Strafe Run

I'm glad that you are glad that I agree
@Adamant I always build T3 with at least two T34's,I'm confused about the AA capabilities of that halftrack,it just stands there burst two or three times and the Strafing plane continues to pin/massacre my infantry with no worries whatsoever...

I think it only shoots down plane after its already done its run, or near the end of the run..
Yeah, I agree. It doesn't seem to be much of a counter

Firstly no it wasn't nerfed to oblivion,example,as I said before it strafed all my infantry situated in the south part of the map Steppes
Second try spaming T34's vs a Panther,a little hint : Panther wins...more decent vs Panzer though but SU85 still being vital
Third no I didn't do nothing wrong,held victory point,held fuel,why would I go in his base,or search the whole map for a f*****g truck,is this some kind of new obligation?
And what is the purpose of Opel Blitz,fuel caches weren't enough ?
Fourth I don't spam snipers or Guards because I feel they are useless,button being the only good thing about Guards,my build was 5 conscript squads,2 whitch crewed stolen MG's,and 2 squads of Penals,two T34's and one SU85,latter AA truck whitch proved futile,aka useless...so no I don't use this "sniper guards su85s" of yours
Off-Topic:Why put a Recon Plane and Bomber in the same doctrine??

LOL! You are complaining about Strafe is 3v3 and 4v4 as the map you give an example of indicates. Dude, you really need to STFU, L2P and stop complaining about balance at anything more then 2v2. Balance is really only being worked out 1v1 at this stage as this is where it matters most. Take your biased Soviet whining back to you big team games along with your Guards, Mortars, Snipers and SU85 combo for insta win team games and stop CRYING!

LOL! You are complaining about Strafe is 3v3 and 4v4 as the map you give an example of indicates. Dude, you really need to STFU, L2P and stop complaining about balance at anything more then 2v2. Balance is really only being worked out 1v1 at this stage as this is where it matters most. Take your biased Soviet whining back to you big team games along with your Guards, Mortars, Snipers and SU85 combo for insta win team games and stop CRYING!

That's gonna hurt the game if true, because majority of people played 3v3's and 4v4's in COH and majority of multyplayer community is 3v3's and 4v4's gamers right now in coh 2....


How do I know, well I played 1v1 and 4v4's in COH and do the same in COH2.

For every 5 players searching for 1v1, there are 30+ searching for 4v4's. You wait 5-6+ minutes for 1v1 game... You wait 2-3 min tops for 4v4 game.

Taking into account waiting times and players searching, I would estimate there are 10x more people doing 4v4's than 1v1's

can't be smart move to neglect 9/10's of your gamers, Its business suicide from an ambush

That's gonna hurt the game if true, because majority of people played 3v3's and 4v4's in COH and majority of multyplayer community is 3v3's and 4v4's gamers right now in coh 2....


How do I know, well I played 1v1 and 4v4's in COH and do the same in COH2.

For every 5 players searching for 1v1, there are 30+ searching for 4v4's. You wait 5-6+ minutes for 1v1 game... You wait 2-3 min tops for 4v4 game.

Taking into account waiting times and players searching, I would estimate there are 10x more people doing 4v4's than 1v1's

can't be smart move to neglect 9/10's of your gamers, Its business suicide from an ambush

Its got nothing to do with what is smart for your business or how many people play a particular game mode. The problem is it's just NOT POSSIBLE to balance 3v3 and 4v4, those game modes are about who can spam the most units faster then the other team, simple. 1v1 and 2v2 actually have some strategy involved.

LOL! You are complaining about Strafe is 3v3 and 4v4 as the map you give an example of indicates. Dude, you really need to STFU, L2P and stop complaining about balance at anything more then 2v2. Balance is really only being worked out 1v1 at this stage as this is where it matters most. Take your biased Soviet whining back to you big team games along with your Guards, Mortars, Snipers and SU85 combo for insta win team games and stop CRYING!

It's funny that you cry about more things than me...let me guess,13 years old,am I right?

Its got nothing to do with what is smart for your business or how many people play a particular game mode. The problem is it's just NOT POSSIBLE to balance 3v3 and 4v4, those game modes are about who can spam the most units faster then the other team, simple. 1v1 and 2v2 actually have some strategy involved.

You Sir, have no idea what you are talking about....

