How come Axis infantry get all the snares?

Regardless of balance implications etc, to say that Allies have more snares than Axis is either misleading or just plain wrong. What counts is not the number of different unit types that can snare, but the number of units that is on the field at a given time. Technically, UKF always had a infantry available snare (sniper), but this is not equal to 4 Volks running around the field with a faust.

Axis usually have better snare availability since their mainline can use snares after normal teching (Volks) or from the get go (Grenadiers). There is only one viable Ostheer build where you don't have snares, and that is Assault Grenadiere into Panzergrenadiere. In a normal game (at least at my skill level), there are 4-5 Volks or 3-4 Grenadiere running around for the whole match.
Allies have a more limited snare availability. Only standard USF and Soviet T2 Conscript builds after vet/side-tech have widely avaiable snares with about 3-4 Riflemen/Cons. Soviet T1 build usually don't have that many upgraded Penal squads (I'd say 1-2 from what I have seen, as you usually try to avoid upgrading your Penals. Also, you trade range for damage which can give high rewards, but also enables the Axis tanks to move more freely), UKF for the most part have 1-2 engineer squads on the field. Only cons can generate a very high snare-threat in combination with Ooohra.

Additionally, both Axis factions have access to engine-critting mines. USF, the Allied faction with the best snare availability, has only light mines that don't crit the engine.

So all in all, Axis have the better toolbox(es) to snare a vehicle. If this might be necessary or not due to a usually more aggressive LV play by Allies is actually the more important point, not how many different types of units could theoretically snare or not.

So all in all, Axis have the better toolbox(es) to snare a vehicle. If this might be necessary or not due to a usually more aggressive LV play by Allies is actually the more important point, not how many different types of units could theoretically snare or not.

It's pretty much this.

Every allied faction has an early, viable, small-arms immune LV (T70, Stuart, AEC), as well as an even earlier small-arms resistant LV (M3A1, M20, M15A1, UC). Axis simply don't have this.

Both OKW and OST need to spend a significant amount of resources to get small arms resistant vehicles, let alone immune ones.

Additionally, both Axis factions have access to engine-critting mines. USF, the Allied faction with the best snare availability, has only light mines that don't crit the engine.

mmmhhh do u play the game or only usf ? ukf okw and soviet miens are all the same they all deal the same damage and snare..... only usf has light mines but they have other tools and the doc mines, btw cons are better in my opinion for snare but rifle man get zook with snare

mmmhhh do u play the game or only usf ? ukf okw and soviet miens are all the same they all deal the same damage and snare..... only usf has light mines but they have other tools and the doc mines, btw cons are better in my opinion for snare but rifle man get zook with snare

I don't get your point. This is is exactly what I wrote.
Cons are better to snare (I also already wrote this is my post), but Soviet builds usually favor T1 even despite the current patch so you often don't face cons. Riflemen, hated or not, are still the backbone for most USF builds (and I know that there are viable assault pio and pathfinder builds). In a normal game, you have (as I already wrote) 3-4 Riflemen out, which are apart from a Soviet con build more units with snare than any other normal Allied build.
I'm not sure what you're trying to say, since basically I already covered most of what you commented on. Please elaborate on that.

I don't get your point. This is is exactly what I wrote.
Cons are better to snare (I also already wrote this is my post), but Soviet builds usually favor T1 even despite the current patch so you often don't face cons. Riflemen, hated or not, are still the backbone for most USF builds (and I know that there are viable assault pio and pathfinder builds). In a normal game, you have (as I already wrote) 3-4 Riflemen out, which are apart from a Soviet con build more units with snare than any other normal Allied build.
I'm not sure what you're trying to say, since basically I already covered most of what you commented on. Please elaborate on that.

that they have snares, and the fact that mines (that were not part of the discussion) don't snares don't make them worse at snaring vehicles

both side have equal tools, and the smoke nades even slow tanks for usf (Enemy vehicle will have 0 sight and -50% speed for 8 seconds. This will last even when the vehicle backs out of the smoke.)

that they have snares, and the fact that mines (that were not part of the discussion) don't snares don't make them worse at snaring vehicles

both side have equal tools, and the smoke nades even slow tanks for usf (Enemy vehicle will have 0 sight and -50% speed for 8 seconds. This will last even when the vehicle backs out of the smoke.)

Yes, I do agree with you on that, but I also never said that USF did not have snares. I even said they had the best options apart from Soviet cons.

But I think mines should be a part of the discussion as well. Snares are there that your units can not get overrun by enemy tanks so that your AT gun and TDs can finish the enemy tank off. Mines do the same stuff, more unreliably but do not require as much micro after placement. So the availability of mines to a faction does have an influence on the interaction with enemy tanks (extreme example: a faction that could place engine-critting mines for 5-10 mun might seriously not need a infantry based snare, since it could just spam mines across the whole map).

Does USF smoke really slow vehicles? I did not know that. But this is only the case for USF, isn't it?

