Sick/bored of MG42 -.-

So, Nullist are you accepting Strummingbird's premise? Or are you dismissing him? If you accept it, then why don't you just say so?

A) What premise, exactly.

B) Strummingbird and I agree, overall. But I have no idea what fucking premise you are referring to, or how that is relevant to you.

C) You don't speak for Strummingbird, nor does he speak for you. Dont presume to hijack his posts for your own purposes, unless you explicitly point out and quote what exactly you are referencing.

D) You have still not answered the question I put to you here:
http://www.coh2.org/topic/7676/sickbored-of-mg42-./post/75181

@Furyn and OZ:
Do you, or do you not, recognise that MG42 is squishier than Maxim due to 4/6 models?
Yes or no is sufficient.

Nullist just repeating himself over and over without actually adding anything to his argument. He's trying to push that everything is horrible just because one unit is different than another in terms of HP.

I kind of wonder how many games he's had time to play with the amount of posts he's made. I haven't played much due to life, but I got in 3 good games today, and *gasp* Germans won one by using units properly and supporting their MGs.

As for his other arguments, need to go reread all of them.

But frankly, the MG42 still works if used well. Two overlapping still works great. If anything, he needs to check his MG privilege.

Tl:dr- No point comparing the two- compare them in their roles. Survivability differences are there to balance their effectiveness relative to opposing factions, not to grant attribute equality to both sides.

This was the best post in thread.

@nullist ostheer weaponcrews have less models, no denying. Why? Designchoice. Why? Ask relic. Not satisfied with the official explanation? Contact them and or get them to explain it in this thread and or on their twitch stream. Think you made your point by now.

If anything, he needs to check his MG privilege.

Wtf is an "MG privilege".

Are you implying MG is somehow privileged?

@Furyn and OZ:

Do you, or do you not, recognise that MG42 is squishier than Maxim due to 4/6 models?

Yes or no is sufficient.

Of course it is. As there is no armour modifier on weapon teams squads the more men Maxim squad is more durable.
What you're missing is that MG42, with its bigger arc of fire is still a better performing unit than Maxim. It is easier to run a way from Maxims suppression field (more valunurable to flanking) that's why it supposed to have more men and be more durable.

What makes you think Im missing that.

Where have I said anything even remotely suggesting that.

If you're not then what's the point of your complains?
Sorry but smaller squads are irrelevant to how MG42 behaves on the field in current meta game.
25% increased damage was supposed to prevent MG42 from being to robust. We all have seen youtube videos in which Germans HMG teams behave like terminators. This is not the case anymore due to the recent patch.

How is 4/6 survival irrelevant?

Somehow magically the survival of a unit doesnt matter?

The survival of the unit is an integral factor to the meta.

There is an inherent and blatant bias in your position.

If you posit that MG42s behaved like terminators, and that was "bad", then what about Maxims, with 6/6 survival?

If MG42 where terminators in survival, then Maxims where EVEN WORSE.

How can you cite MG42 survival as "terminator", when its only a fraction of Maxims?

You don't listen, do you. Go through this topic again and you will find all the answers here.
All the whine here and on official forum shows how heavily Germans relied on MG play. I do realize that with changes of this magnitude adaptation takes time.
MG42 is only affected by 25% more damage intake when flanked. It's 25% damage not 25% less health as well.
Disproportion in squad size whas there from the beginning. How come it was not the issue before and now it is.

Disproportion in squad size whas there from the beginning. How come it was not the issue before and now it is.

It was, is and will continue to be an issue.

Or do you think that somehow squad survival is not a central and key balance issue?

Yes, but MG42 is still a better HMG than Maxim to offset that.

Yes, but MG42 is still a better HMG than Maxim to offset that.

How is it a "better HMG"?

Better arc of fire, better rate of fire, better pinning.
Maxim long range suppression is better now but MG will still pin you faster.
All that German players whining that MG42 is crap now are mostly bad player that relied heavily on MG42 in the past and now they have problems adopting the changes.
Had couple of games against decent Germans today and MG42 is still a powerful tool and great support weapon.

I thought you where reasonable and unbiased.

I see now I was wrong.

I shouldnt have bothered offering the benefit of the doubt.

Good.

So we have established and agreed that MG42s are squishier than Maxims, with only 2/3 their hp pool.

Now, why is that?
Why is MG42 squishier?

This has already been explained to you multiple times by various people all of whom you chose to ignore. I'd suggest going back and reading their answers as to why in actual games, this "squishiness" is a non-issue.

Dont worry, Ekko Tek.

The survival discrepancy will become a topic soon enough.

Dont worry, Ekko Tek.

The survival discrepancy will become a topic soon enough.

Germans have a very good unit called Grenadiers,you should try using them once in a while,they're very good,they have good accuracy from distance,and can shoot Panzerfausts and Rifle grenades,and are even upgradeable with a Lightmachinegun...
On a serious note now,STOP USING MG42 AS A SPEARHEAD UNIT...it's called SUPPORT WEAPON TEAM for a reason...
So you want to add 6 man to an MG42,which has a wider arc and better surpression...I wonder why did Relic did not recruit you?

Dont worry, Ekko Tek.

The survival discrepancy will become a topic soon enough.

The mg42 hits the field with more regularity than the maxim. It hits the field earlier than the maxim, and more often than not the mg42 engages the russian conscripts squad in the first minutes of the game near the middle of the map over a hotly contested point.

The reasons for this are as follows.

- German tier one is a stable option that most wehrmacht players build as tier 2 panzergrenadier rush is no longer a large part of the meta if ever it was.

- Soviet tier 2 where the maxim comes from has a very long build time for the actual building itself, delaying the arrival of an early maxim squad.

- The strength of the soviet mortar was a large part of the tier 2 strategies we saw months ago. It was then nerfed. The soviet tier 2 mortar can no longer assure maxim supremacy.

Added to this it is advised to many soviet players that they build conscripts en masse as it means that they can out capture the german player by running all over the map and harrassing the wide flank to snare easy cap points. This is one of the differences between the factions as the russian player has the option of tier 0 infantry riflemen. Tier 0 means he will have troops on the field faster than german tier 1. If the soviet gives up the tier 0 advantage they will lose momentum and the german units will reach the middle of the map relatively faster due to the addition of build time for the tier buildings and then the training of the troops. German tier 1 infantry play can circumvent many of these problems simply through providing a varied mix of units from the same tier 1 building whereas the soviet must choose between two clear paths. Support weapons or scout cars.

The factions are also designed to be asymetrical, that means "not the same". The reason they are not the same stats wise and why the MG42 has less health than the maxim is because the MG42 is likely to be fielded more often than not as most german players will build tier 1. Mg42's will be fighting predominantly conscript squads... *start reading from paragraph one until it makes sense*

I thought you where reasonable and unbiased.

I see now I was wrong.

I shouldnt have bothered offering the benefit of the doubt.

I didn't say anything that is unreasonable or untrue.
Didn't mean to be personal either. Sorry if I sounded like I was.

I don't even understand all this cries for "better MG42"s. Even a pure Grenadier opening is super strong and a Soviet anticipating MG42 and opening scout cars will always lose against that and even if you open Conscript spam against that, you have to be super slick with your timings and the read on your enemy.