I've played a few OKW games recently, branching away from my usual soviet and occasional British game.
In the first few games, I build the King Tiger after saving the fuel for it, only for it to be essentially useless, Id rather have bought 2 Panzer IV.
I open this discussion as I'm not sure if the King Tiger is incredibly underwhelming, bordering on being completely useless or if it is just a lack of skill on my part, although this feels less likely as I don't seem to struggle with the heavy tanks on the allied factions (although with allies, I have a more combined arms approach as i really like the Zis, the British AT gun is not great, but better than rakaten).
If it is a case of never worth buying, perhaps it could use some buffs to make it relevant?
Also, As I am a newer player, I would ask that you please provide some reason for voting, so I can learn where I am going wrong.
Cheers
King Tiger - Is it worth buying?
2 Dec 2018, 04:42 AM
#1
Posts: 378
2 Dec 2018, 04:46 AM
#2
Posts: 543
KT is a big HP sponge with a deadly cannon. KT stands for "Kite Them", and you should use it with a conservative aproach.
I think it is more useful when the game is coming to its end, you got the VP's on your hand and you can use it to watch from the back and push it to thin enemy lines. With some competent skills of mixing you army, you can hold the opponent off till the end of the game.
I'm pointing this with a 1v1 mentality, so mind that.
I think it is more useful when the game is coming to its end, you got the VP's on your hand and you can use it to watch from the back and push it to thin enemy lines. With some competent skills of mixing you army, you can hold the opponent off till the end of the game.
I'm pointing this with a 1v1 mentality, so mind that.
2 Dec 2018, 04:48 AM
#3
Posts: 378
KT is a big HP sponge with a deadly cannon. KT stands for "Kite Them", and you should use it with a conservative aproach.
I think it is more useful when the game is coming to its end, you got the VP's on your hand and you can use it to watch from the back and push it to thin enemy lines. With some competent skills of mixing you army, you can hold the opponent off till the end of the game.
I'm pointing this with a 1v1 mentality, so mind that.
So it should not be rushed?
2 Dec 2018, 04:50 AM
#4
Posts: 543
So it should not be rushed?
It's not wise. Rush for P4, and then stall for Panther if u can.
2 Dec 2018, 04:52 AM
#5
Posts: 607
Not really in a 1v1, sometimes in a 2v2, situationally great in larger team games.
I don't buy the "it's useless, a single allied tank destroyer nullifies" it argument, but it's not an insta-win either and you do have to support it.
I don't buy the "it's useless, a single allied tank destroyer nullifies" it argument, but it's not an insta-win either and you do have to support it.
2 Dec 2018, 04:55 AM
#6
Posts: 378
Not really in a 1v1, sometimes in a 2v2, situationally great in larger team games.
I don't buy the "it's useless, a single allied tank destroyer nullifies" it argument, but it's not an insta-win either and you do have to support it.
I don't feel like a single allied tank nullifies it. That is not at all my argument, I'm just saying I don't struggle to use allied TD (of which I have more experience)
I feel like, If I have bought 2 panzer 4, they cost almost identical to a KT, they do more damage (to both infantry and vehicles), and are more maneuverable whilst still being survivable.
Thus, for its price, shouldn't it be similar in performance to 2 panzer IV? or fill a role more effectively than mediums, so it has a distinct use?
2 Dec 2018, 05:34 AM
#7
Posts: 1044 | Subs: 1
Its no longer the old I win automatically unit that it once was but is still situationally strong with good support. TDs can do pretty good against it especially in team games where they can hit critical mass.
KTs overpriced though which is why it isn't seen often.
KTs overpriced though which is why it isn't seen often.
bg /l
2 Dec 2018, 07:48 AM
#8
Posts: 4183 | Subs: 4
Never buy it. There is literally anything else that would be more effective so long as it isn't a kubel
2 Dec 2018, 08:52 AM
#9
Posts: 214
Its no longer the old I win automatically unit that it once was but is still situationally strong with good support.
That was the ISU...
just dont buy the KT.
If u want fast AT buy the Panther, if u want "cheap" AT buy the JP4 and never ever rely on raketen.
Since mid game allied forces have much more arty power and u will get only fuks.
2 Dec 2018, 09:14 AM
#10
Posts: 155
Already ordered one for a x-mas
2 Dec 2018, 09:35 AM
#11
Posts: 1044 | Subs: 1
That was the ISU...
just dont buy the KT.
If u want fast AT buy the Panther, if u want "cheap" AT buy the JP4 and never ever rely on raketen.
Since mid game allied forces have much more arty power and u will get only fuks.
The KT back when double OKW was the most broken thing in the game was a insta win button.
So was the ISU back then but basically every heavy tank had its period of being ridiculously broken.
bg /l
2 Dec 2018, 09:37 AM
#12
Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6
The only time the KT is worth it, is in shot blocker maps when you can rush it and use HEAT shells (312 damage per shot).
Other than that, generally speaking it has turned from the 'I win' button into the 'I lose' button. It really needs a buff to be viable again as currently it is not worth the cost.