I actually spam a lot more in 1v1's, and strategy? Its quite different. 1v1 its all about capping, denying points and resources, outflanking and having counter for expected unit at right time.
After a while, it becomes more of a specific set of tasks that I try to do in quickest possible time. Get to this house before my opponent, send my unit here to flank mg or ambush vehicle that will come in next 30 sec... organised chaos

now if you think that simple thing like de-capping point in 4v4 is about spamming units and doesn't involve strategy, all I can say is HAHAHHAHAHHA AHAHHAHHA.

try taking a point from someone who has it guarded by anti-infantry, AT guns and ranged units. You can't just retreat and go cap other side of the map if your opponent locks down area by HMG, you have to find the way to kill it.
You can't just outflank it, and spamm infantry to outflank it. It requires a lot of strategic planing, less chaos. More like a chees game, I won't even mention that in 1v1 you don't have to plan for your teamates shortcomings, or being prepared to fight of 2 opponents at the same time, until help arrives.....
Different strategy, sure. What you think, well you would be terrible noob 4v4 player

As far as how they are going to balance it, I do agree there. I can't see easy way to do it, with the way two factions are designed......

Meh, at least strafing run goes away after a few circles and doen't insta kill your infantry.... cough cough KV8.

The same nature that allows Strafe chaining in 2v2+, also allows for sufficient Quad production. AA may need some adjustment overall, but I think its in a pretty good place atm.

Strafe was already adjusted. Unless you are trying to argue that the Devs are idiots, it stands to reason it is now where its intended to be, rendering this thread null and void.

You Sir, have no idea what you are talking about....

I actually spam a lot more in 1v1's, and strategy? Its quite different. 1v1 its all about capping, denying points and resources, outflanking and having counter for expected unit at right time.
After a while, it becomes more of a specific set of tasks that I try to do in quickest possible time. Get to this house before my opponent, send my unit here to flank mg or ambush vehicle that will come in next 30 sec... organised chaos

now if you think that simple thing like de-capping point in 4v4 is about spamming units and doesn't involve strategy, all I can say is HAHAHHAHAHHA AHAHHAHHA.

try taking a point from someone who has it guarded by anti-infantry, AT guns and ranged units. You can't just retreat and go cap other side of the map if your opponent locks down area by HMG, you have to find the way to kill it.
You can't just outflank it, and spamm infantry to outflank it. It requires a lot of strategic planing, less chaos. More like a chees game, I won't even mention that in 1v1 you don't have to plan for your teamates shortcomings, or being prepared to fight of 2 opponents at the same time, until help arrives.....
Different strategy, sure. What you think, well you would be terrible noob 4v4 player

As far as how they are going to balance it, I do agree there. I can't see easy way to do it, with the way two factions are designed......

You are retarded, simple as that. If you think that 4v4 games are about strategy instead of spamming as many tanks or arty as you can then you have rocks in your head.

That's gonna hurt the game if true, because majority of people played 3v3's and 4v4's in COH and majority of multyplayer community is 3v3's and 4v4's gamers right now in coh 2....


How do I know, well I played 1v1 and 4v4's in COH and do the same in COH2.

For every 5 players searching for 1v1, there are 30+ searching for 4v4's. You wait 5-6+ minutes for 1v1 game... You wait 2-3 min tops for 4v4 game.

Taking into account waiting times and players searching, I would estimate there are 10x more people doing 4v4's than 1v1's

can't be smart move to neglect 9/10's of your gamers, Its business suicide from an ambush

Give me one piece of evidence to suggest that more players played 3v3 and 4v4 in CoH?? Besides your own biased opinion. Personally I think you are full of shit.

this argument really is pointless. im not going to touch the topic of what takes more strategy, but greendevil is correct that this game is mostly balanced for 1v1. theres just too many variables to account for in large team games, it becomes very difficult to balance for everything. it really doesnt matter if more people play 1v1 or 4v4.

The same nature that allows Strafe chaining in 2v2+, also allows for sufficient Quad production. AA may need some adjustment overall, but I think its in a pretty good place atm.

Strafe was already adjusted. Unless you are trying to argue that the Devs are idiots, it stands to reason it is now where its intended to be, rendering this thread null and void.

Strafe used to be patently ridiculous. Now it's just far too good for cost. I think the devs were right to adjust it down by degrees and reasonably didn't want to nerf it and increase the cost at the same time but that comparing it to propaganda artillery or something still suggests it's not exactly balanced against the other 120-150 muni offmaps.

Because it's undodgeable, it takes relatively little skill to use compared to other offmaps and there is very little you can do to avoid it through skill. Because it affects a big area and pins a variety of targets without any obvious priority, it can basepin effectively for a long time. Because it's very cheap and comes with the Opel Blitz truck, wasting it isn't a big deal, compared with the 240 muni heavy strafes both factions have.

