Eastern Front Armies Revamp

Let's be honest here, brace is one of the biggest issues in the game. Just because it's not in your so called scope doesn't mean it shouldn't have been addressed.

Slot items
Receive accuracy penalty of -43%
This affects all slot items, including PPSH and PTRS

PPSH:
from 0.621/0.43/0.2 to 0.947646/0.65618/0.3052 (affected by a 43% accuracy penalty)

PTRS:
Guards PTRS (affected by a 43% accuracy penalty)

Veterancy
Vet0: Conscripts receive a passive -43% accuracy penalty on equiped slot items)
Vet1: Added a Received Accuracy modifier of 0.92 (new)
Vet2: Molotov range replaced with Molotov thrown speed
Vet3: Reduced Received accuracy modifier modifier from 0.6 to 0.707
Vet3: Added an accuracy modifier 1.15 (new)

So how does this work with slot weapons? the squad gets -43% received accuracy buff, but the gun (ppsh, ptrs, etc.) gets a 43% accuracy debuff? or is it something else?

Reduce duration of brace

Add delay of brace activation

Shit any changes to emplacements in general is what's needed.

Reduce duration of brace

Add delay of brace activation

Shit any changes to emplacements in general is what's needed.

Don't get me wrong I hate emplacements the way they are in this game but what they really need is a full overhaul. With those suggestions what is brace good for? Not avoiding arty or mortars anymore if there's a delay, and reducing duration might actually be frustrating for players who try and finish them off with infantry/light vehicles while they are braced.

Let's be honest here, brace is one of the biggest issues in the game. Just because it's not in your so called scope doesn't mean it shouldn't have been addressed.

Reduce duration of brace

Add delay of brace activation

Shit any changes to emplacements in general is what's needed.

This post is about the EFA revamp, not about "Brace triggers me".

This post is about the EFA revamp, not about "Brace triggers me".

OH my gosh really? I had no idea. Wow

Does the panther still have 0.5 moving accuracy? If it's meant to dive into enemy lines for opportunistic kills to separate it from the stug's sniper role, I kind of feel it should be less hit and miss to compensate for the risk/reward. Especially given the armour nerf in this mod. The low ROF should presumably still prevent it from being too damaging.

After reading through everthing, all the General changes seem great. Everything else, which seems like a whole lot of changes, seems worth testing for the fun of it. But at the same time, I am a little leery of overhauling EFA armies without being comprehensive with the other factions... Most of the changes you've outlined here seem alright, but I have some reservations about a number of them:

Conscripts
I get the rationale. The slot_item stuff seems needlessly complex though.

Demo charges
Stun and forced retreat seems unnecessary. Suppression, if anything would be more appropriate.

M3A1 Scout Car
I dunno, beefing it up like that just seems like asking for problems. Especially with how late OKW's panzerfaust is atm.

Guards Troops
Drop rate from 0.1 to 0.33...? Why not just revert them to prepatch performance, and then implement the slot_item purchasing changes?

DSHK and Maxim
Go nuts guys. Those have been a can of worms from the start. What about switching the DSHK and 120mm for the Maxim and PM-42? As in, DSHK and 120mm in T2, and the maxim and PM-42 as 0CP call-ins? Just a thought. Move the Sniper to T2 with all the attention Penals are getting.

All the other Soviet changes are more or less worthwhile changes. The volume of changes might make it hard to measure their individual impacts though.

Pak40 TWP
Definitely worth testing. May I suggest working the TWP shot to (maybe only) stop the tank in its tracks when it hits, forcing it to start moving again from a standstill? Sort of a thematic counter to Ram. But a tank at a standstill is the prime benefit of TWP.

Command P4 aura
I guess. At the same time supporting a teammate with an aura really shouldn't be discouraged IMO. I feel like there's got to be a solution to auras. If anything, perhaps a unique bonus for teammates that's straightforward and minor?

Panther
Interesting. I still feel like it needed an accuracy boost more than a damage boost. It's armor is what WOULD make it a particularly strong adversary for heavies, but it can't hit the broadside of a barn.

Tiger
They go in line with the changes to the IS2, so I guess they'll work... It's just you've got to consider that the issue with the Tiger has long been it's lack of durability. With these boosts to heavy tank damage, that shortcoming will be even more pronounced. Staying power is more what the Tiger needs.

Elefant
I guess there's no stopping this train... :| HE barrage seems... unnecessary and only to justify neutering it's ability to do its one job.

Spotting Scope
3.5 seconds seems entirely too long.

Everything else mentioned seemed worth a shot. I'll have to see if I can get some games in this weekend.

