Redesigning Emplacement

Yes, back on topic, i get your ideas.

For mortar pit, let said 250mp for the pit with 1 mortar operational, then another 100mp for the second mortar. I brought up this idea a while ago in the other forum.

But, for bofor and 17 pdr, i think it will be tricky. Brace should be removed if possible and may be replace with something else. May be an upgrade to unlock stand fast as toggle ability.

As long as things come with tech:
One could add other abilities for the mortar like different munition and longer range (they are already in the game actually.)

Stand fast imo could easily be reintroduced but with a cost in MU or UP so that there is some cost attached to it.

So can be brace.

In addition the HP and armor of this emplacements could also have upgrades so that player can have more control of how much he want to invest on them.

As long as things come with tech:
One could add other abilities for the mortar like different munition and longer range (they are already in the game actually.)

Stand fast imo could easily be reintroduced but with a cost in MU or UP so that there is some cost attached to it.

So can be brace.

In addition the HP and armor of this emplacements could also have upgrades so that player can have more control of how much he want to invest on them.

Abilities like supper charge barrage and parachute flare will definitely be cool, at a price, for sure, i'm ready to pay fuel for those "utilities", especially mortar flare, since UKF doesn't have many good recon options.

Stand fast can stay behind an upgrade like "entrenching tools".

For the tech part, i think the major upgrade system for emplacement should be put in main tech lv and specialization to avoid too many side tech.

I think they went with "emplacements" for 3 reasons.

First off, "nostalgia". CoH's Brits also heavily relied on emplacements.

Second is "uniqueness". The most retarded thing that destroys both balance and game design but hey, at least they're not similar, right?

Third I'm guessing is because they could be garrisoned only when done in such a way. You could even put MGs inside them before but it proved too buggy so they removed it.

To be honest I would be fine if they removed the British emplacements altogether altho it's nice to have an Allied Pak 43 once in a while on open terrain maps as well as the Bofors, however situational it may be.

I never bother with the mortar pit and so do other people from what I've noticed, especially after the new British Commander.

The Brits are definitely modeled off their Company of Heroes 1 rendition, but heavily toned down to be more playable. They still have powerful but expensive infantry with upgrades alter that unit's role, they're still defense oriented, they have an emphasis on artillery as the only faction with stock howitzers, they've got their emplacements with fireproof and bomb proof crews, and even the same emplacements; Mortar Pit/Bofors Gun/17 Pounder. They don't have the trucks anymore because OKW has that now (should've been USF imo), but they do have one as a static building.

Removing emplacements feels like the wrong way to go for me though, making them less "binary" seems better. Make them more vulnerable to anti-fortification weapons, they can receive Crew Shock from heavy bombings or Assaults, or be decrewed at low health, or from Incendiary attacks. Then Brace could be reworked to prevent crew shock from bombings or decrew from incendiary weapons, but reduce or remove the damage resistance. Also it feels weird and gamey to me that the best counters to these fortifications are anti-tank weapons firing AP shells, rather than anti-fortification units firing HE; weapons that do big booms should cause more damage like you'd expect. A StuG III E should hurt them more than a StuG III G, an LeIG should hurt more than a Pak 40, etc.

I really like how this thread is going, i have not much time to read all the posts but i am going to later.

I support the emplacements redesign too. Actual game balance punishes really hard static gameplay, therefore emplacements got worse by each patch. I can share some ideas now.

• IMO Bofors should not lock out AEC to begin with.
  
• Mortar emplacements should definitely have a paid ability to shoot farther, like H. Sapper suggested. They could even have a pinpoint accurate single shot (even though we all know its kind of OP), or even a flare for the howitzers (i think that was too much)
  
• Pounder emplacement could have a camo ability, like the new raketens, its already stationary. Either that or give them a snare shot.
  
• All emplacements could receive a "pack/unpack" ability, to move them around, but the resulting squad when the emplacement unpacks should be pretty vulnerable. To avoid creeping turtling, set up time should be pretty high.
  
• Make doctrinal the ability to crew emplacements. As a slight nerf to adjust for the new versatility.
  
• Consider a rework/rebalance of the auto repair emplacement (its simply a bad idea) and change it into a "sappers garrisoned will heal automatically and also get cover bonus"
  

I really like how this thread is going, i have not much time to read all the posts but i am going to later.

I support the emplacements redesign too. Actual game balance punishes really hard static gameplay, therefore emplacements got worse by each patch. I can share some ideas now.

• IMO Bofors should not lock out AEC to begin with.
  
• Mortar emplacements should definitely have a paid ability to shoot farther, like H. Sapper suggested. They could even have a pinpoint accurate single shot (even though we all know its kind of OP), or even a flare for the howitzers (i think that was too much)
  
• Pounder emplacement could have a camo ability, like the new raketens, its already stationary. Either that or give them a snare shot.
  
• All emplacements could receive a "pack/unpack" ability, to move them around, but the resulting squad when the emplacement unpacks should be pretty vulnerable. To avoid creeping turtling, set up time should be pretty high.
  
• Make doctrinal the ability to crew emplacements. As a slight nerf to adjust for the new versatility.
  
• Consider a rework/rebalance of the auto repair emplacement (its simply a bad idea) and change it into a "sappers garrisoned will heal automatically and also get cover bonus"
  

Self repair like advance assembly should be made for vehicle and move to an armor oriented Commander like royal tank regiment.

The ideal of emplacements pack up and move is nice. I'm thinking of while packing up, a Universal carrier will move from the base up to where the emplacements stand, then the crew get on the carrier.After pack up, you move your emplacements to anywhere you want like moving an UC, UC itself is pretty fragile so i think it will be ok to allow moving around like so.

