Out of all the unbalanced units in this game IS2 is one of the worst offenders. One of the best tanks in WW2 but in 95% of games it´s not used unlike Tigers, Panthers etc.
It had a 122mm gun and four machine guns (one of them a Dshk) but cant do anything in this game. Why does it have to be that way? Why not make the IS2 a somewhat realistic copy of the real-live IS2. Very high damage gun with good penetration even against heavy tanks but with long reload, mobility comparable to Tiger I but with slightly better armour.
Penals and Demos got nerfed, T34 got a price increase, maybe give IS-2 something in return? Even the ISU 152 is more useful than IS2 in lthe ive version of the game and it got buffed and the IS2 is just being left alone rotting away in uselessness.
BTW: the small 7.6cm gun of the panther deals 160 damage just as the 12.2cm gun of the IS2...this is insane.
Why is there no IS2 buff being discussed?
12 Nov 2017, 13:56 PM
#1
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
12 Nov 2017, 14:16 PM
#2
Posts: 1389 | Subs: 1
Imo IS-2 much better, than ISU-152. It is one of the best tanks for allies.
On the other hand i find weird that fact, that 122-mm D-25T(IS-2 main gun) deals 160 damage, and 8.8-cm L/71 (Tiger II main gun) deals 240 damage. In the same way 152-mm guns (ML-20 on ISU-152 and M-10T on KV-2) deals only 240 damage, and 12.8-cm gun/8.8-cm guns (Jagdtiger and Elefant) deals 320 (in WBP 300) damage.
On the other hand i find weird that fact, that 122-mm D-25T(IS-2 main gun) deals 160 damage, and 8.8-cm L/71 (Tiger II main gun) deals 240 damage. In the same way 152-mm guns (ML-20 on ISU-152 and M-10T on KV-2) deals only 240 damage, and 12.8-cm gun/8.8-cm guns (Jagdtiger and Elefant) deals 320 (in WBP 300) damage.
12 Nov 2017, 14:26 PM
#3
Posts: 2184 | Subs: 2
All the Soviet Heavy Tanks (KV-1, KV-2, KV-8, IS-2, ISU-152) are in very bad condition, yesterday enemy JagdTigr with HE shells killed more than 30 infantrymen, this is ridiculous JagdTiger even better than ISU-152 against infantry. I almost do not meet the Soviet Tanks in the game - it's expensive + inefficient.
12 Nov 2017, 14:33 PM
#4
Posts: 493
There's IS-2 in this game??? Wow, since when?!! Beginning, you say? Oh yeah, I remember now. So maybe because everybody forgot about it? Anyway, no chance for it. Lemme save time of balance team and fanboys and cite them.
balance > historical accuracy
Still useful. l2p, win fast.
You'll get Ele nerf.
P.S. In a good spot.
P.P.S. Scope.
realistic copy of the real-live IS2
balance > historical accuracy
Penals and Demos got nerfed
Still useful. l2p, win fast.
give IS-2 something in return?
You'll get Ele nerf.
P.S. In a good spot.
P.P.S. Scope.
mastered mode: 4v3 
drops > mates > rng > pathfinding > ??? > skill
drops > mates > rng > pathfinding > ??? > skill
12 Nov 2017, 14:37 PM
#5
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Imo IS-2 much better, than ISU-152. It is one of the best tanks for allies.
ISU 152 isnt every efficient in most games but at least it forces the enemy to react while the IS2 just doesnt have any significant impact on the game. Tiger I isnt much better either and needs to be buffed aswell.
At least Ele and Jagdtiger get their well deserved nerf.
12 Nov 2017, 15:09 PM
#6
Posts: 1954
Imo IS-2 much better, than ISU-152. It is one of the best tanks for allies.
On the other hand i find weird that fact, that 122-mm D-25T(IS-2 main gun) deals 160 damage, and 8.8-cm L/71 (Tiger II main gun) deals 240 damage. In the same way 152-mm guns (ML-20 on ISU-152 and M-10T on KV-2) deals only 240 damage, and 12.8-cm gun/8.8-cm guns (Jagdtiger and Elefant) deals 320 (in WBP 300) damage.
