Teamgame dominant meta

Stuka dive bomb only kills something if you are deaf or braindead - you can't use them in base anymore so there is no way to wipe a blob with it.

No need to be deaf. the sound can not be played if there is many other sounds played around at the same time. It happens to me, I was right on the spot but I couldn't, nor my teammate, hear the sound.

I really don't know why is it difficult to add the red smoke like for other off map calls.

No need to be deaf. the sound can not be played if there is many other sounds played around at the same time. It happens to me, I was right on the spot but I couldn't, nor my teammate, hear the sound.

I really don't know why is it difficult to add the red smoke like for other off map calls.

Or make it like other Ju 87 abillitites. When bomb was delivered from offmap by plane, which you can see on the minimap.

Even UKF air supremacy shows planes on the minimap. Doesn't matter, that they can't be shooted down.

I can hear the stuka dive bomb in 1v1's and 2v2's and is easy to dodge, but in team games with all the explosions going on i struggle to hear it and by the time i release its coming its too late.

+1 to the suggestion about showing the plane on the minimap for the dive bomb, i think thats a good idea

why should a Pilot warn u with a signal befor drop the bomb? the pilot search alone his targets. no scout need to mark a tarket.

ask yourself why u have only 2 sec to react after see a red smoke on the ground till circle planes kill all of squads/ tanks.

So ... Soviet pilots are very polite? They throw a smoke signal when they drop the FAB-500 bomb and PTAB. Plus IL-2 can be shoot down before he drops bombs

So ... Soviet pilots are very polite? They throw a smoke signal when they drop the FAB-500 bomb and PTAB

noob. They need the mark on the target, cause the the drop it from huge height.

a diving bomb will be drop by the pilot...by a dive onto the target. he drops it when he is shure it will hit the target:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86xuX4MPugE

noob. They need the mark on the target, cause the the drop it from huge height.

a diving bomb will be drop by the pilot...by a dive onto the target. he drops it when he is shure it will hit the target:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86xuX4MPugE

Sigh, Jesus. Have you heard of free hunting? This is when the II-2 Link take off and destroy what they consider appropriate? Plus PTAB bombs were thrown without a target designation.

So ... Soviet pilots are very polite? They throw a smoke signal when they drop the FAB-500 bomb and PTAB. Plus IL-2 can be shoot down before he drops bombs

noob. They need the mark on the target, cause the the drop it from huge height.

a diving bomb will be drop by the pilot...by a dive onto the target. he drops it when he is shure it will hit the target:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=86xuX4MPugE

Sigh, Jesus. Have you heard of free hunting? This is when the II-2 Link take off and destroy what they consider appropriate? Plus PTAB bombs were thrown without a target designation.

Red smoke is one of the rules of the game since vCoH. Assault abillity marked with red smoke to give the opponent a chance to dodge it.

Stuka Dive Bomb don't follow several rules of the game:
1. It doesn't marked with red smoke like other assault abillities.
2. It doesn't deliver the bomb from offmap on the plane, like other planes bombing abillities.
2.1 Can't be countered by Anti-air defence.

IMO solving this exceptions will make this abillity less frustrating and OP in some situations.

Sigh, Jesus. Have you heard of free hunting? This is when the II-2 Link take off and destroy what they consider appropriate? Plus PTAB bombs were thrown without a target designation.

pls show us the abilty "free hunting" for planes in coh2.

Can we just stop with the "Muh realism!" shit now? The StuKa dive bomb should receive flares like any other bombing run, then we have to see if it is still OP, and then it should be decided if further nerfs are needed.

Raising both the cost and adding flares at the same time bears the risk of making the ability useless (especially on a faction like Ostheer, where ammo is always scarce during the entire match), which would make fighting against emplacement spam impossible in the current state of the game.

Red smoke is one of the rules of the game since vCoH. Assault abillity marked with red smoke to give the opponent a chance to dodge it.

Stuka Dive Bomb don't follow several rules of the game:
1. It doesn't marked with red smoke like other assault abillities.
2. It doesn't deliver the bomb from offmap on the plane, like other planes bombing abillities.
2.1 Can't be countered by Anti-air defence.

IMO solving this exceptions will make this abillity less frustrating and OP in some situations.

Exactly, this is a design error, all abilities should be highlighted with smoke. To melt this error, it took many, many years

intresting thing: if allies get a " design error" its ok (emplacments with brace)

if axis have maybe one...it should be removed.

That could be a nice idea. At the same time, however, this possibility already exists, and it comes with cool animations too! It's called Hull Down

If you had ever used Hull Down, you would know why they are not the same: Hull down prevents any vehicle movement, including turning the vehicle. Which makes it inherently useless in most cases on the Elefant, because (surprising to you perhaps) it doesn't have a turret.

The CoH1 ability still allowed the vehicle to turn.

intresting thing: if allies get a " design error" its ok (emplacments with brace)

if axis have maybe one...it should be removed.

They have two at least (Tiger Ace)

It is not constructive to justify design issue with proof-point "There is another design issue from the other side".

All design issues should be solved. One or two pages ago i have talked with vasa about soviet democharge. It is design issue too and should be solved, doesn't matter, to which faction it belongs. Stop this war between allied fanboys and axis fanboys.

I believe, every issue prevent to make this game fun and interesting. And every solved issue, doesn't matter which faction has it, makes this game much better.

I sense a great disturbance in the force. It feels like some of suggestions made by the mod team are going to destroy 1v1 and 2v2.

Stuka dive bomb only kills something if you are deaf or braindead - you can't use them in base anymore so there is no way to wipe a blob with it.

