What if OKW had standard starting resources?

I understand the idea but saying "rushing the light tank timing is now comparable" and ignoring that that means skipping all sorts of stuff for one faction and not for the other doesn't really make it comparable. Rushing a luchs doesn't sacrifice anything. It's hardly even considered rushing, just "getting" becuae you are going to get it asap no matter what. There is no "rush" there is no "quick luchs" just normal timing luchs. To get a "fast Stuart" you need to weigh the risks of not getting many things.

Where did I say any of that? Why are we talking about rushing a Stuart? That'd be like rushing a Puma.

if so reduce the mp by 100 but make the truck an unlock: 100 mp 15 fuel every 30 second a truck spawns if there is not other truck or all tech building are up

if so reduce the mp by 100 but make the truck an unlock: 100 mp 15 fuel every 30 second a truck spawns if there is not other truck or all tech building are up

It used to work like that.

They changed it so players wouldn't use the trucks as assault units.

It used to work like that.

They changed it so players wouldn't use the trucks as assault units.

well just ernf speed and armor even more

Where did I say any of that? Why are we talking about rushing a Stuart? That'd be like rushing a Puma.

Dunno, to counter the sooner Luch maybe. It's not like Luch have been delayed to 60 sec build for something... nope.

Dunno, to counter the sooner Luch maybe. It's not like Luch have been delayed to 60 sec build for something... nope.

You're treating a fuel increase in isolation.

It'd also come with a manpower decrease, meaning OKW has a weaker early game, meaning less map control, meaning less resources.

With a weaker infantry presence to deal with, you can afford to invest in earlier AT tools.

My bad from starting the 100mp inaccuracy. It was 100mp more than Soviets back when Sturms were 320mp. I used that number because I was talking to Soviet-only players at the time.

Honestly I would happily pay for weapon racks if it meant BARs and Zooks (or STGs and Shrecks) off the racks. Weapon racks offer anti-infantry weapons as well as anti-tank weapons, equippable on any squad of your choice - but from what they describe it's as if it's the worse deal in the world.

I can tell you those same players will keep bitching even when BARs and STGs have the exact same cost, timing, and stats. Right now STGs have a better timing and are far more muni efficient, but BARs have a vastly superior upper limit in combat power.

Like others have said the game isn't a vacuum with these timings

On average OKW will have slightly more map control and thus fuel due to kubel and volks being built off the bat+strongest starting unit in sturms. This is especially true vs say Ostheer or Soviets that are more delayed out the gate

Stuart 105 fuel +15 fuel ambulance + 10 fuel racks + 10 fuel grenade rack to unlock access to the same tools OKW get the moment the luch hit the field.
If you don't see the problem, can't help you more from here.

-15F starting resources for OKW, +55F for medics so an additional 70F OKW needs for luchs. rifles > volks lategame. Give OKW the same tools USF get the moment a sherman hits the field. If you don't see the problem, can't help you more from here.

Remove Infrared Halftrack (useless unit except team games), make it a doctrine unit. Being the least used unit for something productive instead. Maybe add Pak40 since they are utterly vulnerable in terms of AT mid to late game. That is an issue OKW experiences is proper AT equipment.

Revamp or remove Raketenwerfer since it is a nuisance for both sides and for balancing purposes. Nerf Camo completely to the state where it is activiated upon the unit being idle/stationary only. Or remove camo for some other ability. Improve the range of Rak as any other AT gun. If that is too much just simply remove it with Pak40 instead.

Make it come after a base built according to every other factions timing with AT guns and give access to them Pzfaust early. Lock Fire nade until 1 base built.


Starting points as it currently is fine in my opinion. Maybe manpower reduction and increase fuel. Do not know exactly. Any proportional changes would do just fine!

It is just how they start is the annoying issue and what unit, do and donts is,... just needs changing.!

Like others have said the game isn't a vacuum with these timings

On average OKW will have slightly more map control and thus fuel due to kubel and volks being built off the bat+strongest starting unit in sturms. This is especially true vs say Ostheer or Soviets that are more delayed out the gate

Not if their starting manpower is reduced.

Which is literally the first line of this thread.

-15F starting resources for OKW, +55F for medics so an additional 70F OKW needs for luchs. rifles > volks lategame. Give OKW the same tools USF get the moment a sherman hits the field. If you don't see the problem, can't help you more from here.

No my dear friend, you didn't understand me, let me be more clear. I said that the actual fuel configuration is fine, the problem is if you give 20 fuel more to OKW at start. This is were it become a problem since. I think you can read thedarkarmadillo's post who explained it just fine.

OKW don't need T1 to get healing, it has been established well enough by the balance team last year so OKW can go T2 first and then T3 without any healing problem, as we can see it almost every day every match since then.

No my dear friend, you didn't understand me, let me be more clear. I said that the actual fuel configuration is fine, the problem is if you give 20 fuel more to OKW at start. This is were it become a problem since. I think you can read thedarkarmadillo's post who explained it just fine.

OKW don't need T1 to get healing, it has been established well enough by the balance team last year so OKW can go T2 first and then T3 without any healing problem, as we can see it almost every day every match since then.

I'm not going to explain further why this is incorrect.

No my dear friend, you didn't understand me, let me be more clear. I said that the actual fuel configuration is fine, the problem is if you give 20 fuel more to OKW at start. This is were it become a problem since. I think you can read thedarkarmadillo's post who explained it just fine.

OKW don't need T1 to get healing, it has been established well enough by the balance team last year so OKW can go T2 first and then T3 without any healing problem, as we can see it almost every day every match since then.

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Why shouldnt they? Do volks have passive self regen at vet0?

I would prefer if people would just say "i dont want to OKW get buffed", at least that is being honest.

I would kindly ask you, why there would be 'problems' but do it in a way everyone can understand (im not refering of skill level).

IMO its a change, a intermediate one but it would put OKW in line with the rest of the factions.
Darkarmadillo got it right about the "luchs rush", its more like a progression, maybe a needed one, but its true that the OKW player isnt sacrificing anything in return.
USF playstile is far different from OKW, so please do not compare them. USF has priorities that OKW does not.
The manpower/fuel at start can be leveled to allow better game balance.

And no, SPios are strong but they are not the best starting unit. If anyone wants to justify a nerf to their economy.

-"Oh boi, they are asking for Axis buffs! Whe should stop that from happening!"
*Denies everything but own arguments
*Plays the "there would be problems" card[

Is it a buff? Faster light vehicles, but lower early game manpower. OKW loses its main strength, and when that inevitably eats into map control, they lose a chunk of that 15 FU acceleration too.

Is it a buff? Faster light vehicles, but lower early game manpower. OKW loses its main strength, and when that inevitably eats into map control, they lose a chunk of that 15 FU acceleration too.

The amount of negation some people are offering make it seems like a buff.
As i said is a change for good. Im good with it.

Imo all vehicles should actually be delayed a bit and space between them increased.

That would allow infatry fights, the better designed part of the game, to last longer and the shock value of vehicles could be decreased since their window of opportunity would be increased.

Imo all vehicles should actually be delayed a bit and space between them increased.

That would allow infatry fights, the better designed part of the game, to last longer and the shock value of vehicles could be decreased since their window of opportunity would be increased.

Then lights would be completely forgotten and you'd see nothing else but med armor rush, like we had it in the past, you know, when all vehicles were delayed more, because the more infantry and ATGs on field, the less effective lights are.

Then lights would be completely forgotten and you'd see nothing else but med armor rush, like we had it in the past, you know, when all vehicles were delayed more, because the more infantry and ATGs on field, the less effective lights are.

There is big enough space between dominating games and becoming irrelevant.