Give me a reason why KV8 is OP?

Jump back to quoted post1 Sep 2013, 07:48 AMpantherswag

It's cause the KV8 is the soviets hardest counter to infantry, where it forces the German player to absolutely tech to armor or get demolished.

Jump back to quoted post1 Sep 2013, 08:00 AMRiggsen

bounces pretty much every german AT shot until panthers

can duke it out with a P4 when it switches guns

Jump back to quoted post1 Sep 2013, 08:00 AMRiggsen

bounces pretty much every german AT shot until panthers or heavy call-ins and can duke it out with a P4 when it switches guns (will lose slightly)

Jump back to quoted post1 Sep 2013, 07:10 AMPorygon

While I choose to faust it, whole gren squad dead, even vet 3
and having that massive armor?
seriously, but why? Why such a unit is designed like this?

If it is a meatshield stuff, it shouldn't be that strong in killing

Jump back to quoted post1 Sep 2013, 08:34 AMwooof

you want the reasons why its so good? it has 240 armor (su85 only has 180). its flamethrower deals 18 dps (for comparison, flamertrack only deals 4 dps with each gun, so 8 total if you can get both to fire on the same target). all flamethrowers ignore armor, so vet 3 squad means absolutely nothing. on top of that dps, flamethrowers also have a chance to kill entities instantly, even if they were at full hp. to top it all off, its only 20 gas more expensive than an ostwind.

Jump back to quoted post1 Sep 2013, 08:13 AMCruzz

Should I point out that a StuG is more likely to penetrate a KV8 than a t34 is to penetrate a PIV?.

It doesn't lose "slightly" against a PIV, even if you just duke it out sitting next to each other shooting (rather than, you know, circling around the much slower kv8) the PIV will still have half health left by the time it finishes with the KV8. And the PIV is a much cheaper, faster and versatile unit.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. The KV8 is, in a vacuum, an overpowered unit (almost purely because of retarded flame mechanics, which also affect other units like the flameht. Just those units are relatively soft compared to KV8). It's stuck in two relatively bad commander trees and is a slow pure anti-infantry vehicle for the faction that is far more reliant on fuel for antitank of the two. I see more games lost because the soviets make an KV8 when what they really need is an AT unit, than I see won by one showing up.

Jump back to quoted post1 Sep 2013, 09:12 AMRiggsen

How is the Stug v KV8 or T34 v P4 relevant?

Jump back to quoted post1 Sep 2013, 10:19 AMRiggsen

I haven't tried stug vs KV8, it has better reload time than a P4 but does it also have better penetration? P4 is definitely faster, but as you say we shouldn't look at units in a vacuum, and if KV8 has any support its unlikely you'll be able to circle it. Most of the time a P4 would trade shots with the KV8 frontally and it seems to deflect an awful lot. Which as I said is fine if it wasn't instagibbing infantry. I wasn't comparing it to P4 btw (which is pretty balanced now as a generalist tank), more just saying how P4 isn't really a counter to it. You meed Panther or Tiger or Elefant to have a real shot of taking it down. If you're looking at a role comparison of a hard AI and light AT, compare it to say an ostwind - which granted has great AA but thats rarely useful in 1v1 - and you can see what I mean.... Yeah its 40/20 more, but doesn't require teching. Ostwind can't ignore AT guns and AT grenades, infantry can get away easily, the KV8 is worlds in front.

Jump back to quoted post1 Sep 2013, 10:19 AMRiggsen

I haven't tried stug vs KV8, it has better reload time than a P4 but does it also have better penetration? P4 is definitely faster, but as you say we shouldn't look at units in a vacuum, and if KV8 has any support its unlikely you'll be able to circle it. Most of the time a P4 would trade shots with the KV8 frontally and it seems to deflect an awful lot. Which as I said is fine if it wasn't instagibbing infantry. I wasn't comparing it to P4 btw (which is pretty balanced now as a generalist tank), more just saying how P4 isn't really a counter to it. You meed Panther or Tiger or Elefant to have a real shot of taking it down. If you're looking at a role comparison of a hard AI and light AT, compare it to say an ostwind - which granted has great AA but thats rarely useful in 1v1 - and you can see what I mean.... Yeah its 40/20 more, but doesn't require teching. Ostwind can't ignore AT guns and AT grenades, infantry can get away easily, the KV8 is worlds in front.