Interesting changes, most of them, and actually interested in seeing them in play, but there are a few things I would like to comment:

1) Demo charges: The changes it offers don't really make it worth it; I liked the idea that GG gave some time ago in a random video; that it can only kill like 2 or 3 models of every squad in a close area besides pinning them, at some medium range it insta pins and the furthest away it insta supressess. That way it's still a heavy punishing to blobs, even more if a player doesn't act fast.

2)Partisans: If I'm not mistaken, Partisans are some of the worst infatry on the game, they drop like flies in a firefight, and that's good they are not trained soldiers, but if you remove their cheese they will still need something to make those upgrades worth, as AT partisans will get heavily focus once they are detected, same with AI partisans. Maybe a bit more utility in the recon area could work, or some form of better cloak.

3)Pak 40: The TWP nerf is a bit extreme, I get it on the stug, but on the Pak40 seems a bit extreme, besides all ATs have some form of extremely useful abilities, USF even has two that work well on tandem. I think the full stun on the Pak40 is fine, if it has to be nerfed, reduce the stun duration but make it so it has some lasting effect, like a short mark on the vehicle.

4) Command Panzer IV: These nerf seems a bit unnecesary, maybe in bigger team modes it gets absurd when a whole axis army gets defensive bonuses, but the Command PIV is not that good of a combat vehicle, isn't possible to allow it to still give bonuses to allies but the defensive bonus is lees for the units not owned by player who has the Command PIV?

seems pretty decent. maybe demo should get more aoe to suppress more squads. and kv2 and isu better?

when can we try these changes

when can we try these changes

right now he linked to the mod in the post

OH my gosh really? I had no idea. Wow

Then why'd you bring it up out of nowhere? Lol save the sarcasm for when it's justified.

Does the panther still have 0.5 moving accuracy? If it's meant to dive into enemy lines for opportunistic kills to separate it from the stug's sniper role, I kind of feel it should be less hit and miss to compensate for the risk/reward. Especially given the armour nerf in this mod. The low ROF should presumably still prevent it from being too damaging.

Comet and cromwell both have 0.5 moving accuracy. Doesn't bother me that much. Just stop the damn tank before it shoots, or use hold fire. You don't even have to flank with the panther anyway so that should make it much easier.

seems pretty decent. maybe demo should get more aoe to suppress more squads. and kv2 and isu better?

I think that would be a fair change to demos seeing as they are 90 muni and are technically getting nerfed even if it is for consistency reasons.

Hey everyone!

With the way things are currently going as we wait for GCS to chug along and waiting for the powers that be to grant us permission to begin work once again, the Balance Team has been doing some work on the side to try and work on certain issues and get them tested as we remain on stand-by.

Given that the main factions we want the others to follow are the EFA, we began working on them first and resolving their issues to see how it affects the rest of the game before we work on WFA and Brits.

Down below is a list of changes separated between Soviets and Ostheer.

You can also grab the changes here: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=929737693

Any feedback and criticism is welcome!

General

Show Spoiler

Most of the changes look good on paper. It would be nice to see all call-ins to be build but short of that then the 25% penalty ok. I think the Ost Panther buff might entice some people to actually build it, and also like that T4 doesn't have to be researched. The Brummbar nerf might let anti-tank guns live long enough to do something against it.

The only thing that sticks out as questionable is the change of manpower for fuel on the ML-20 and B4. This change will probably make sure that it is never built again. The biggest problem with the ML-20 and B4 is the stuka dive bomb wiping it. The price increase on the dive bomb might help, but probably not.

The second problem with Soviet arty is the cumulative changes. The old six-shell ML-20 was great. If someone blobbed, it was only a matter of time before you could punish them severely for it. The larger AOE also meant that you could fire it into an armor charge and help blunt the charge, maybe even stop it. The new model, with more shells but a much smaller AOE is mostly just good against OKW trucks.

The ML-20 would be much better if the cost was cut from 600 to 300, the shells cut from 8 to 4 (half damage, half cost), pop-cap from 15 to 10, and a limit of 2 howitzers. Alternatively, restore the old AOE but cut the number of shells to 2 or 3. This would make them much more accessible in small game modes without buffing them into something that is game breaking.

Note that two of them would fire as many shells as one of the old ones, but cost 20 pop-cap so it kind of nerfs them in terms of damage/pop cap but I don't think too many players would complain. In fact, I bet most players would agree with this and limiting all indirect fire units to 2 each (this would require the Priest to be changed so that it can't be decrewed).

