Schwerer Flak Truck Balance ideas

I wanted to get peoples opinion on this because the Schwerer Flak Trucks gun is something that I and many other people agree is over preforming.

The Guns amazing AA capabilities are very problematic because it can sometimes down planes in a matter of seconds which can often lead to game winning results because you can force your opponent to first waste hundreds of munitions and then make it dang near impossible for more air abilities because the range of the guns AA is very wide.

Whats even more important in my opinion is how this Gun can completely eliminate flanking maneuvers and it can sometimes force you to retreat a tank while chasing down a wounded panther because its penetration is high enough to pose a very real danger to many allied tanks and of course it can be an incredibly annoying camping enabler because any indirect fire units placed in the guns arc of fire are basically invulnerable to all attacks from infantry.

Now I realize that there is a lot of risk in placing this unit forward because its high cost ad tech status but unless you are playing as the British or you have howitzers this Gun is very hard to deal with.

So I think that this thing needs to be toned down because right now it eliminates a lot of strategies and encourages dumb a move battles and it simply does way to much for something that is free. So I think the solution is to either make this gun an expensive side tech or at the very least make it less effective vs tanks or planes or both.

(Also dont try to use the Bofors to justify this because one broken unit does not justify the existence of another I think the Bofors needs to be changed as well but I think the Schwerer HQ gun is more important because it requires no side tech and the faction it is in is more aggressive)

ALL aa guns should have less pen. even bofors can pen KT somehow
schwer easily destroying T34

and so on, this is beyond bearable.

Really, it's fine.

You speak about the truck removing strategic avenues. I challenge you to present such avenues being anything more than a curiosity in Wehrmacht match ups.

Really, it's fine.

You speak about the truck removing strategic avenues. I challenge you to present such avenues being anything more than a curiosity in Wehrmacht match ups.

Well obviously its an OKW unit so it would be absent in a 1v1 Wehrmacht match up however it closes strategic avenues because it mostly eliminates the possibility of flanking with infantry and it even effects the movements of armor and these problems are even greater in team games. Its simply too much to have a unit that is capable of fighting anything but heavies with no teching cost.

Like what now? If you position the truck forward as was customary in the days of yore, you lose it and you lose the game with it. Its not very potent, zooks with smoke, su76s etc will kill it very quickly.

Like what now? If you position the truck forward as was customary in the days of yore, you lose it and you lose the game with it. Its not very potent, zooks with smoke, su76s etc will kill it very quickly.

Well obviously if you place it too far forward it can be easily removed but it becomes far to powerful when placed a bit farther back and even zooks(which would cost a lot of munitions to get enough to kill a Schwerer) in smoke can be burned out with flame grenades and explosives and su 76s can be countered by a single at gun.

Well obviously if you place it too far forward it can be easily removed but it becomes far to powerful when placed a bit farther back and even zooks(which would cost a lot of munitions to get enough to kill a Schwerer) in smoke can be burned out with flame grenades and explosives and su 76s can be countered by a single at gun.

Yeah, this is kind of the essence of the game. One unit destroys another, so you need a third unit to stop the first from destroying it.

Oh ffs, the thing is 120 fuel, vulnerable to tanks and AT and doesn't even Bofor laser units to death.

Just use uber UK commander concentrated fire operations or other similar arty based abilities, a land mattress, sexton, priest, Calliope, Katy, MORTAR even to deal with it.

Oh ffs, the thing is 120 fuel, vulnerable to tanks and AT and doesn't even Bofor laser units to death.

Just use uber UK commander concentrated fire operations or other similar arty based abilities, a land mattress, sexton, priest, Calliope, Katy, MORTAR even to deal with it.

The gun isnt 120 fuel the whole truck is and the price is too low for both a tech and a powerful weapon and most of the units you listed are doctrinal and will take a while to destroy the truck and mortars cant really get close enough to hit the truck without being on the front lines which is not where mortars belong and in case you missed it I mentioned that the Bofors doesn't justify the Schwerer.

I voted to leave as is. I don't see how it encourages "dumb a-move" battles at all. Quite the opposite, it takes a little bit of planning to take it down. I also don't think that OKW needs any nerfs.

The gun isnt 120 fuel the whole truck is and the price is too low for both a tech and a powerful weapon and most of the units you listed are doctrinal and will take a while to destroy the truck and mortars cant really get close enough to hit the truck without being on the front lines which is not where mortars belong and in case you missed it I mentioned that the Bofors doesn't justify the Schwerer.

It is not that powerful of a weapon. It doesn't laser wipe like Bofor, and all faction have counters to it.

Mortar pit
Land mattress
Mortars
Artillery
At guns
Smoke and attack ground

OKW flak base is a non-issue.

I voted to leave as is. I don't see how it encourages "dumb a-move" battles at all. Quite the opposite, it takes a little bit of planning to take it down. I also don't think that OKW needs any nerfs.

The reason I said it encourages dumb a move strategies is because it often times negates flanking because it is usually placed on a cutoff or as a barrier between the front and the med half track and I also think that the OKW needs some help but I think that it would be better to fix some of their units like the tier 1 AA half track and Obers while balancing things like the Schwerer gun rather than just ignoring problematic units while giving out buffs.

It is not that powerful of a weapon. It doesn't laser wipe like Bofor, and all faction have counters to it.

Mortar pit
Land mattress
Mortars
Artillery
At guns
Smoke and attack ground

OKW flak base is a non-issue.

Its not that powerful of a weapon and yet it can engage any unit other than heavies, well you and I certainly have different opinions on what powerful is. Also one of the reasons why it doesn't wipe like the Bofors is because it has suppression and its slower rate of fire makes it wipe retreating units less and like I said before I also think the Bofors is op but that doesn't justify the Schwerer's gun

actually penetration values dont matter for planes. Whether they are shot down or not is completely RNG. Im sure percentages are set for each AA gun individually.

The Penetration level is done on purpose by Relic for some reason.

actually penetration values dont matter for planes. Whether they are shot down or not is completely RNG. Im sure percentages are set for each AA gun individually.

The Penetration level is done on purpose by Relic for some reason.

The penetration nerf would be to make the Flak gun less effective verses armored vehicles not planes, thats why its an option.

Its not that powerful of a weapon and yet it can engage any unit other than heavies, well you and I certainly have different opinions on what powerful is. Also one of the reasons why it doesn't wipe like the Bofors is because it has suppression and its slower rate of fire makes it wipe retreating units less and like I said before I also think the Bofors is op but that doesn't justify the Schwerer's gun

Tell me, how does it engage units like atguns and mortars ?

Also bofors has better suppression too

Tell me, how does it engage units like atguns and mortars ?

Also bofors has better suppression too

I think they may have removed bofor suppression.

But it doesn't NEED suppression, you are already retreating because 3 model of your squad is DEAD. :/

Tell me, how does it engage units like atguns and mortars ?

Also bofors has better suppression too

Im pretty sure the Bofors needs to be crewed to get suppression and I meant that the Schwerer gun could effectively hit any target in its range, so of course units out of its range cant be hit.

I think they may have removed bofor suppression.

But it doesn't NEED suppression, you are already retreating because 3 model of your squad is DEAD. :/

That is if there even are any survivors to retreat by the time you notice that anything has happened

That is if there even are any survivors to retreat by the time you notice that anything has happened

RIP Kubelwagon. :/

Always the victim of an unknown bofor.