Rear Echeleons need reworking.

Riflemen spam is basically the only thing you can do as USF at the start of the game. Riflemen preformance is very lack luster in the first few minutes of the game and get out preformed by Volks and Strums and easily pinned by MG42s. REs are pretty terrible for 200 MP and the volley fire ability is worthless. The devs like to make damn sure certain USF abilities are worthless and volley fire is no exception. 60% recived accuracy? How about 0% recieved accuracy? Seriously who thought that was a good idea...best way to rework them us to remove the pointless anbility and just set them up to be a 5 man sqaud.

If you're losing the early game as USF, you are getting outplayed by a better player. Learn to flank, use a forward ambulance, pick fights you can win and you will be fine. Also, you have a T0 mortar, use it.

Volley fire use to be fucking the most op ability in the game back during release when REs had no RA modifiers to it. They could literally 1v1 any unit in the game and then got even better with upgrades. So 0% RA is a big fat no.

Not really a rework, a cost reduction to 180MP would be fine

I find rear echelons really terrible cant even kill the team weapon crew

Volley fire needs to be buffed some how lie its penalty must be nerfed and make rear echelon more accurate

More like replaced by Ass Engies if you ask me.

Riflemen spam is basically the only thing you can do as USF at the start of the game.
@
Penal spam is basically the only thing you can do as SU at the start of the game.
@
Grens span is basically the only thing you can do as OST at the start of the game.
@
Fgrens spam is basically the only thing you can do as OKW at the start of the game.

Any problems?

Riflemen spam is basically the only thing you can do as USF at the start of the game.
@
Penal spam is basically the only thing you can do as SU at the start of the game.
@
Grens span is basically the only thing you can do as OST at the start of the game.
@
Fgrens spam is basically the only thing you can do as OKW at the start of the game.

Any problems?

WTF?
Both Soviets and Wehr have plenty of options dependin on the opponent and the build order
Another engineers into an M3 with penals? Can work against OKW
Cons and a maxim? Can work
Multiple engineers and two cons into sniper? Can work sometimes
Cons and penals? Can work
Double 42? Can work
Triple pios into grens? Can work
Grens and a sniper? Can work
One piece of each? Can work

OKW has a kubel/no kubel option as well as second sturmpios sometimes

And then theres USF
Three rifles straight up? Yes
REs and then three rifles? Can work against wehr
Two more REs? Cant work ever
Two rifles into med car? Cant work
REs and only two rifles? Cant work

Doctrines dont count


I bloody well hope that your post was(nt) just a trolling in which case Im feedin u

I bloody well hope that your post was(nt) just a trolling in which case Im feedin u

First i wanted to post that "guys want only one thing and it is disgusting" pic, but then....

Volley fire use to be fucking the most op ability in the game back during release when REs had no RA modifiers to it. They could literally 1v1 any unit in the game and then got even better with upgrades. So 0% RA is a big fat no.

At release volley fire actually worked too. The only thing that feels slower at suppressing is a Maxim. They could easily reduce the rec acc debuff and leave the piss poor suppression or buff the suppression rate and leave the easy counterplay. The fact that despite the m2 being late and locked volley fire sees no use is pretty good cause to change it up a bit somehow.

Riflemen spam is basically the only thing you can do as USF at the start of the game.
@
Penal spam is basically the only thing you can do as SU at the start of the game.
@
Grens span is basically the only thing you can do as OST at the start of the game.
@
Fgrens spam is basically the only thing you can do as OKW at the start of the game.

Any problems?

Dude OKW gets a kubel wagen and has option for 2 strong stum pios and OST has MG that screws your riflemen pretty hard cuz SMOKE on riflemen was Op its very hard TO CHANGE YOUR MGS POSITION IT NEEDS ROCKET SCIENCE

I find rear echelons really terrible cant even kill the team weapon crew

Compare their DPS with other engineer units you might be surprised, then compare them again at vet 1 when the get bonus accuracy, you might be even more surprised.