If things above can be done, i believe it definitely will be cood. In real life, Universal carrier is use to town guns, like those inside the emplacements. The pack up time is decide by the time the UC have to move, so the further you built emplacements, the longer pack up time, creeping emplacements wont be a serious problem any more.

Not only that, we can take a further step, make emplacements come in form of Universal carrier from the stat and then "set up" like OKW truck.

UC+Emplacements for reposition sound way too good but also complex. Hopefully devs will like the idea to invest time and effort on it

UC+Emplacements for reposition sound way too good but also complex. Hopefully devs will like the idea to invest time and effort on it

I found it to be complex, too, but it is just too cool for me to stop dreaming :v

The Brits are definitely modeled off their Company of Heroes 1 rendition, but heavily toned down to be more playable. They still have powerful but expensive infantry with upgrades alter that unit's role, they're still defense oriented, they have an emphasis on artillery as the only faction with stock howitzers, they've got their emplacements with fireproof and bomb proof crews, and even the same emplacements; Mortar Pit/Bofors Gun/17 Pounder. They don't have the trucks anymore because OKW has that now (should've been USF imo), but they do have one as a static building.

Removing emplacements feels like the wrong way to go for me though, making them less "binary" seems better. Make them more vulnerable to anti-fortification weapons, they can receive Crew Shock from heavy bombings or Assaults, or be decrewed at low health, or from Incendiary attacks. Then Brace could be reworked to prevent crew shock from bombings or decrew from incendiary weapons, but reduce or remove the damage resistance. Also it feels weird and gamey to me that the best counters to these fortifications are anti-tank weapons firing AP shells, rather than anti-fortification units firing HE; weapons that do big booms should cause more damage like you'd expect. A StuG III E should hurt them more than a StuG III G, an LeIG should hurt more than a Pak 40, etc.

To be honest the CoH Brits are perfectly fine and playable. However they have a lot of quarks and perhaps gimmicks that make them extremely hard for less experienced or accommodated players to their playstyle. Plus blobs. 3 LTs plus several Bren upgraded sections and a few PIAT upgraded Sappers can really do some damage as well as several Fireflies, perhaps the best Allied tank I would say in that game, supported by a Cromwell Command Tank, can really mop the floor with the Axis if microed correctly. Kangaroos were also fun while they lasted.

As far as the trucks goes, that was actually pretty spot on in terms of historical portrayal I'd say. They were the only Army to truly use a lot of mobile command trucks called "Armored Command Trucks" based on I think 2 types of AEC truck chassis, one small 4 wheel one and one larger, 6 wheel one. One example I can give you is Rommel's personal command and control vehicle being such a captured British one which they called the "Mammut" which you can probably guess what it means. There's also a few pictures on the internet here and there if you just Google for it. The Germans used command trucks like that to a bit of a lesser degree, I've only seen ones based on the Opel Blitz so the ones the OKW have in-game, as in the sWS were more used as heavy haulers, Panzerwerfer and Flak self-propelled guns rather than field HQs.

They just went with the emplacements in the wrong direction if you ask me. If it were up to me I'd give the British the full complement of support weapons in both games, that being the Vickers, 3-inch Mortar and 6 Pounder but with the added twist of being able to spawn their respective emplacements around them to "dig themselves in" so to speak. That would provide the British player with the option and not force him into being heavily/overly defensive while sticking with the overall theme of the Army.

To be honest the CoH Brits are perfectly fine and playable. However they have a lot of quarks and perhaps gimmicks that make them extremely hard for less experienced or accommodated players to their playstyle. Plus blobs. 3 LTs plus several Bren upgraded sections and a few PIAT upgraded Sappers can really do some damage as well as several Fireflies, perhaps the best Allied tank I would say in that game, supported by a Cromwell Command Tank, can really mop the floor with the Axis if microed correctly. Kangaroos were also fun while they lasted.

As far as the trucks goes, that was actually pretty spot on in terms of historical portrayal I'd say. They were the only Army to truly use a lot of mobile command trucks called "Armored Command Trucks" based on I think 2 types of AEC truck chassis, one small 4 wheel one and one larger, 6 wheel one. One example I can give you is Rommel's personal command and control vehicle being such a captured British one which they called the "Mammut" which you can probably guess what it means. There's also a few pictures on the internet here and there if you just Google for it. The Germans used command trucks like that to a bit of a lesser degree, I've only seen ones based on the Opel Blitz so the ones the OKW have in-game, as in the sWS were more used as heavy haulers, Panzerwerfer and Flak self-propelled guns rather than field HQs.

They just went with the emplacements in the wrong direction if you ask me. If it were up to me I'd give the British the full complement of support weapons in both games, that being the Vickers, 3-inch Mortar and 6 Pounder but with the added twist of being able to spawn their respective emplacements around them to "dig themselves in" so to speak. That would provide the British player with the option and not force him into being heavily/overly defensive while sticking with the overall theme of the Army.

Giving UKF a full set of weapon team with the ability to "dig in" sound interesting, having a complete set of support weapons available in normal form definitely make the faction easier to play with, while "dig in" give them distinction and fit in to faction's theme. And i think this isn't that difficult to do, as a vicker or a single 3 inches mortar will fit nice and tight in an USF fighting position model. The 6 pdr can be squeezed in to a bofor pit and that it. You can use all of them like normal or dig them in to gain additional benefits like increase sight/ range. While dig in, beside being more durable up to a certain lv, those weapons may still able to be decrewed (by indirect, flame...) but if enemies pick them up, they will only can use like normal, no dig in.

Bigger things like bofor or 17 pounder can use my UC idea like above.