Soviet buffs/adjustments

Your ignorant self was also proven incorrect on multiple occasions, including by me, yet you never dropped your nose-high-in-the-air attitude even for a second.

And maybe one who has proven to be wrong so many times, should have learn his lesson by now and maybe he should stop posting on what is going or not going to happen and accept the fact that he does not have a direct line with GOD so he can not predict the future.

. A direct line from relic is a direct line from God as far as this game is concerned. Not saying he hasn't been wrong, but use those examples not one where relic explicitly said something and then did the opposite.

Either way, if you both could take this into PMs and not the open forum that would be great....

. A direct line from relic is a direct line from God as far as this game is concerned. Not saying he hasn't been wrong, but use those examples not one where relic explicitly said something and then did the opposite.

Either way, if you both could take this into PMs and not the open forum that would be great....

If one want relay information released from Relic one can quotes, if one posts thing like:

...
Which is not going to happen.
...

He is presenting as fact something that is actually his own prediction. That is simply wrong.

I have nothing personal with the user and nothing to sent him in a PM. That is why avoid as much possible making personal comments, but since the user tents to turn everything to personal issue and in a insulting way I might add, its quite difficult not respond at all.

kat would u please give ur opinion for once ? what would be ur changes ?

kat would u please give ur opinion for once ? what would be ur changes ?

I did in multiple other threads, but since you're asking so nicely, I'll repeat myself once more:

-Con T3/T4 scalability global upgrade, if its meaningful reinforcement cut so they don't bleed so badly, so be it, if its weapon upgrade, so be it - one thing is certain, whatever is going to happen, it needs to match cost efficiency provided by weapon upgrades of other factions or they'll always be behind to the point of irrelevance in late game. 3 SVTs would be my preferred way, but someone suggested reinforce cost decrease upgrade, which I'd also like to test.
-Stop pretending maxim is soviet "LMG", either leave shitty suppression and buff its DPS, so it does provide firepower support for cons in early game or buff its suppression with needed DPS adjustment, either make it a damage setup weapon OR suppression weapon, not shit at both, adjust setup time accordingly, tho with current stats and cost it has, plain suppression buff is what it'd go with
-Both of these units buffed will indirectly make commissar squad actually useful as its buffs are nothing but a waste on anything that isn't penal.

No other soviet unit needs any kind of buffs if we consider commander patch changes specifically to shocks.
Lets just forget for good lend-lease guards exist and remove them from the game.

good changes but do u think penal and t 70 should remain as they are after those changes ?

Not gonna read another thread of walls of Vipper vs Katitof, no offense, but since that appears to happen, please keep it on OPs topic.

@OP Most factions suffer from this 1 dimensional build issues. The only changes that occur from the metas are usually commander selections. While I agree soviets could use a rework, I think most could use it as well. The problem is no one is designating the resources for a full game overhaul. Instead we just play wack-a-mole and deleting 2 problems but create another 2.

I don't think penals would need much of a change, you'd still see penal spams, but you wouldn't see only penal spams, they would be a nice supplement to cons, not complete replacement, so 1 or 2 in addition to cons, for emergency AT after M3 rush could be more of a norm them heavy T1 we're pretty much forced to rely on now.

As for T-70, its much more tricky, I'm a massive M5 quad fan myself, but it was completely gutted as glass cannon, so alternative doesn't exists for T-70 and T-70 itself already was nerfed multiple times, it needs to be decent at its primary job, which is AI, or you'll end up with abomination of a light tank like Stuart, which completely lost its identity and potency and was completely phased out of the game as it can't engage vehicles(pumas eat it for breakfast) and can't engage infantry due to gutted performance, Luchs performs very well vs inf and still can score retreat wipes if opponent doesn't retreat early against it and T-70 already is considerably more expensive and comes later, so you probably can't nerf T-70 without buffing it elsewhere or drop its price to luchs level, which would lead to even earlier T-70, however earlier and more reliably PGs for ost could plug that T-70 vulnerability as OKW doesn't really have problems against it.

u know u could nerf the t 70 wihtout touching his ai much right ?
reload speed Nerf, speed nerf, target size nerf etc

and as u said people will still spam penal as they are just stronger spammed so u still did not fix the problem

No, I've said that some people will still spam penals, there were people spamming them when they were shit and achieving something other then utter defeat, I've also said that more diverse BOs might emerge, like 3 cons, 2 penals or so(2 cons 2 penals was a thing for some time pre penal nerfs, remember?), with cons having a backbone in late game, penals wouldn't be the only viable option. I for one am sick of using them, but there is no alternative.

