PMD-6M

Tank hunting commander has these mines, and I do not see any sense in them, why do we need more useless mines than standard ones (yes cheaper, but less damage and temporary concussion)? If this commander is designed to tanks hunt, he needs specialized AT mines like the Wehrmacht AT Tellermine 42 or Riegelmine 43.

PMD-6M are actually OP. Use them to snare a tank and use AT assault grenades from cloak (or satchel)and you will see their value.

[Actually the whole doctrine is rather broken:
PTRS conscripts are OP (being one of the most cost efficient AT units)

For AT specialized doctrine the doctrine has too much AI:
Ambush Tanks
ML-20
Bomb strike

+3 PTRS/AT grenade assault, should be move to Penal (or the PTRS upgrade could be removed from Penals completely and we could all leave happily ever after)

Ambush should be back to CP5 and limited to SU-76/Su-85
First strike bonuses should come with veterancy

ML-20 should be replace with engineer kit providing faster repair and salvage...]

The primary benefit of the doctrinal mines is that they are cheap mines that you can lay down fadt, and are available at all infantry.

I don't know if I would prefer laying down 1 enginee mine over a doctrinal mine on a chokepoint. However on an open map I would consider laying 3 special mines over 1 normal mine over open field.

The cheapo mines are also occasionally useful if your enemy likes to spam indirect fire and is blowing up your mines, and creating craters for your cobscripts to ambush from in the process.

More crucially the doctrinal mine is only triggeed by vehicles. So, use thqt if you've wiped the enrmy pioneer squad and the enemy starts sweeping mines with their squads

The primary benefit of the doctrinal mines is that they are cheap mines that you can lay down fadt, and are available at all infantry.

I don't know if I would prefer laying down 1 enginee mine over a doctrinal mine on a chokepoint. However on an open map I would consider laying 3 special mines over 1 normal mine over open field.

The cheapo mines are also occasionally useful if your enemy likes to spam indirect fire and is blowing up your mines, and creating craters for your cobscripts to ambush from in the process.

More crucially the doctrinal mine is only triggeed by vehicles. So, use thqt if you've wiped the enrmy pioneer squad and the enemy starts sweeping mines with their squads

from the experience of the game on open maps, this mine shows itself the worst: stunning quickly, the damage is small, the tank is coming down. this mine is no more than a flash warning that on the flank someone that is

from the experience of the game on open maps, this mine shows itself the worst: stunning quickly, the damage is small, the tank is coming down. this mine is no more than a flash warning that on the flank someone that is

According to patch notes:
PMD-6M Mines
* Cost from 8 to 10
* No longer stuns vehicles; instead, slows vehicle movement and rotation by 50% for 8 seconds
* Can now be built by Penals and Conscripts

The Combo mine + ourah/AT grenade assault (ambush camo/first strike) or AT satchel is actually OP.

So Apparently using the Commander to its fullest is OP? The Fuck?

With the abundance of non-doctrinal cheese infantry Soviets have, complaining about cheap mines that can be spammed by all infantry wherever they go is rich...

So Apparently using the Commander to its fullest is OP? The Fuck?

So sturmtiger and stuka bomb were "using the commander to its fullest" and shouldn't have been nerfed ?

So Apparently using the Commander to its fullest is OP? The Fuck?

Compare the 4 man 340/75 AT stormtrooper with 6 man 240/75 AT Conscript (or the AT support Paratrooper) and you will see how they are OP.

Compare the 4 man 340/75 AT stormtrooper with 6 man 240/75 AT Conscript (or the AT support Paratrooper) and you will see how they are OP.

Nobody builds stormtroopers.

Nobody builds stormtroopers.

I occasionally build those with Stgs against maxim spammers to ambush them from behind and get free maxim.

But AT Stormtroopers ? Never ! Rather Pgrens with cloak

Nobody builds stormtroopers.

You prefer to compare them with the 4 man 340/140 camo PGs? you would still find them OP.

You prefer to compare them with the 4 man 340/140 camo PGs? you would still find them OP.

Would I? Try engaging any infantry unit with the at conscripts. In fact try flanking a recrewed mg with them and post your results.

Would I? Try engaging any infantry unit with the at conscripts. In fact try flanking a recrewed mg with them and post your results.

Are you seriously going to compare 2 AT infantry on the basis of how good they can flank a re-crewed hmg?

Do I really have to list why AT conscripts (and AT support paras) are better than Shreck PGs on the AT role (paras are actually better in most roles)?

Are you seriously going to compare 2 AT infantry on the basis of how good they can flank a re-crewed hmg?

Do I really have to list why AT conscripts (and AT support paras) are better than Shreck PGs on the AT role (paras are actually better in most roles)?

Yes, I am seriously going to compare their AI performance, on the basis that at conscripts have 0 AI. Thr upgrade even makes them lose access to the molotov upgrade. Just send any vet0 squad against them and sweep them off the field.
I am pretty sure that even the sniper can beat them in a a melee fight.