It definitely needs to get Brummbär AOE on its main gun (and all other heavy tanks too). And / or any/some of the following: better turret traverse, higher armor, spearhead to vet0/1, cost down to ~650MP/240FU.
Other than that, generally speaking it has turned from the 'I win' button into the 'I lose' button. It really needs a buff to be viable again as currently it is not worth the cost.
It definitely needs to get Brummbär AOE on its main gun (and all other heavy tanks too). And / or any/some of the following: better turret traverse, higher armor, spearhead to vet0/1, cost down to ~650MP/240FU.
2 Dec 2018, 10:06 AM
#13
Posts: 1220
2 Dec 2018, 10:19 AM
#14
Posts: 5279
I want to see its front armour climb back up. It's flank able and flanks are now feasible, unlike when it's armour was nerfed. I'd like to see spearhead moved vet 1 so it can actually be used, plus it would make the KT better and leave the flanking option open. No other changes imo
#stalinwept
2 Dec 2018, 10:20 AM
#15
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
KT isn´t as bad as people claim when it´s used right but I admit KT is pretty bad in 7/10 games.
Never "rush" for it. That´s a sure way to lose the game unless the opponent is way below ur level and you just want to troll.
Use it as the final piece in late game to secure VPs on maps that have a decent amount of sigh/shot blockers. Only use it if you know you will be able to deal with allied TDs (if you have 2+ Raks and either a JP4 or a Panther). Best case scenario is calling it in when you know your opponent will not have more than 1 TD each (in 2v2) or maybe 2 TD in total.
KT needs to get lower vet requirements (they are completely insane at the moment) and a faster turret rotation. Then it would be fine IMO.
Never "rush" for it. That´s a sure way to lose the game unless the opponent is way below ur level and you just want to troll.
Use it as the final piece in late game to secure VPs on maps that have a decent amount of sigh/shot blockers. Only use it if you know you will be able to deal with allied TDs (if you have 2+ Raks and either a JP4 or a Panther). Best case scenario is calling it in when you know your opponent will not have more than 1 TD each (in 2v2) or maybe 2 TD in total.
KT needs to get lower vet requirements (they are completely insane at the moment) and a faster turret rotation. Then it would be fine IMO.
2 Dec 2018, 10:21 AM
#16
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
never ever rely on raketen.
Says someone who doesn´t know how to use them.
2 Dec 2018, 10:29 AM
#17
Posts: 956
Some sort of buff is sure needed
Not sure which
But it should have a role of a good medium tanks spam counter (but only as long as it has snares and ATs behind it) and an infantry counter (but not a wiper), that gets consistently rekt by TDs (but has a chance to escape them if supported and not snared)
So, as for AI, shells with huge AoE but small damage (1 third of a soldiers HP) could work
Also ability to turn into shells that have average AoE and small damage, but suppress
As for the medium tanks, it seems quite fine.
As for retreating away from TDs:
An ability to get higher reverse speed
A smoke shell (fired by the gun very fast, but not popped)
A deactivate the main gun, but get lower received damage (there is no realism logic behind such a thing, but it would be interesting
(Ofc not all at once)
BTW a faster turret rotation is a big no. If anyone is like me (i. e. dumb enough to send it without huge support behind it) they shouldnt get away with it
Not sure which
But it should have a role of a good medium tanks spam counter (but only as long as it has snares and ATs behind it) and an infantry counter (but not a wiper), that gets consistently rekt by TDs (but has a chance to escape them if supported and not snared)
So, as for AI, shells with huge AoE but small damage (1 third of a soldiers HP) could work
Also ability to turn into shells that have average AoE and small damage, but suppress
As for the medium tanks, it seems quite fine.
As for retreating away from TDs:
An ability to get higher reverse speed
A smoke shell (fired by the gun very fast, but not popped)
A deactivate the main gun, but get lower received damage (there is no realism logic behind such a thing, but it would be interesting
(Ofc not all at once)
BTW a faster turret rotation is a big no. If anyone is like me (i. e. dumb enough to send it without huge support behind it) they shouldnt get away with it
"Nice. Very impressive. Now let´s see Paul Allen´s playercard."
2 Dec 2018, 10:30 AM
#18
Posts: 747 | Subs: 2
KT used to be an insta win. Now you need atleast 1 JP4 additionally. Nothing wrong with this unit.
 | Playercard of RedT3rror | |||||||||||||||
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2 Dec 2018, 11:44 AM
#19
Posts: 3166 | Subs: 6
BTW a faster turret rotation is a big no. If anyone is like me (i. e. dumb enough to send it without huge support behind it) they shouldnt get away with it
The current traverse speed significantly hampers all of its combat capacity, even when the unit is used correctly. It takes ages for it to train the gun on target. That's why the Spearhead ability makes the tank so much better. Obviously it doesn't need Panzer IV level of turret traverse, but the current value is bonkers (and unrealistic). It definitely needs either a straight buff or Spearhead moved to vet 1.
2 Dec 2018, 12:04 PM
#20
Posts: 13496 | Subs: 1
I would try a more reliable gun and moving most of its power down to veterancy (with a full veterancy overhaul). Then the unit would have lower impact when it called but it will still become relevant when vetted.
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