Does USF smoke really slow vehicles? I did not know that. But this is only the case for USF, isn't it?

yep it's the only one, others just block vision, but the ober one disable weapon but only if u are inside it and not 5 second after like usf
btw here https://www.coh2.org/guides/88945/the-coh2-ability-guide-mark-2-0#2653

My issue with USF snares is they aren't on LT or CPT and you have to vet your Riflemen (which is not a very quick process with that unit) before they get them. That's why it feels like Axis has a big advantage there. The Cav Riflemen satchel is admittedly the best or tied for best snare in the game but thats only one unit in one doctrine.

Honestly I'd rather USF AT rifle grenades be tied to the existing grenade unlock. That way if your Riflemen get wiped their replacements still have a snare.

The UKF snare ability seems like the weakest since it's on such a squishy unit that isn't available until teching but at least it's there now and you can give the Royal Engineers piats so that's something.

Just remember that with crew repairs a snare on an allied light vehicle is often lost munitions. They will just crew repair and absorbing a few shrecks (one at a time) is actually quite a viable strategy of draining ostheer of munitions.

Another thing is that allies tend to equip their infantry with anty infantry weapons a lot and that's how they build their potent infantry blobs. They spend a lot of munitions to be good at dealing with infantry (or don't equip penals with ptrs). It's part of the gameplay. If you don't equip your units with bazookas but with lmgs/bars you risk being countered by a vehicle. You just can't have the best of both worlds: really potent anty inf blob and great at destroying tanks. But to be fully honest its close to that anyway.

I dont get why EVERY ALLIES faction has the possbilty to drop / take weapons from racks or airdrop ....while ALL axis faction is limited by the upgrade weopaon from the unit itsself (and maybe lost weopoans from dead squads/models)

its a HUGE advantage to give your snare squad an AT upgrade at the same time. or give the cheapest sqaud the AT upgrade...and so on...

My issue with USF snares is they aren't on LT or CPT and you have to vet your Riflemen (which is not a very quick process with that unit) before they get them. That's why it feels like Axis has a big advantage there. The Cav Riflemen satchel is admittedly the best or tied for best snare in the game but thats only one unit in one doctrine.

Honestly I'd rather USF AT rifle grenades be tied to the existing grenade unlock. That way if your Riflemen get wiped their replacements still have a snare.

The UKF snare ability seems like the weakest since it's on such a squishy unit that isn't available until teching but at least it's there now and you can give the Royal Engineers piats so that's something.

That backpaddeling haha

Well for OKW sturmpioneers dont get snares overs dont get snares JLI dont get snares either- and fusilier LOSE their snare if you give them panzershreks.

For ostheer ostruppen grenadiers and the jaeger command squad have snares, all the rest dont.


I'm just not seeing how axis infantry have "all the snares" or "all have snares" whichever you meant neither are true.

Well if you upgrade the G43 you can still get 1 Panzershreck and keep the snare

Well if you upgrade the G43 you can still get 1 Panzershreck and keep the snare

Panzergrens can't do that. Axis don't have satchels. So it's the allies who have all the snares.

My issue with USF snares is they aren't on LT or CPT and you have to vet your Riflemen (which is not a very quick process with that unit) before they get them. That's why it feels like Axis has a big advantage there. The Cav Riflemen satchel is admittedly the best or tied for best snare in the game but thats only one unit in one doctrine.

I think the big problem here is the assumption on everyone's part that everyone has the same experience at different points on the ladder.

At very high ELO Satchel Charges are weak: at 5 range they're very difficult to trigger because everyone's so good at maintaining optimal range with vehicles.

Similarly, unit preservation is very good so USF snares being behind veterancy isn't a big deal.

However, if you're playing at a level where frequent squad wipes are common, I can see how that veterancy lock would be a real problem.

I think the big problem here is the assumption on everyone's part that everyone has the same experience at different points on the ladder.

At very high ELO Satchel Charges are weak: at 5 range they're very difficult to trigger because everyone's so good at maintaining optimal range with vehicles.

Similarly, unit preservation is very good so USF snares being behind veterancy isn't a big deal.

However, if you're playing at a level where frequent squad wipes are common, I can see how that veterancy lock would be a real problem.

True. However, when a vehicle does get snared it is a perfectly valid option to finish it off with a satchel/satchels. Happens on high level play too. Also satchels and snares on an at weapon holding squads eliminate certain possiblities of engaging them. It is sometimes a good idea to force an at squad out of cover or just try to crush it with a vehicle. You can do it against shrecked pzgrens or pios but can't do it against, for example, ptrs penals. In my opinion some snare should be given to pzgrens after they equip shrecks because too often they get crushed or just killed by a closely approaching vehicle (dmg close on vehicles is simply higher). Sometimes good players just circle pzgens not allowing them to shoot. A but too cheesy for me.

