You're only considering the economy side.
I know, because no one else was.
The biggest problem with talking about FRP is that its situation is different according to faction, people really need to stop talking like it's a simple one-dimensional issue, because it's not. |
You're not going to discourage blobbing by removing forward retreat, players will just take it in stride (har har!) and re-blob like 1-2 minutes later than usual- retreating squads run faster, after all.
Forward Retreat has its own share of drawbacks, first being placement, which itself requires securing the territory (required for OKW and UKF, but you can be very gutsy as USF), and second being securing it throughout the match, which demands micromanagement outside of blobbing.
If you want blobbing to be discouraged you can do something like implement upkeep cost when FRP is in effect, forcing players to toggle it only at the right moment to optimize economy. Or even just simply up the FRP upgrade cost. You know why you can't blob Sturmpioniers?
If you just remove FRP it won't do anything except maybe encourage it even more because FRP itself is expensive. Only Major doesn't require an upgrade for FRP but he's T4 unlock and a 3-man squad.
If that OKW blobber no longer has a 300 manpower sink, it's just going to another Volksgrenadier.
FRP itself gets in the way of blobbing. If USF is the worst of them all it's only because Major is mobile, comes regardless (ie not a side tech), has other abilities and can reinforce and heal next to ambulance. Think of all that micromanagement and manpower that can be spent in more blobbing if they simply didn't have it. It might discourage blobbing in massive maps, but most people apparently are 1v1 or 2v2, and large team game has never been the measuring stick for balance anyways.
I don't see FRP is the problem, and I think frustrated people are just pointing fingers looking for a reason convinced it is and if only it's gone.
For myself I love forward retreat, but I'm largely a big map player where having an FRP close to the middle and kept secure is a major tactical focus. I would accept an increase or even upkeep/ population cost for FRP upgrade. If you want to discourage blobbing there should be more or more expensive manpower choices for the player to sink into which accomplishes tactical decisions while also requiring less manpower for blobs. In an example of increasing 300 manpower to 400 manpower for FRP for OKW, it's still worth it but obviously makes both the investment into FRP as well as blobbing harder to achieve. You don't even need to do fancy things like removing medics or making it come later, all which demand deeper balance examination. If FRP is such an important tactical option, it should also cost; it already does at the tactical level but not so much at the economy side; ultimately 300 manpower isn't a lot for OKW. |
Won't work. Not because idea is shit, but too complicated for the supposed mass audience Relic wants to sell to.
I mean if anything, CoH3 will have neither suppression nor morale, or even munitions cost, given the way DoW3 turned out ;/ |
Maybe add a salvage option to emplacements? Terrans in Starcraft 2 can do this with turrets and bunkers (in some game modes, anyways). Recoup only a percentage of cost, and maybe also relative to current health? ie you only get like 5% back if it's about to die, whereas full health it will give back like 50-70%
Veterancy can be ignored so you will be incentivized to place them strategically and not constantly salvage.
This might require something like a cap for emplacements, so that you don't leapfrog them over the length of a map. Which of coures makes the idea more complicated. |
They explained why already. They like to build campaign around an immersive character or group of characters. The problem with the German faction is how can you make a cool and nice character belonging to the Wermarch.
There are many games were you can make the bad guys looking cool, but it is a really risky task when your bad guys are based on the Nazi. This could be assimilated to Nazi propaganda, revisionism etc...
Not to mention the potential interdition to sale in Germany and some others European countries.
1) CoH1 Opposing Front's market garden campaign: a bunch of dudes resisting the airborne invasion, the main character's brother is killed at the end
2) CoH1 ToV Tiger Ace mission: tank crew with names run around blasting Tommy
3) CoH2 Theatre of War missions, including DLC; no named characters, but not technically campaign
Which leads to
4) No one IIRC made a fuss about these missions existing; the closest was Soviet campaign and that was by Russians that were butthurt over a comically fictional portrayal. |
I think I recall double tapping an issue with some other units, like HVAP. I also recall they were fixed, so it'd be merely a matter of applying the same to JT. |
Low firing rate and the need to have someone on the other side of those buildings to provide sight in the first place, doesn't make the ability BS. It has its uses, but that use is simply to ignore shotblockers.
On a map designed where a unit like a Jagdtiger could perform well, I'd think it's meant to perform well. I mean you have a point of it was the King Tiger with a turret and machine guns, but JT is practically THE option to get on a map with linear chokepoints for maximum advantage. |
I don't hate the idea of weapon racks, but it's hardly a perfect idea. UKF has the benefit of construction Forward Assembly, of which weapon racks are just one benefit among several.
If I am reading OP right s/he is merely saying that units in HQ sectors can upgrade the weapons, so the "retreat back to base" still applies, but without the micromanagement restrictions of going to a specific point in the map. You can always bring back timing for upgrades to compensate for what is ultimately a buff to USF.
I think it's possible to ADD to weapon racks idea as an alternative, similar to UKF's design, without having to remove it altogether; really, the problem of weapon racks is largely about their limitations.
A few ideas:
-Ambulance can be upgraded to be mobile rack; replaces healing and reinforcement; cheap cost for ambulance and upgrade means you can build multiple ones, so you can even make it where you have to have one rack type per each truck, and variety of options for the player BARs in the field and bazooka at the base or vice versa)
-Fighting Position can be upgrade to provide ONE weapon rack; gives FPs a reason to exist; if you want to upgrades all three types you need three FPs built and upgraded to the variant(s) you want
-commander abilities allow you to air drop the weapons for a slightly higher munitions cost
-call-in racks (ie supply glider), or simply the USF version of British supply halftrack, which requires unlocking racks before you can drop weapons, but has the inherent benefit of reinforce and transport
Really, there are multiple creative ways to implement "forward racks" without simply removing the base racks idea.
To be realistic though, this is really only a big deal in the early part of the game where you might have delayed unlocking the racks, whereas a lot of later-game units like Paratroopers and Rangers have their own special unit upgrades to begin with. I mean once you've unlocked the racks, the only time you need to pay attention to getting stuff is when you actually have squads with available slots, either because you just trained them or you really need that Bazooka to deal with tanks. |
As for OP, yes it is just being salty and didn't like losing to good teamwork.
If I chose breakthrough but someone else brings out KT, I cannot use my own doctrinal call-in, despite not having KT myself?
What next, I also can't call in my own KT either because one is already too many?
In such a scenario both OKW players have to save fuel and coordinate once both actually arrive. In the meantime they've got nothing but faust and Rak43 to deal with armour.
What next, OKW can't have more than 280 fuel at any time? A call-in's a call-in, everyone else can bring in a new heavy tank if they got the fuel and dispatch recharge has long since been expired.
Most of OP is just bitching about OKW in general anyways; just looking for an easy way to win. |
Churchill is also behind tech...though it's negated by not having a limit, and a range of other benefits. Also, Comet.
If Sturmtiger is too powerful for its cost you merely up the cost or adjust it's effectiveness. Hell that's been the other steady thing about OKW nerf. Dumbest thing to do is limit it and make it exclusive with KT. That's just limiting strategic options more than resource constraints, and actually justify making the Sturmtiger more powerful. It is also lazy. |