give the 34/85 the ability to Blitzkrieg like the Panzer IV at Vet 1, the Beutepanzer T-34/85 can remain unchanged from its Soviet counterpart except for its voice set. |
The options of the original armies by comparison to the WFA are, frankly, quite hilariously bad. People talk about how redesigning the factions would take too much effort, and I might agree if adding the ability to build sectioned sandbags with conscripts/pioneers/grens probably isn't actually that hard to accomplish. The old factions are outclassed in terms of options by the WFA, especially if you count how much the commanders for the new factions add that are supplementary, and not essential.
It needs to be addressed, but fixing doesn't make money. Making DLC and expansions does.
But I'm not trying to hate on Relic. The old factions still work, but is it too much to ask for sectioned sandbags and tank traps? Leave the tank call-ins, fine, but I don't think anyone can put up a reasonable defense for why the Soviets can't build tank traps by default and why the Wehrmacht can't build any defenses other than bunkers. |
Except modern MGs all have a rate of fire similar to the MG34 for a reason. The US actually reduced the rate of fire of their machineguns because empirical studies showed that higher rates of fire simply wasted ammunition past a certain point. A burst from a 600 rpm machinegun was just as effective as a 900 or 1500 rpm burst in ground combat.
Accuracy =! recoil, a weapon can still be inaccurate on a tripod. The MG-42 had lots of vibration due to the high rate of fire so it had considerable dispersion, which was actually helpful in a defensive situation since you're fighting large groups of advancing infantry, you don't need to be pinpoint.
It was a good defensive weapon, but it had several downsides and wasn't the Greatest Weapon Ever Made™ like a lot of people seem to believe.
You do remember that this is a machine gun we're talking about, right? The entire purpose is to provide heavy amounts of sustained fire in order to suppress enemy positions. By comparison to its contemporaries, the MG42 outperformed in basically every aspect. When the war ended, Germany searched the world for a better MG, and when they didn't find one, they just improved the MG42 and turned it first into the MG42/59, followed by the MG3, still one of the best machine guns in existence.
What is "The Greatest Weapon Ever Made" anyway? Of course the weapon had weaknesses, but basically every weapon does; list any weapon, and it'll have flaws. The MG42 performed exceptionally in its role and was far ahead of any other WW2 machine gun for the infantry support role.
I still maintain what I said earlier about the in-game MG34. I agree with the OP that in terms of team placement that it's doing too well. |
I don't know why people keep talking up the MG42 like it was god's gift to machine guns. It had a completely unnecessary rate of fire that ate up ammo and was inaccurate compared to the 34.
Everything is backwards here. The MG42 was designed to be easier to produce, but the MG34 is 30mp cheaper. The 42 was a little lighter than the 34, but has a full second longer setup time. The 34 has slower rate of fire, but suppresses better.
IMO, the 34 should not suppress as effectively as the 42, in both splash or individual units, and the 42 should deal more damage at close range. The 34 should have more dps at mid-long range though, and should have a little longer burst when firing.
You seem to miss the point of a Heavy Machine Gun; the tripod, or even bipod for a machine gun almost completely negates the issue of fire rate in terms of accuracy, thus allowing accurate (by automatic firearm standards) fire at medium to long ranges, regardless of the actual fire rate. Fire rate is actually a boon (disregarding the issue of ammo, which for HMG's usually isn't an issue) because the stability of the firing platform itself almost completely negates the issue of recoil. If you've ever fired from a tripod or even bipod, you would understand that. The MG42 was cheaper and better, and could be produced more quickly as well. |
I don't even think OKW is bad in 1v1. Decent Sturmpio micro in the early game followed up by the use of Obersoldaten late game is extremely difficult to deal with. At best, they're balanced in 1v1. In team games, especially because of the trucks, OKW is completely broken. |
This game is not supposed to be realistic, it has to make sense in a gameplay perspective.
Even if it isn't realistic, from a completely mechanical look at the game, I have to ask why OKW gets a machine gun (doctrinal, sure, but that brings into question the DShk, which is awful lol) that is functionally identical to the MG42 (including the ability to fire rounds that destroy light armor), given that the two units come out at roughly the same time, with the main difference being that OKW can function fine without any suppression whatsoever, while the Wehrmacht desperately needs it to hold back the Allied blob. Explain to me why this MG, which is 30 cheaper and has no build time, is almost exactly the same (it even looks to be better at suppressing). 30 manpower cheaper means that building two is only 420MP, whilst a Wehr player needs to spend 480MP FOR THE SAME UNIT (not to mention reinforce costs and upkeep costs as well). The unit even takes 1 less pop than the MG42! Explain to me why in hell it sets up quicker, too! The only real weakness is the arc, but with that setup time, it's functionally closer to a Maxim. This is within a team whose base engineering unit is a squad that is equal to, if not better than Panzergrenadiers, and where the MG itself can achieve FIVE levels of veterancy. When you analyze it, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever in a gameplay sense. So when I nitpick about the historical accuracy, it's because my hope is that then maybe the unit would make some sense.
Here are the stats, posted earlier in this thread.
"Average (over all ranges) suppression per second
MG42 - 0.0892
MG34 - 0.0978
Average (over all ranges) damage per second
MG42 - 14.050
MG34 - 10.570
Arc size
MG42 - 120°
MG34 - 90°
Setup time
MG42 - 3 seconds
MG34 - 2 seconds
Teardown
MG42 - 2.5 seconds
MG34 - 2.5 seconds
Splash suppression radius:
MG42 - 11.5
MG34 - 12
Splash suppression modifiers:
MG42 - 0.8
MG34 - 0.8" |
+1. This practice is ludicrous. |
Ostruppen are, like the majority of Wehrmacht and Soviet units, in dire need of attention and reworking. Unfortunately, Relic is content to just create a campaign instead of fixing the replayable part of the game. Ugh. |