True. However, when a vehicle does get snared it is a perfectly valid option to finish it off with a satchel/satchels. Happens on high level play too. Also satchels and snares on an at weapon holding squads eliminate certain possiblities of engaging them. It is sometimes a good idea to force an at squad out of cover or just try to crush it with a vehicle. You can do it against shrecked pzgrens or pios but can't do it against, for example, ptrs penals. In my opinion some snare should be given to pzgrens after they equip shrecks because too often they get crushed or just killed by a closely approaching vehicle (dmg close on vehicles is simply higher). Sometimes good players just circle pzgens not allowing them to shoot. A but too cheesy for me.

Pgrens with shrecks have high alpha damage and fire their first shot very fast. Pushing them around is more risky then when penal didnt have the at satchal.

Ptrs penals where the easiest to push around by far, because the aim time is longer for the first shot and their alpha damage is pretty low.

Ost has 3 snares non doc. Pfausts plus twp on the pak and stug3, both of wich are pure at units. The teller also can work pretty effective in slowing down armour.

So imo pgrens defenitly do not need or are justified to have a snare after going shrecks. Because of the above.

Pgrens with shrecks have high alpha damage and fire their first shot very fast. Pushing them around is more risky then when penal didnt have the at satchal.

Ptrs penals where the easiest to push around by far, because the aim time is longer for the first shot and their alpha damage is pretty low.

Ost has 3 snares non doc. Pfausts plus twp on the pak and stug3, both of wich are pure at units. The teller also can work pretty effective in slowing down armour.

So imo pgrens defenitly do not need or are justified to have a snare after going shrecks. Because of the above.

I'm not pushing for it. I just feel that if some players complain that axis have all the snares they should be aware it's not that nice for ostheer especially.

Still, I don't agree that it's easy to push at penals. You basically can't let them close. They are especially dangerous to stugs and pz4. Yoy can pretty easily, thought it is risky, chase pzgrens to their base and wipe them. Their alpha dmg won't help if there is no gren around. They get wiped too easily for their cost.

True. However, when a vehicle does get snared it is a perfectly valid option to finish it off with a satchel/satchels. Happens on high level play too. Also satchels and snares on an at weapon holding squads eliminate certain possiblities of engaging them. It is sometimes a good idea to force an at squad out of cover or just try to crush it with a vehicle. You can do it against shrecked pzgrens or pios but can't do it against, for example, ptrs penals. In my opinion some snare should be given to pzgrens after they equip shrecks because too often they get crushed or just killed by a closely approaching vehicle (dmg close on vehicles is simply higher). Sometimes good players just circle pzgens not allowing them to shoot. A but too cheesy for me.

The finishing satchel is then only possible for coordinated team games, since Soviets usually don't use Penals and side-teched cons in their builds, not even at my skill level anymore.
I think Panzergrenadiere have design issues. They were meant as the high damage elite infantry of Ostheer that specialize in AT or AI and can do their job very well. But I'm not sure if they're worth it since they cost so much MP to reinforce. But maybe I'm just biased due to the long time frame where they were pretty mediocre to bad.
Then again, you rarely need to push AT Penals out of cover since they do not do much damage to medium armor, while letting squadsreload their Panzerschrecks or Bazookas could be the end of your tank.

EDIT: I forgot mines of course. Yes, there you can finish a tank off with satchels.

I'm not pushing for it. I just feel that if some players complain that axis have all the snares they should be aware it's not that nice for ostheer especially.

Still, I don't agree that it's easy to push at penals. You basically can't let them close. They are especially dangerous to stugs and pz4. Yoy can pretty easily, thought it is risky, chase pzgrens to their base and wipe them. Their alpha dmg won't help if there is no gren around. They get wiped too easily for their cost.

Now because of the satchel you cant push them. Before even a 222 pushed them around. The ptrs was a downgrade before the atsatchel was added. It has a very short range for that reason. It can as you said be used to finish of or severly cripple already snared armour.

The finishing satchel is then only possible for coordinated team games, since Soviets usually don't use Penals and side-teched cons in their builds, not even at my skill level anymore.
I think Panzergrenadiere have design issues. They were meant as the high damage elite infantry of Ostheer that specialize in AT or AI and can do their job very well. But I'm not sure if they're worth it since they cost so much MP to reinforce. But maybe I'm just biased due to the long time frame where they were pretty mediocre to bad.
Then again, you rarely need to push AT Penals out of cover since they do not do much damage to medium armor, while letting squadsreload their Panzerschrecks or Bazookas could be the end of your tank.

EDIT: I forgot mines of course. Yes, there you can finish a tank off with satchels.

Couldn't agree more. Panzergrens are still very delicate. You invest a lot of manpower plus 100 munitions and they can be too easily wiped. A risky unit. What's more they completely, one may say, lose their anty inf capabilities when upgraded with shrecks. So they become sort of expensive support unit. But to the point: allied ikfantry anti tank options are more varied than those of axis.