Problem with Rear Echelon in the early stages is that Volley Fire only works if you are ignored or facing Ostheer Pioneers; the unit will die in most cases or be combat ineffective. Get into late game, the squad will disintegrate if they push the button and your better off just shooting with LMGs to BARs. Volley-Fire either needs to not have a RA penalty given it needs time to even ramp up, lower RA and faster ramp up time, or be changed so that let's say, enemy units under Volley Fire have their accuracy reduced by like 20-25% and are slowed to walking speed. The latter would mean Rear Echelon could support Riflemen and allow them to close the distance. What penalties the Rear Echelon would get could either be received accuracy or they need to keep the ability channeled or the debuff breaks.

Furthermore, their damage is very inconsistent. Yes, they deal 10 damage per shot, unlike an M1 Garands 8, but your accuracy is only 0.403/0.288/0.23. The moment anyone steps into cover, say goodbye to your to hit anyone. I'd rather their damage get dropped and they could actually hit people or they could shoot slower, but for higher accuracy. Of course, this does mean they no longer are good counters vs the Kubel, but maybe just adjusting their moving stats.

Also, it would be nice if USF can destroy their Fighting Position and get a full or partial refund; would help Rear Echelon to 'bunny-hop' and get more usage of their rifle grenades.

After that, maybe reduce cost or just their reinforcement cost and then that's a decent alternative to Riflemen and you'd have a reason to build more to support Rifles outside of mass RE strats.

At release volley fire actually worked too. The only thing that feels slower at suppressing is a Maxim. They could easily reduce the rec acc debuff and leave the piss poor suppression or buff the suppression rate and leave the easy counterplay. The fact that despite the m2 being late and locked volley fire sees no use is pretty good cause to change it up a bit somehow.

I actually forgot about that, either they keep the RA modifiers and give them better suppression or remove RA modifiers and maybe give them a minor suppression buff. IDK which one would be better.

Maybe another thing they could do it give REs some better Combat buffs with vet. SO they arent super good early but scale slightly better with vet.

Problem with Rear Echelon in the early stages is that Volley Fire only works if you are ignored or facing Ostheer Pioneers; the unit will die in most cases or be combat ineffective. Get into late game, the squad will disintegrate if they push the button and your better off just shooting with LMGs to BARs. Volley-Fire either needs to not have a RA penalty given it needs time to even ramp up, lower RA and faster ramp up time, or be changed so that let's say, enemy units under Volley Fire have their accuracy reduced by like 20-25% and are slowed to walking speed. The latter would mean Rear Echelon could support Riflemen and allow them to close the distance. What penalties the Rear Echelon would get could either be received accuracy or they need to keep the ability channeled or the debuff breaks.

Furthermore, their damage is very inconsistent. Yes, they deal 10 damage per shot, unlike an M1 Garands 8, but your accuracy is only 0.403/0.288/0.23. The moment anyone steps into cover, say goodbye to your to hit anyone. I'd rather their damage get dropped and they could actually hit people or they could shoot slower, but for higher accuracy. Of course, this does mean they no longer are good counters vs the Kubel, but maybe just adjusting their moving stats.

Also, it would be nice if USF can destroy their Fighting Position and get a full or partial refund; would help Rear Echelon to 'bunny-hop' and get more usage of their rifle grenades.

After that, maybe reduce cost or just their reinforcement cost and then that's a decent alternative to Riflemen and you'd have a reason to build more to support Rifles outside of mass RE strats.

+1

Compare their DPS with other engineer units you might be surprised, then compare them again at vet 1 when the get bonus accuracy, you might be even more surprised.

The thing is HOW you get them vet and there DPS doesnt matter when sturms and grens volks pios literally destroy you i am jsut saying they are not so good use for USF

Can we give them a non doctrinal flamethrower like all the other factions and swap the rifle company ability with something like a assault package that gives RE m3 sub machine guns and demos like assault engineers?

Can we give them a non doctrinal flamethrower like all the other factions

Lulwat?

Can we give them a non doctrinal flamethrower like all the other factions and swap the rifle company ability with something like a assault package that gives RE m3 sub machine guns and demos like assault engineers?

All the other 2 out of 5 factions?