jesus Christ it fires a damn 152mm round!!! The KT and JGGT rape tanks too!!! It also has massive armor!!! much more than the ISU!!!
If you wanna talk about realism ISU had terible accuracy and was not that good against tanks. KT will have no problems with ISU. But gameplay > realism
Problem with ISU is it is ultimate counter to everything except planes. I think current call-ins system need some rework. Will you build Panther or call-in Tiger etc... ISU should by more assault gun then tank hunter. If your opponent blobs infantry get ISU. It should have more specific role as anti blob weapon and not all around performer. |
All I can see in this tread is biased people defending their beloved factions. What is with these balance discutions? Nobody can be objective about these, people are so biased than they could not see the truth even if it stands in front of them.
I think you people are wrong a little. It's not about ISU being to OP, it's about that in the hands of a good player, this unit can give to him a more imprtant upper-hand that it should, because that player knows how to use it and support it.
But hey, that's also the Tiger Ace, Tiger and KT's case.
The only difference is that the german squads are so small and vulnerable to explosions, that this will often lead to squad wipes - no matter how vetted they are, which is not the case of americans or russians. They usualy have a better chance to avoid squad wipes and team crew wipes.
That is the problem, not the ISU itself, and this should be looked at.
All the units mentioned above are game changers, but this is not a problem, because this reveals a tactic used by the player who uses such a monster on the battlefield. They conserve resources riscking everything on one unit. This is their choice and the tactic is valid.
So why in hands of good player will it give him such a huge advantage? Because it is too powerfull. What do you risk by going ISU? Nothing. You will have very good AI and AT vehicle with great range on the other side if you go Elephant you will have only good AT or if you go JT you will have excelent AT but thats all those two units can do plus they are very easily flankable since they are slow (same for ISU) and cost a lot of resources especially if you play as OKW. |
I compared the two a little while ago;
Jagdpanzer 4 is far better but it is more expensive. Jagdpanzer 4 has some really great veterancy too:
Jagdpanzer IV:
Vet1: Ability (Camouflage Ability)
Vet2: +10% armor, +160 HP, +35% sight radius
Vet3: +20% rotation, +20% max speed, -10% reload
Vet4: -25% reload, +30% accuracy
Vet5: Gains "First Strike" bonus when attacking from camouflage
... as you can see the Vet2 bonus for the Jagdpanzer is crazy good. +35% sight radius is basically permanent SU-85 vision cone with no mobility disadvantage. +160 health gives it 800 health; the same as the Panther. It's basically one extra tank shot before death which is real nice.
For the sake of balance I'll snag the SU-85's vet bonuses:
Vet 1: Tracking Ability (Increased vision range)
Vet 2 -30% Reload +30% Accuracy
Vet 3 -20% Reload +20% Max Speed +20% Acceleration +20% Rotation
... Personally I find the SU-85 rather lacking at the moment as its armor is so low that only auto-cannon units like the Ostwind will fail to penetrate it reliably. Its range is a boon but range is essentially map dependent.
Jagdpanzer 4 is pretty excellent although I don't use it much. I get a lot more out of the Puma which is just a little more flexible of a unit and arrives at a more favorable timing. It's a great unit to have in one's toolbox though as a dedicated tank hunter late game.
You forget one very important aspect. Pathfinding on Jagdpanzer IV is very very bad so you have to micro it almost all the time. |
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Well some of you say ISU is fine as it is. OK lets give Jagdtiger and Elephant similar AI capability, JT had 120mm and Elephant 88 gun and also HE shells so it will be even realistic then we can ask russians if JT or Elephant are fine. |
You are comparing a medium tank with a super heavy late game tank.
Good luck with that.
And dont run infantry in the radius of the Isu, thats like asking for a wipe.
Also, it doesnt consequently wipe squads anymore as it did.
I am comparing tank with assualt gun. You know the difference? probably not. |
Its ridiculously OP. Its still an anti everything unit.
Thats my main problem with it. It is anti everything unit with a great range. As axis you have great antitanks with great range but only effective against tanks but ISU will decimate everything and on some maps it is almost impossible to flank it. |
I naturally regret that you are upset, but you have to accept that simply because you do not like the power of the ISU, is no reason to react in this fashion, to the simple observation that you must deal with it.. Because deal with it, Axis players must, unless and until another patch changes its powers. Put simplistically, there is the Elefant.....and then the longer question of why you allowed the ISU to be built in the first place....
It is high time, I think, to keep demanding replays from objectors to any unit from any faction, so that these discussions cease to take place in a vacuum of theory.
Why should I be upset? I do not like OP stuff thats all.
"why you allowed the ISU to be built in the first place...." - maybe because on some maps maxim + zis spam + shocks are way too much for axis to handle so there is going to be ISU (I play mostly 2vs2, 1vs1 is not fun for me). BTW if I allow my opponent to build ISU should I just loose the match?
@Katitof: your L2P advices.. well keep them for somebody else. I play this game long enough to know how flank etc.. but since ISU can get my PIV to almost half health in just one shot, or decimate whole squads even on vet 5 its not that simple. Maybe you faced opponent which didnt support its ISU then it can be easy but with some AT behind + maxim or guards, yeah good luck flanking and not each map good for flanking. |
Will probably get fixed (finally) next patch.
This is the only unit where i wouldnt mind a serious overnerf, it was OP for so long, ive seen it in pretty much every match since it was made OP, i dont think i need to see/use it for the next year anymore.
I really hope so. It is very annoying to face it almost every match. |
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Do we have to wait another year until somebody at Relic realize that ISU is still too strong? Since axis usually have 4-5 man squads ISU will oneshoot them pretty often. I know there was attempt to fix this but it still happens pretty often. |
Kubel is fine as is.
Light vehicle for early game map control which you can lose eventually and salvage for a bit of fuel. Lower pop cap than the same cost Volksgren squad so your income takes a smaller hit to offset the loss of your kubel at a later date.
It is definitelly not fine since it cant even espace M3 souct car which is stupid. So at least speed should be increased and for love of God pathfinding needs to be fixed. |
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