In some regards, you're talking apples and oranges. The KWK 43 had a lot higher muzzle velocity than the D-25T and could penetrate thicker armor. In real life, either of these would have one-shot any medium tank that they hit, but that wouldn't make for a fun video game. A good compromise might have been to give the D-25T a passive stun ability, so that anything hit but not penetrated couldn't respond for 1-2 seconds, including an increased reload time for the tank that was hit. At the end of the day, it is a video game, not a simulation.
12 Nov 2017, 15:17 PM
#7
Posts: 747 | Subs: 2
It's pretty good... however the current meta is pretty much against this doctrine.
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12 Nov 2017, 15:18 PM
#8
Posts: 647
its bad not because its a shitty tank, but its the only tank in the soviet army that you can put in the front to take hits, being so usually makes it the only target on the front.
the rest are pretty much cardboard tanks with somewhat decent firepower. which means to say, is2s can be easily focused down with enough guns pointing at it and the other tanks can easily be ignored and dealt with later once the is2 is dead, since medium tanks arent that powerful unless in a flanking position.
compared to german armies who can have panthers AND tigers/super heavies and at given a point can have at least a panther and tiger/KT/JT/elefants.
the rest are pretty much cardboard tanks with somewhat decent firepower. which means to say, is2s can be easily focused down with enough guns pointing at it and the other tanks can easily be ignored and dealt with later once the is2 is dead, since medium tanks arent that powerful unless in a flanking position.
compared to german armies who can have panthers AND tigers/super heavies and at given a point can have at least a panther and tiger/KT/JT/elefants.
12 Nov 2017, 15:28 PM
#9
Posts: 2066
It is only good once it gets vet 2. Vet 3 IS2 is a beast. But the problem is, once it hits the field in a 1v1, it will get eaten alive by pak walls with target weakpoint, vetted stugs with target weakpoint, and stuka loiters. Add to this the standard Tiger call in and guess what, the IS2 is useless. It also faces vetted JP4s, Command Panthers, invisible predator raketten wolf packs and the mighty KT.
I believe the FBP had some interesting veterancy changes for the IS2. But these got scrapped for now.
I believe the FBP had some interesting veterancy changes for the IS2. But these got scrapped for now.
Kappa
12 Nov 2017, 15:46 PM
#10
Posts: 2742
The IS2 and the Tiger I both come from a time and a game where there weren't stock tanks that dealt more than 160 damage.
The bells and whistles that accompany WFA factions and especially the British faction more or less have invalidated the 'ultimate' units of EFA.
The bells and whistles that accompany WFA factions and especially the British faction more or less have invalidated the 'ultimate' units of EFA.
Strategic Territory Points Mod:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
12 Nov 2017, 15:50 PM
#11
6 Posts: 328
At the very least they should give it a decent vet 1 ability. Maybe a high penetration shot for x amount of ammo.
12 Nov 2017, 16:11 PM
#12
Posts: 930
IS2 is in a delicate spot.
IMO the tank is not bad, just very cost ineffective, Axis have too much shit that can shut it down fast, a single panther can hold the IS2, things like stuka loiter will melt it.
I can see it making a comeback after all the changes from this patch, but only time will tell.
IMO the tank is not bad, just very cost ineffective, Axis have too much shit that can shut it down fast, a single panther can hold the IS2, things like stuka loiter will melt it.
I can see it making a comeback after all the changes from this patch, but only time will tell.
12 Nov 2017, 17:17 PM
#13
Posts: 1890 | Subs: 1
Yeah, IS2 itself isn't too bad it's just that StuGs and JP4s are so cost-effective at countering it that it's hard to use if your opponent goes for the proper hard counter. I do wish they'd test out the frag-shot Vet 1 ability for it again.
That being said the IS2 should be in a much better place post-DBP since a lot of it's counters are getting nerfed (no more Stuka-crits, Target Weakpoint nerf, JP4 nerf, etc). It's probably safer to not buff it in addition to that lest it get too good after all those nerfs.
That being said the IS2 should be in a much better place post-DBP since a lot of it's counters are getting nerfed (no more Stuka-crits, Target Weakpoint nerf, JP4 nerf, etc). It's probably safer to not buff it in addition to that lest it get too good after all those nerfs.
12 Nov 2017, 18:05 PM
#14
Posts: 206
IS2 is not that bad, but this guy have a point. 122mm gun doing the same damage as a 76mm gun is bullshit. A better damage gun will put IS2 in a good spot.