Aforementioned late game con upgrade would already diminish penal usefulness as cons would still be able to apply cost efficient bleed and they boast greater map presence then penals ever could.

Having an option to go more then 1 con and don't concede the game without ppsh doctrine is something soviet players really look forward to.

Maxims would be more tricky as its quite challenging to find a golden spot between "maxim spam only meta" and "maxims=free vet piniata for axis" states it constantly bounces between with no middle ground, current state is probably closest to that middle ground, but it still got short end of the stick.

I feel like SOV are like OST pre mobile defense nerf.

SOV are crutching on 2-3 OP units (Penals, t70) like how OST crutched on p4 command and pumas. Remove those and the faction struggles.

I feel like small nerfs to penals and t70 can be compensated with t2/cons buffs and maybe a su76 buff. This will hopefully open more diversity in SOV lineup than scout car and penals into t70 every game.

good idea, nerf the t70 even further.

Please stay on topic.

I actually don't think that Maxim needs a buff, maybe a price reduction to 240 and it's enough. And I don't think conscripts is that bad, they just need a proper vet 1 and merge the Molotov with AT nades with proper price.

Price reduction = spam

Take katitof advice: either DPS or suppression. Both equally good. If you consider maxims vet1 ability a DPS increase could be better for sinergy pruposes.

Cons needing a buff is something people have been saying quite a lot lately.

If both were to happen, buff cons+maxims and nerf T70 a little, SU will get a lot of diversity in opening and midgame strats.
I would consider M5 HT Quad buffs too

Con SVT just turns them into volk clones and volks are problematic enough.

Just reduce their reinforce cost at vet 3

Give the Maxim the ability to actually do its job (suppress) and it'll be fine.

Conscripts are more complicated. I'd remove their sidetech first and see what happens: if the idea is Sov builds one or two to support other squads then charging that much for their abilities is insane.

Conscripts are more complicated. I'd remove their sidetech first and see what happens:

Absolutely nothing would change.
They'd be equally shit in late game combat as they are now.

Absolutely nothing would change.
They'd be equally shit in late game combat as they are now.

They'd also be one of the best snarers in the game (Oorah plus the good AT grenade), fill in as garrison clearers freeing up your engineer to be a minesweeper, build heavy cover and merge into fighting squads and team weapons. And for 240 MP, not the insane circa 470 MP 40 FU you pay right now for a single full utility Conscript squad.

Lackluster on their own or when spammed, very useful when combined with other units.


You could be right and they'll never be good until they're turned into yet another spammable mainline. But I'm not convinced that's the only way just yet.

They'd also be one of the best snarers in the game (Oorah plus the good AT grenade), fill in as garrison clearers freeing up your engineer to be a minesweeper, build heavy cover and merge into fighting squads and team weapons. And for 240 MP, not the insane circa 470 MP 40 FU you pay right now for a single full utility Conscript squad.

Lackluster on their own or when spammed, very useful when combined with other units.


You could be right and they'll never be good until they're turned into yet another spammable mainline. But I'm not convinced that's the only way just yet.

Penals do both, much better and still can fight on their own, at all stages of the game.

Having a cripple on a wheelchair instead of him lying on the floor, making him pay for wheelchair first still means you have a cripple that needs to get carried all the time.

FHT is op but that is totally irrelevant.

If you buff conscripts and maxims their will be no need for a band aid anymore.

Make conscripts into Penals.
Buff Maxims to MG42.
Remove T70. Replace with T34/76 (at 100 fuel)
Make T34/76 also come out of T5 (at 90 fuel)

This way, Penals, Maxim, Conscript, T70 and T34 problems are fixed.

Oh, and make Grenadiers 5 man, but without LMG42 upgrade.

COH2 fixed.