Yes, I am seriously going to compare their AI performance, on the basis that at conscripts have 0 AI. Thr upgrade even makes them lose access to the molotov upgrade. Just send any vet0 squad against them and sweep them off the field.
I am pretty sure that even the sniper can beat them in a a melee fight.

So according to that reasoning AT support paratroopers are Broken (the ability is actually OP) (or even AT Penals since they retain 66%). A 6 man squad that gets mines to snare, cloak/first strike bonus, great AT while remaining one of the strongest AI infantry (compared to other AT infantry).

Not to mention that paratroopers can pick a super-bazooka and still upgrade with an LMG making the best AI/AT infantry.

If the AI of an AT squad really mattered storm-troopers would be great, but as you pointed out, none uses them.


Conscripts can be spammed and flank hmg and on top of that can be upgraded to Tank hunter only in late game where they can excel at taking out any axis Heavy tank either buy chasing down or by ambushing it.

All that while being cheaper and having lower POP cost.

The effectiveness can be seen here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsRAYkVaA_Q&feature=youtu.be

From a design point of view Axis used to have better AT infantry while having worse AI in their tanks. Now they no longer have better AT infantry while their tanks still have worse AI.


Once more, any criticism originating from me, aim solemnly to Relic and Relic alone, which seem to be more interested in sifting the meta (commanders) than actually balancing the game.

maybe we should bring back pzschrecks to mainline inf and buff volks to heaven LUL

So according to that reasoning AT support paratroopers are Broken (the ability is actually OP) (or even AT Penals since they retain 66%). A 6 man squad that gets mines to snare, cloak/first strike bonus, great AT while remaining one of the strongest AI infantry (compared to other AT infantry).

Not to mention that paratroopers can pick a super-bazooka and still upgrade with an LMG making the best AI/AT infantry.

If the AI of an AT squad really mattered storm-troopers would be great, but as you pointed out, none uses them.


Conscripts can be spammed and flank hmg and on top of that can be upgraded to Tank hunter only in late game where they can excel at taking out any axis Heavy tank either buy chasing down or by ambushing it.

All that while being cheaper and having lower POP cost.

The effectiveness can be seen here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsRAYkVaA_Q&feature=youtu.be

From a design point of view Axis used to have better AT infantry while having worse AI in their tanks. Now they no longer have better AT infantry while their tanks still have worse AI.


Once more, any criticism originating from me, aim solemnly to Relic and Relic alone, which seem to be more interested in sifting the meta (commanders) than actually balancing the game.

How about some actual in-game footage where the tanks are properly supported by infantry? Even a single mine is "OP" vs unaccompanied tanks.

If you are sacrificing your actual vetted cons to completely deprive of the ai utility they bled to gain through veterancy, you are using them wrong. I haven't seen anybody ever use the commander anywhere near the way you describe. Ever.

How about some actual in-game footage where the tanks are properly supported by infantry? Even a single mine is "OP" vs unaccompanied tanks.

If you are sacrificing your actual vetted cons to completely deprive of the ai utility they bled to gain through veterancy, you are using them wrong. I haven't seen anybody ever use the commander anywhere near the way you describe. Ever.

How I personally use units is rather irrelevant to how Allied AT infantry compare to axis AT infantry.

In the video provided by blackcrows around minute 1 the elephant is supported by 2 AT PGs (who although they have superior AI) fail protect (it while in point blank range) before it loses around 1/5 of it HP, gets engine damage and dies to the bomb run.

While in the next clip the Elephant is support by an ostwind, a HMG, 2 Lmg grenadiers that fail to stop conscripts from unleashing a At grenade assault and finish off the elephant.

AT conscript lose 50% of their AI DPS the same as AT PG lose.

If in you opinion AT storm-troopers, AT PG and AT SP are more cost efficient that PTRS Conscripts and AT paratroopers, its fine by me. I simply have different opinion.

The PMD-6 mine is fine and does not need turned into a riegel mine.

How I personally use units is rather irrelevant to how Allied AT infantry compare to axis AT infantry.

In the video provided by blackcrows around minute 1 the elephant is supported by 2 AT PGs (who although they have superior AI) fail protect (it while in point blank range) before it loses around 1/5 of it HP, gets engine damage and dies to the bomb run.

While in the next clip the Elephant is support by an ostwind, a HMG, 2 Lmg grenadiers that fail to stop conscripts from unleashing a At grenade assault and finish off the elephant.

AT conscript lose 50% of their AI DPS the same as AT PG lose.

If in you opinion AT storm-troopers, AT PG and AT SP are more cost efficient that PTRS Conscripts and AT paratroopers, its fine by me. I simply have different opinion.

The PMD-6 mine is fine and does not need turned into a riegel mine.

that's not true actually cons can still hit infantry sometimes with ptrs so i would say they retain 70%