12 Nov 2017, 18:39 PM
#15
Posts: 911
Imo IS-2 much better, than ISU-152. It is one of the best tanks for allies.
On the other hand i find weird that fact, that 122-mm D-25T(IS-2 main gun) deals 160 damage, and 8.8-cm L/71 (Tiger II main gun) deals 240 damage. In the same way 152-mm guns (ML-20 on ISU-152 and M-10T on KV-2) deals only 240 damage, and 12.8-cm gun/8.8-cm guns (Jagdtiger and Elefant) deals 320 (in WBP 300) damage.
Don't forget the historically meh 76mm gun of they firefly doing 200-280 damage
Imagine my playercard is here
12 Nov 2017, 19:52 PM
#16
Posts: 4314 | Subs: 7
At the very least they should give it a decent vet 1 ability. Maybe a high penetration shot for x amount of ammo.
You are right, the ability is useless currently, epsecially for tanks like IS2.
But I remember a single match where I have won because my IS2 could cap a VP when both of us were running out of victory points. It was one of maaaaany matches I have played. I have used even valiant assault more times
12 Nov 2017, 20:02 PM
#17
6 Posts: 328
Yes, there can sometimes be very rare occasions when it can save the day.
I really liked the idea of giving the KV1 hull down as a vet 1 ability. Sure it's not an original ability, but it makes the KV1 much more interesting and useful.
Even now I'm amazed that after all those years, the maxim FINALLY have a vet 1 ability that is actually worth using.
I really liked the idea of giving the KV1 hull down as a vet 1 ability. Sure it's not an original ability, but it makes the KV1 much more interesting and useful.
Even now I'm amazed that after all those years, the maxim FINALLY have a vet 1 ability that is actually worth using.
12 Nov 2017, 20:10 PM
#18
Posts: 818
The last time this unit was really good was when you could get two of them and they came sooner. Since then the only stat change has been lower rear armor.
I believe it was never particularly good vs Ostheer and it was used primarily vs OKW (still had low fuel income). Because it could deflect shreks and fight panthers of equal number.
Since that time Stugs, OKW fuel income, Raketenwerfers, Ostheer t4 in general, the stuka at strafe have all improved
You have better and more common anti tank options. It's not super durable for that reason. It's main gun has poor accuracy vs infantry and you are often forced off before the pintle can do its work.
Better scatter, more HP, or a useful combat vet 1 ability could help.
VERY IMPORTANT: for similar reasons tiger 1 isn't what it used to be but still slightly better than the IS2 because of its mobility and superior scatter and reload(at the cost of 75 armor). the IS2 doesn't need major changes though probably just tweaks to help it catch up in the arms race.
I believe it was never particularly good vs Ostheer and it was used primarily vs OKW (still had low fuel income). Because it could deflect shreks and fight panthers of equal number.
Since that time Stugs, OKW fuel income, Raketenwerfers, Ostheer t4 in general, the stuka at strafe have all improved
You have better and more common anti tank options. It's not super durable for that reason. It's main gun has poor accuracy vs infantry and you are often forced off before the pintle can do its work.
Better scatter, more HP, or a useful combat vet 1 ability could help.
VERY IMPORTANT: for similar reasons tiger 1 isn't what it used to be but still slightly better than the IS2 because of its mobility and superior scatter and reload(at the cost of 75 armor). the IS2 doesn't need major changes though probably just tweaks to help it catch up in the arms race.
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12 Nov 2017, 22:05 PM
#19
Posts: 2458 | Subs: 1
Considering it seems to be the consensus that IS2 needs a buff maybe the balance team can do us a favour and take a look at it?
12 Nov 2017, 22:25 PM
#20
Posts: 1124
I said many months ago that the is2 needed a buff. Then someone replied saying I just said it to cover up my axis fanboyism.
Anyways, you don’t ever see this tank, it simply doesn’t compare to the usefulness of t34-85 spam/katushas. Falls under the tree of (X amount of cheaper medium tanks > 1 expensive heavy tank)
85s with mark target is a better choice. Especially when it comes to doctorine abilities
Anyways, you don’t ever see this tank, it simply doesn’t compare to the usefulness of t34-85 spam/katushas. Falls under the tree of (X amount of cheaper medium tanks > 1 expensive heavy tank)
85s with mark target is a better choice. Especially when it comes to doctorine abilities
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