Damage nerf is simply stupid because the JT/elefant are suppose to counter the bullshit super-heavy with ridiculous amount of health - if you want to nerf damage, then nerf the IS2/ISU armor or health as well, or you have to decrease the reload time (it's 8 sec!! how can you not get away?)

Damage nerf could be compensated with a reload speed boost to keep JT/Elefant powerful vs slow moving heavies.

What I, personally, find unacceptable about Ele/JT is the alpha-strike and how they 2-shot medium armour (including TDs). This is a similar issue to Fireflies & Tulips (especially release-time Fireflies).

The Crocodile might have to be changed at some point for 1v1 reasons alone (we just have to see where 1v1 meta migrates, and how it feels).

I sense a great disturbance in the force. It feels like some of suggestions made by the mod team are going to destroy 1v1 and 2v2.

Can you identify any single change that has a non-positive impact on 1v1/2v2?

No need to be deaf. the sound can not be played if there is many other sounds played around at the same time. It happens to me, I was right on the spot but I couldn't, nor my teammate, hear the sound.

I really don't know why is it difficult to add the red smoke like for other off map calls.

that's a bug. It happens.
it has nothing to do with the stuka sound - usually it's REALLY FUCKING LOUD, as loud as I can hear it from half a map away

Damage nerf could be compensated with a reload speed boost to keep JT/Elefant vs slow moving heavies.

What I, personally, find unacceptable about Ele/JT is the alpha-strike and how they 2-shot medium armour (including TDs). This is a similar issue to Fireflies & Tulips (especially release-time Fireflies).

The Crocodile might have to be changed at some point for 1v1 reasons alone (we just have to see where 1v1 meta migrates, and how it feels).

Obviously YOU HAVE TO.
Allies have plenty of stock heavy-hitting TDs and Soviet in particular has plenty of super heavies to specifically counter Axis mediums/panther - and the only reliable way to counter those with 60/70 range is elefant/JT - or maybe it's time you give Axis something AT tank that is not 10 range short.

Ele/JT alpha strike does shit-ton of damage yes, but that only happens every 8s, and ONCE you know an Ele/JT had been built, you will know to avoid it until you make a big push against it.

And I personally don't think 2 shotting true-medium is of any issue.
By the time they hit the field it's at least 35 mins into the game, those mediums had ~20 mins to wreck enough havoc to make themselves worthwhile, or you have accumulated enough mediums to counter a heavy.

As far as I can see, this is one of those "phase transition" that was designed into the game - for example, lights become obsolete when medium hit the field and so on.

Croc is plain bullshit. It's an anti-everything unit with heavy armor and free blitz.

The problem with the static arty units is they are already uncounterable on certain maps (crossing, trois ponts). if you buff its health or something, i predict: mortar pit 2.0 --> constant arty shells in your base you can do nothing against. My assumption for its counter is then just 2 people going Jäger armor/CAS to drop 2 stuka strikes at once which will lead to even less commander variety

the stuka strike is actually ok for what it does. however, since it is so precise and good at what it does, it should cost more. I suggest 250 ammo. then you would have to spend 80+250=340 Muni to kill an arty piece

which is a reasonable price imo. this also means less rifle nades or flamers against the soviet player which is also a big advantage

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for a similar reason demos are ok, too. if you're so lazy to send minesweepers in unguarded areas, you deserve to be punished. also what's the big gain of this game to encourage running around with single squads everywhere on the map? that's what DoW is there for. One of the best things about coh2 was that it provided more frontline based gameplay. Stupid things like that +16fuel point on the right side on Sturzdorf in coh1 (where you had to harrass all the time with single squads) are almost gone etirely

The problem with the static arty units is they are already uncounterable on certain maps (crossing, trois ponts). if you buff its health or something, i predict: mortar pit 2.0 --> constant arty shells in your base you can do nothing against. My assumption for its counter is then just 2 people going Jäger armor/CAS to drop 2 stuka strikes at once which will lead to even less commander variety

the stuka strike is actually ok for what it does. however, since it is so precise and good at what it does, it should cost more. I suggest 250 ammo. then you would have to spend 80+250=340 Muni to kill an arty piece

which is a reasonable price imo. this also means less rifle nades or flamers against the soviet player which is also a big advantage

For howitzers, we could also experiment decreasing their range a bit, along with the price change. However, that's too far down the list.

I think it's good design to have a hard-counter ability handy for the maps where howitzers can be too nasty. The hardcounters, as you indicate, have to be expensive enough to keep howitzers useful for all stages in the game. 250MU is a good price for that; not too expensive, nor too cheap.

Ideally, every faction should have at least 1-2 abilities that can fit the bill. Ostheer, in particular, also has railway artillery, which is cheap enough, which also does that. What makes Stuka Dive bomb so controversial however, is that nearly all the commanders that have it (except Storm) are already carried by the other abilities in the same commander.
- Jaeger Armor commander definitely doesn't need that ability
- CAS & Luftwaffe support should be better defined through their unique abilities, rather than let Dive Bomb dominate everything

Therefore, the question that arises is:
- Should Jaeger Doctrine, with the Elefant, also possess the hardcounter for Howitzers (Recon & Dive Bomb)?
- If we nerf Dive Bomb, should we compensate the other doctrines in some way (e.g., replace Dive Bomb with Railway arty for Storm, so that it's more similar to Soviet Combined Arms)

This problem is also present in a smaller scale at the IL-2 & ISU-152 commander. The reason why it's not so obvious is because ISU-152 is extremely map dependent (hills matter). IL-2 could use with a price increase for that reason.

The reality is that when you enter a team, the team has to come up with commander combos that make sense. With the changes, we just want to eliminate super-commanders (Jaeger Armor Doctrine) to give breathing room to more varied combos.