Kubel needs changes

"VonIvan built 2"
must have missed this game, but i checked most if not all remaining and never seen it.

"and it would have worked if he paid more attention"
You could say that grenades would never work if X player paid more attention.
The DO REQUIRE a lot of micro and effort to stay alive against infantry, and even more against m3 and wc51. Is this micro and effort worth ?

Simply not worth the micro. I usually watch VonIvan myself, he hardly builds the Kubel. It is rare of him actually using it. Unless it does as good as Universal Carrier (if Kubel would have access to upgrades) then I would have to say yes. #78, My devoted time and effort on that message/s are hopefully well spent. I do hope changes will be made.

Invised posts and corresponding posts for flame

(2v2speaking)

Kubel is complete trash and nearly a 100% a throwaway MP by 5min with little return.

I find it a waste on MP and I no longer go it, the fact that I see the UC/SC 90% of games is also an issue. Tho I can't give any opinion on how to fix it, I would like to state that yeah its trash. Id rather put that 210MP towards a racken which will be needed over that any day.

Kubel is fine,maybe OP, it can fucking cap and maphaxxx with vet 1!
Slap a fuel tag of 5 on it.

The DPS max of the m3 is 4.04 and of Kubel is 7.03 so its more like x174%.
But that is half the picture:
From range 22 M3 has more DPS.
More importantly Kubel has terrible moving modifiers lowering its DPS at max range to 1.56 while the M3 has 2.021 and at close range 1.49 (for kubel) vs 9.21 for M3.
That makes the M3 better since this unit need to keep moving and the M3 far better at chasing enemy unit.
Not to mention that M3 has 5.4 armor which is the same as 221...

The kubel is currently one of the least cost efficient car in the game and that is why it sees far less use than other cars.

And it has 2 guns!

How so? The Kuble can cap and fight out of the box. The wc51 needs something more in order to cap and fight.
After you invest more, you have a better unit.
You pay more and you get more.
No hurdles or balancing bars here.

There, fixed for ya.
Yeah sure, pay more have more, is this a capitalist fantasy? Or is this a game? Anyway if kubel costed 280, but its water gun is upgraded to a real machine gun then ill pay that anytime soon.

Edit: Funny thing, you say in other threads, cons CANT fight because of reasons but kubels conveniently CAN. They both are dirt cheap, but cons are trash and kubels is intended to be useless?

Fucking priceless LMAO

Have you heard guys, git gud and start using Kubel, it's totally worth it.

Not a single OKW player in the CC3 built it, they must know how strong Kubel is !!!

Not a single player has also built Easy8, KV-2, KV-1 and plenty more units, which are in a good place.
What's your point again?
Buff everything that wasn't used in a random tournament?

Not a single player has also built Easy8, KV-2, KV-1 and plenty more units, which are in a good place.
What's your point again?
Buff everything that wasn't used in a random tournament?

its a shame these doctrinal units didnt get used, they should be buffed asap.

Compared to other RTS games, say like Starcraft, Company of Heroes 2 has a big focus on unit preservation. You are rewarded for keeping your units alive in the form of Veterancy. At the moment there are a few units in the game that struggle to hit max Veterancy regardless of how good one individual plays. The Kubelwagon is one of those units which needs to be fixed because at the moment one of the core basic gameplay mechanics is broken. Trying to argue otherwise is disingenuous. Rather than playing faction politics, I ask when was the last time anyone on this forum saw a Vet 5 Kubelwagon against someone who wasn't AFK or playing against the AI. You will see Maxed out Vet Rifleman, Grenadiers, Machine Guns, AT Guns etc, never in my history of playing (almost 6000 hours on COH2) have I ever seen a Vet 5 Kubelwagon. This is broken and needs to be fixed for the betterment of our beloved COH2. Even if the Kubelwagon comes with some nerfs (limited to 1, fuel cost etc) I believe every unit should be able to hit Veterancy cap in a reasonable and fair fashion. The second thing is every unit should have a CLEAR Role on what it is supposed to do. Many units lack these definitive roles which is why we have lackluster units such as the KV-1 which are rarely seen in games.

Compared to other RTS games, say like Starcraft, Company of Heroes 2 has a big focus on unit preservation. You are rewarded for keeping your units alive in the form of Veterancy. At the moment there are a few units in the game that struggle to hit max Veterancy regardless of how good one individual plays. The Kubelwagon is one of those units which needs to be fixed because at the moment one of the core basic gameplay mechanics is broken. Trying to argue otherwise is disingenuous. Rather than playing faction politics, I ask when was the last time anyone on this forum saw a Vet 5 Kubelwagon against someone who wasn't AFK or playing against the AI. You will see Maxed out Vet Rifleman, Grenadiers, Machine Guns, AT Guns etc, never in my history of playing (almost 6000 hours on COH2) have I ever seen a Vet 5 Kubelwagon. This is broken and needs to be fixed for the betterment of our beloved COH2. Even if the Kubelwagon comes with some nerfs (limited to 1, fuel cost etc) I believe every unit should be able to hit Veterancy cap in a reasonable and fair fashion. The second thing is every unit should have a CLEAR Role on what it is supposed to do. Many units lack these definitive roles which is why we have lackluster units such as the KV-1 which are rarely seen in games.

