Conscript Upgrade Concept

Currently Conscripts are the only faction with no upgrade for their core infantry. Grenadiers and Sections have Light Machine Guns, Riflemen have Automatic Rifles, and now even Volksgrenadiers finally live up to their name with Sturmgewehrs. Conscripts still have nothing without doctrines, an effect of CoH2's old design of forcing the Soviet Army to rely 50% on their doctrine. More recently CoH2 has seen sweeping changes including the mentioned Volksgrenadier redesign, and the Soviets can access all of their Army. So here's my concept for Conscripts. This doesn't focus on the intricacies of balance, just design.

Conscripts will start out normal as they do every game. Once T3 is reached, an upgrade will be available in that building. The upgrade will outfit all Conscript squads, old and new, with three PPSh-41 Submachine Guns. These PPSh's will be unique among SMG's in that they will not reduce DPS at any range, only increase it at closer ranges. I'd imagine it would have a similar damage curve (Not DPS) to the Thompson. When the upgrade is purchased, instead of showing the PPSh weapon icon, all Conscript Squad icons will change to this:




That will allow you to still see what other weapons you have picked up or upgraded, instead of being hidden by a PPSh icon. This would support the role of Conscripts as aggressive close-mid range units without hindering their alternative role as long-range defenders from cover. As for the Commander ability, replace it with an SVT-40 upgrade similar to Panzerfusilier's G43's, 3 semi-automatic rifles that are useful, but not too strong.

Anything that will make them useful... Ppsh, DP-28, SVT, wooden stick, slingshot... Just make them true mainline infantry.

Anything that will make them useful... Ppsh, DP-28, SVT, wooden stick, slingshot... Just make them true mainline infantry.

Giving them a PTRS upgrade by default would make Tank Hunter, the new Penals and Guards useless.

Giving them a DP28 package would make Guards useless.

Giving them a PPSH package by default would require Relic to actually put their minds into play and try to figure out what to replace all of the commander abilities with and would make Shocks obsolete EXCEPT for their armor since they'd basically be getting semi cheaper shocks.

Adding ANY weapon upgrades to them by default would mean making them cheaper and thus superior to their doctrine counterparts.

So changes need to happen to both parties, not just cons, in order to make them more useful sadly/

It would make Shocks obsolete EXCEPT for their armor since they'd basically be getting semi cheaper shocks.

Not really, Shock Troops are for up close and personal. They've got an assault role rather than an infantry role.

The only way I see in changing conscripts in so they are more unique for when the soviets already have a large variety of infantry, is to make them more closer to ostruppen. It would also be more thematic with the soviets style. Would this be balance, it could be. Similar to ostruppen into panzergrenadiers. This could be conscripts into penals/guards/shocks/more conscripts.

top players in casts i've seen seem to make cons work.

Top players play with penals/guards and 1-2 cons or dont play soviets MVGame

I'm in favor of a non-doctrinal global PPSH upgrade but I think it should apply to ANY soviet infantry including Engineers, Penals, Guards (they should spawn with 6 Mosins and be choosing either DP-28's OR PTRS) and so on. This way we could let Penals keep the choice of Flamethrower or PTRS and have a global option of PPSH.

I also think it should simply unlock the upgrade for each squad and cost 0 muni per unit like normal so you aren't forced into having an only close range army.

Soviets are one of the strongest factions, have been for ages.

Buffing cons with no downside seems like a strange choice.

Imagine oorahing cons spam all with ppshs and backed up by guards or AT partisans.

Lenny would would shit himself with delight...

Remember when in DoW 1 you could upgrade your Guardsmen with different leaders and each one would change the unit stats?

Don't know, veteran sargeant, political officer, tankhunter sargeant, assault specialist etc. Maybe make these upgrades doctrinal replace the doctrinal ppsh and ptrs so that this officers buff conscripts upgraded in that direction (tankhunter to penals upgraded with ptrs, assault specialist to ppsh cons, etc)

No, just no. What cons need is a rework on everything. In my vision cons were supposed to be what rifleman were in CoH 1, an inferior infantry that got much better with upgrades and veterancy.

also, molotovs need some serious fix, the animation and range is just awful.

Soviets are one of the strongest factions, have been for ages.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, no.

Best idea I've seen is giving an upgrade at the base hq for ppshs. Once researched (200mp 45 fu) cons can upgrade to 3x ppshs just like many commanders currently do. They would also have to buy these ppshs for 40 munis like it is currently, but the upgrade at the hq just makes these unlockable for all conscripts.

The only problem with this is that many commanders currently have the ppsh unlock ability, a good way to replace the ability is to have these commander unlock the ppsh upgrade for free once the required amount of CPs are reached.

I'd rather see more things to focus on Conscript survivability and cheapness which suits the unit.

If I had to add an upgrade, it would possibly be adding two additional conscript squad members for no additional population or it conscripts reinforce is 2 for every 1 reinforce like IG in DoW II when they had their squad leader upgrades.

Making them cheaper to reinforce end game, would probably be enough however. Let everything else do the killing with conscripts doing all the support stuff and eating bullets for cheap.

The only faction without a non-doctrinal automatic weapon is a foolish design...

Still waiting for molotov buff

I also think it should simply unlock the upgrade for each squad and cost 0 muni per unit like normal so you aren't forced into having an only close range army.

These PPSh's will be unique among SMG's in that they will not reduce DPS at any range, only increase it at closer ranges.

Hate it when people don't read.

If I had to add an upgrade, it would possibly be adding two additional conscript squad members for no additional population or it conscripts reinforce is 2 for every 1 reinforce like IG in DoW II when they had their squad leader upgrades.

Eight man squads sounds extremely broken though. CoH has never gone over 6, and there's a good reason for that. Nothing in the game is balanced to combat or suppliment an eight man squad. Actually getting a squad wipe on an eight man squad would also be stupidly hard to do.

Still waiting for molotov buff

Units do not actually weapon upgrades to remain useful.

Buffing soviet core unit patch by patch will lead to mmore nerf to soviet call in.

Making all the faction similar make the game less interesting

Finally if they do get a weapon upgrade it should not be 3 ppsh that perform as bolt action rifle max range...

Weapon profile was a great improvement for the game and it should be followed when possible, and it this case it rather simple to followed.

One could simply allow a 6 svt upgrade for them if there was an actual need for a weapon upgrade. They would have to be weaker than the one Penal use but they would still be semi auto and not smg that are equal to bolt action at max range.

my suggest is buff their rifle a little bit perharp damage per shot perharp accurate. anyone feel in same way like me that IS , volk and gren doing pretty fine with their own rifle in late game but if we have to mention USF too then perharp this unit doing fine as flanker but what about later on from early game ? will BAR become must pick weapon for them but USF not the problem so let get back to con lol... somehow like i said there is somthing wrong with con in late game which i can't tell how

Conscript could trade ourah for decisive ability (timed costing mu maybe similar to Hit the dirt) that would increase their RA and their accuracy at max range. (then the should also have molotov replaced by a normal grenade and the AT grenade have increased range)

That would help them lose less bad to lmg gren when in cover.

In this way they would be solidified as defensive infantry opening they for penal to be an offensive one.