@Woofdevil; while I agree that balancing 4v4 is impossible, I don't think that should extend to dismissing things which completely ruin that experience.

@Blovski: I dont agree with comparisons to heavy Strafes. Those are in a context of their own, due to penetration and dmg. For the same reason its not comparable to other bomb type offmaps.

It stands to reason, that since Strafe was already looked at and adjusted, it is now at its intended stats.

If anything, I think it could use a dmg reduction, since suppression overall is still overperforming in this game ie: I dont think suppression is being given high enough of a quotient, when considering its onfield and meta value.

Opel was also already adjusted, raising the premise that it is now also "as intended".

I agree that balance is achieved in small steps. But I dont agree that that would imply that individual units/abilities are not completely adjusted at a time. It just means not all units/abilities are adjusted at one time.

As to AA, iirc Pintle mounted MGs have a very low AA factor, and Ostwind/Quad are almost equal.
Seeing as Ostwind is much more expensive than Quad, in relation to the preponderance of aircraft call-ins, which Ost has more of, I think the equations balance out pretty good atm.

If opponent is spamming Strafes, you spam Quads. You thereby negate the Ost strategy, with the additonal benefit that Quads are also AI and reinforce points. For 120 Muni per Strafe, and 120 muni per Quad upgrade on the M5 that has 3x the frontal armor of 251, for the same cost, its "fine".

Quads vs Strafe is a net benefit situation for Sov. You negate Ost Muni expenditure, and that element of their chosen doctrine, with a nondoctrinal unit that has AI and reinforce capacity, and excellent survival and utility in comparison to its cost.

Its got nothing to do with what is smart for your business or how many people play a particular game mode. The problem is it's just NOT POSSIBLE to balance 3v3 and 4v4, those game modes are about who can spam the most units faster then the other team, simple. 1v1 and 2v2 actually have some strategy involved.

Uhm it's a strategy game so yeah,I think you need strategy whether you are playing 1 vs 1 or 4 vs 4...also I usually play 2 vs 2 or 3 vs 3...4 vs 4 is shit and at least one person is kicked in the beginning and 1 vs 1 finishes too quick and gives little xp

Give me one piece of evidence to suggest that more players played 3v3 and 4v4 in CoH?? Besides your own biased opinion. Personally I think you are full of shit.

Have you played 1v1 and 4v4 in COH1? If yes, you would know......

LOL, I think we can all say from your two posts who is biased here.

You think faction you don't seem to play is for idiots

and you also think that devs created coh for 1v1 only, but somehow ended up with this stupid 3v3 and 4v4 games, campaign and other things that they can't remove for some reason.

If you must know, people who only play campaign trump all 1v1 and 4v4' player by almost 5:1
Just ask Noun, he will confirm it for you.......

Go figure...

As Woof said you are right about 3v3 and up being very hard to balance, and COH wasn't ever fully balanced in that area either.

Rest of your post is just rage and bias anger

Im an outsider to 2v2, but I can see how that may infact be the most strategic and involved game mode, if you have a fpgood partner.

Its in the juicy middle ground where a certain degree of abuse is ok, but where that is mediated for by the fsctor that there are two independant peopke microing, leading to twice the mistakes vs twice the attention quotient.

I prefer 1v1, for its more direct cause->effect relation, but the interplay between partners isa seriously interesting gaming facet.

The question arises, what is its bottom line: 2 persons extremely interesting cooperation against 2 others vs does the games balance support it (ie: is it just exploiting the system to its max)?

I would argue that balancing for 2v2 is more than twice as difficult as 1v1. Its quadratically moreso.
Maybe in future, RTS will specifically design for 2v2+, as Mobas do now.

The nature of the best balance in CoH2, though, is vested in 1v1.

That doesnt mean though that two 2 teams cant equally exploit the fuck out of each other for an interesting match, particularly and especially considering the importance of the team cooperation element inherent in achieving that.

In 3vs3 or 4vs4, i would limit the number of some units relatively to the size of the map. Resource production could be also adjusted similarly as well as the global pop cap. Limiting global resource sharing could be also be a way.

I think there should be a higher cost the the strafe run or a higher cooldown time on 2v2 upwards. I played a game today where i had a su-78 perfectly supported by infantry and pushing forward, 2 strafe runs at the same time pin and murder my inf while two gren squads flank around the back fire a fuast each and leave my units as fish in the barrel for a PIV and OST

Sorry i might add that after this i couldnt move out of my base because of near constant strafe runs

At least they buffed the Soviet strafe,it was 240 munitions for a Recon Plane before