I agree with what you have stated entirely. Many units in game should have a definite defined role than something undefined or being lackluster.

The highest I ever gotten with Kubel was vet 2 or 3, that match was more than a month ago, it was around 20-25mins. Others were already vet 5 even earlier before Kubel got even that veterancy.

Elements of the game has to reworked or looked through carefully again. Kubel needs buffs. Problems have to solved rather then argued further.

There, fixed for ya.
Yeah sure, pay more have more, is this a capitalist fantasy? Or is this a game? Anyway if kubel costed 280, but its water gun is upgraded to a real machine gun then ill pay that anytime soon.

Edit: Funny thing, you say in other threads, cons CANT fight because of reasons but kubels conveniently CAN. They both are dirt cheap, but cons are trash and kubels is intended to be useless?

In a fight to the death the Kuble will outlast any other t0 infantry it faced in 96% of the tests. I'd call that being able to fight. It's a part of an army though, not the whole thing. Use it to cap and use its mobility to help goon enemies.

Also cons are not cheap as they cost 240mp and then another 205mp in sidegrades (that do nothing but stuff for cons so it is a direct cost increase to them) and 35 fuel. That's half a T70 EXTRA just for a full kit.

The Kuble costs 210mo and can beat 280mp in an outright fight. Cons cost 240mp and can lose against 250mp infantry.

I agree with what you have stated entirely. Many units in game should have a definite defined role than something undefined or being lackluster.

The highest I ever gotten with Kubel was vet 2 or 3, that match was more than a month ago, it was around 20-25mins. Others were already vet 5 even earlier before Kubel got even that veterancy.

Elements of the game has to reworked or looked through carefully again. Kubel needs buffs. Problems have to solved rather then argued further.

As was pointed out, the Kuble has stupidly high vet requirements. Shiuld that be fixed the Kuble can experience things like self repair and targeted Supression which would increase its ease of use ten fold.

In a fight to the death the Kuble will outlast any other t0 infantry it faced in 96% of the tests. I'd call that being able to fight. It's a part of an army though, not the whole thing. Use it to cap and use its mobility to help goon enemies.

The Kuble costs 210mo and can beat 280mp in an outright fight. Cons cost 240mp and can lose against 250mp infantry.

At what range ? What unit ? What cover has the infantry ?

Nope, just generically "beat"

Can you show me one of those tests ?

At what range ? What unit ? What cover has the infantry ?

Nope, just generically "beat"

Can you show me one of those tests ?

Attack moved in an open field since the consensus was that the Kuble couldn't fight anything at all ever. I can link you the post where I screen capped the aftermath of each bout (10 tests against each allied t0 unit) but if you scroll back it will be right about when people stopped saying it can't fight and starting bitching that it can't garrison.

I didn't use cover because due to the kubles vision it can chose to pick its engagements an act like a vulture swooping in to nab the dirty kills

Wholey unrealistic anyways as there was no Sturm support or micro of any sort but the Kuble will 1v1 any allied t0 infantry in a slug match

https://www.coh2.org/topic/88649/kubel-needs-changes/post/735766

I also have screen caps of before and after each bout in each match up (you could say you want to see the 6th round of before and after in a con fight against conscripts and I can prove it was actually done and not just 10x damaged kubles chilling out.)

Attack moved in an open field since the consensus was that the Kuble couldn't fight anything at all ever. I can link you the post where I screen capped the aftermath of each bout (10 tests against each allied t0 unit) but if you scroll back it will be right about when people stopped saying it can't fight and starting bitching that it can't garrison.

I didn't use cover because due to the kubles vision it can chose to pick its engagements an act like a vulture swooping in to nab the dirty kills

Wholey unrealistic anyways as there was no Sturm support or micro of any sort but the Kuble will 1v1 any allied t0 infantry in a slug match

https://www.coh2.org/topic/88649/kubel-needs-changes/post/735766

I also have screen caps of before and after each bout in each match up (you could say you want to see the 6th round of before and after in a con fight against conscripts and I can prove it was actually done and not just 10x damaged kubles chilling out.)

So you basically designed a scenario that was specifically designed to be as unrealistic as possible. Tell me, do you generally leave a unit out of cover when its being shot at?

Attack moved in an open field since the consensus was that the Kuble couldn't fight anything at all ever. I can link you the post where I screen capped the aftermath of each bout (10 tests against each allied t0 unit) but if you scroll back it will be right about when people stopped saying it can't fight and starting bitching that it can't garrison.

I didn't use cover because due to the kubles vision it can chose to pick its engagements an act like a vulture swooping in to nab the dirty kills

Wholey unrealistic anyways as there was no Sturm support or micro of any sort but the Kuble will 1v1 any allied t0 infantry in a slug match

https://www.coh2.org/topic/88649/kubel-needs-changes/post/735766

I also have screen caps of before and after each bout in each match up (you could say you want to see the 6th round of before and after in a con fight against conscripts and I can prove it was actually done and not just 10x damaged kubles chilling out.)

So if the opponent suffer from heavy brain damage and decide to not take any cover whatsoever while being at max range aka the best range possible for kubel, the kubelwagen win.

Nice to know i can count on hacking into opponent hardware to make kubelwagen viable.