Ok a few things. FHQ has no aura just tested it, was horrrrriible god damn. booby trap is a waste its super garabge for a doctrine trap change it back and make it cost 120. m42 atgun is alot better. su76 is alot worse with less deflection should get cost lowered maybe. barrage misses to much to even matter. t70 nice change hills dont get in way of shots. b4 howi missess waay to much still. needs better accuracy and was the dmg lowered? seems garbage when it hit plus no AOE.. sad. demo charge sucks hard now. shocks are a little better with cheaper smoke. zis nice change in good spot. partysains dont feel worth it to ambush imo. while thing like falls can nade a katy asap. is2 feel better shoulda been like this a long time ago. for mother russia change was big nerfs but needed, i think lower cost to 90 muni.

b4 howi should be 2 shells 400and more aoe, FHQ needs aura back dont see wat was wrong with it. its really easy to kill buildings.. add 2 more secs of vision on trip wire. demo charge needs more aoe. i was dropping guards weapons every encounter.

Looking over this list there are many good things that look like they would be alright. However there are many changes that I immediately have issues with, so I will mention them.

Callins. I completely agree they need to be addressed, in my op

pak 40. Nerfing twp seems like a horrible choice. IF there is an issue you could make the point that it'


ost tech. i think everyone agrees that ost t4 needs to be addressed HOWEVER, making t3 cost nothing is not the way to go. Ost teching is by far the best designed tech in the game. The ability to skip building tiers while still having to pay for research leads to by far the most fluid and diverse strats. t4 needs to be addressed but messing with the tech structure of ost itself would be a tragedy.


ost panther. the panther does need a rework, badly. I don't want to see a vet rework though ie 2 and 3 swapped. One of the best aspects of EPA is the consistency they offer. ost armour get skirts at vet 2 thats how it works, don't mess with this, more randomization is not good there are many other ways to rework the panther.

elephant. Why on earth are we messing with this unit to make it less of an at specialist? I get that it doesn't have a lot of 1v1 draw but tweaking it to make it somehow have utillty with and he barrage would be silly. tbh I don't see why this is being messed with right not. not when tommies still cost less than grens to reinforce.

ziz barrage. 35 mu barrage is just asking to get spammed even more so with dam increase.

maxim. can we just see the maxim returned to pervious live patch but retain the set up break down times? the unit was supposed to be good vs single squads hence the small ark. now its just in a weird place. for real just change it back.

again many good things, but these stand out is badly out of place.to be completely honest I don't feel like the road the balance team is going down is the most beneficial for coh2. At this point we should be addressing balance issues rather than looking for large scale restructuring of factions. example: proposed partisan fix would solve the issue of cheesey partizan snares but why not just make all infiltration units spawn with nade cooldown? cheesy wipes and snares across game fixed, easy, less work. I appreciate the amount of thought and work you guys put into the game but I feel that we should be looking for simple fixs that help iron out the game rather than large reworks. I think the community would rather see a balanced game rather than a massive rework of all the factions. given that coh2 is almost 5 years old realistically simple solutions seem to be the best in my mind.

exactly this.....+1

I can't understand how you came up with the idea that spotting scopes and panzer tactician require usage delays. The spotting will be completely useless on the tanks with fixed turrets since they they have to move to face the enemy. The panzer tactician has always been used as a purely defensive tool to get tanks out of tough situations and could be countered with attack ground, now they are useless. By the time you need them they will come too late. Compare them to the USF smoke which can be fired aggressively and defensively and are non doctrinal (although do require more micro. I always saw these two abilities something that made Ostheer unique since it had no other tank repair abilities. I feel like these changes are just throwing two more abilities to the pile of useless abilities ostheer already has.
Oh and TWP for stug and pak40 are now useless with half dmg. Should remain at 160 for what they do.

tried elephants i like the new barrage ability its real nice, rieger mines own for the price nice change maybe a little to cheap maybe 50 will be more balanced. tiger ace is still super strong killed to many tanks chasing them with strong damage and long sight range. i really like pwerfers speed now i missed the suppress but this is just as good. my brummy cant penetrate every shot vs medium armor n e more , panther is a beast now. press stop when u shoot and u wont miss much. pgrens mark target is great i love the change vets to fast to imo and i was getting chase down kills like crazy. nice bunker change alot more safe. ambush camofor werh is way better then soviets. more speed is better dunno why its like that. spotting scope wasnt to great

I kind of disagree with the way you guys buff Cons, it's now excessively complex with 43% accuracy debuff when? On slot items? On just vet 0? What? I agree with normalizing DPS, but not slapping on a accuracy debuff unless you guys show that Cons actually go magically worse on vet 0 with items.

Partisans are still useless past their infil role, so a received accuracy decrease would be appropriate and ability to upgrade weapons immediately after spawning and from anywhere on the map regardless of owned territory.

Also disagree with cost increase when no tech is built, it should be NO CALLINS AT ALL. Make them affect all factions and boom, no more callin cancer meta.