Too much artillery?

Hey guys I had some games after a pause of about 6 weeks and I honestly don't know if I'm not gonna have another Hiatus for even more time right after.

Has this game simply become Scheldt on all maps? Because I hade the feeling it has.

I played some 2v2 as Allies AND Axis and everything both teams did was simply wiping all the stuff with artillery after the mid game.

I didn't even know what exactly was happening but it clearly did not make a lot of fun for me to have my well preserved vet 3 units all wiped on retreat.

Yep, lots of Arty. But i don't think it is that bad.

Too much, or too powerful? Cause I don't think anybody will be rebuilding the mortars he just lost for example, and the only new artillery piece that was added was the OKW LeFH 18.

Artillery is fine. It costs a lot (600 MP in late is really sirius investment), it's very vunerable, it's very random...

And can somebody explain me - why squad wipes became such serious issue of last period. A lot of people write and whine about it but... it's fine. Squad dies - you always free to get new. Losing veterancy - go get it again. Deal with it, it's war!

I just don't understand that message of OP, that "my well preserved vet 3 squads dying because of random arty - it's bad". And you want what? When squad gets vet 3 it should become unvunerable, just for to please your efforts of saving it?

Personally, I like that random, it adds realism, unpredictability and more "action" in game. Of course, it affects bad on people, who thinks, that "micro should rule over everything", but seriously - without random wipes, random other things, which may annoy you, game would be way more boring...

So - let's arty be at least same powerful, as it is. I would even say - let's buff it, because it's performance is too weak for doctrinal late and overpriced unit, which leaves you without other reliable late game options, like heavy tanks. (If I remember right, there are no doctrines, combining heavy tanks and arty).

Artillery is just as much a part of the game as anything else. And just as some matches favor tanks, others favor artillery. That's not a bad thing as long as the maps aren't too chokepointy.

Artillery is fine. It costs a lot (600 MP in late is really sirius investment), it's very vunerable, it's very random...

And can somebody explain me - why squad wipes became such serious issue of last period. A lot of people write and whine about it but... it's fine. Squad dies - you always free to get new. Losing veterancy - go get it again. Deal with it, it's war!

I just don't understand that message of OP, that "my well preserved vet 3 squads dying because of random arty - it's bad". And you want what? When squad gets vet 3 it should become unvunerable, just for to please your efforts of saving it?

Personally, I like that random, it adds realism, unpredictability and more "action" in game. Of course, it affects bad on people, who thinks, that "micro should rule over everything", but seriously - without random wipes, random other things, which may annoy you, game would be way more boring...

So - let's arty be at least same powerful, as it is. I would even say - let's buff it, because it's performance is too weak for doctrinal late and overpriced unit, which leaves you without other reliable late game options, like heavy tanks. (If I remember right, there are no doctrines, combining heavy tanks and arty).

Squad preservation is the most important rule in COH2 maybe not in 4v4 plebmode, but in 1v1 it is.

Can you provide more detailed information about that particular game on "which artillery" and "how many"?

Even before the OKW LeFH 18 was added into the game I thought there was way too much arty. Just arty the hell out of everyone and done.

Squad preservation is the most important rule in COH2 maybe not in 4v4 plebmode, but in 1v1 it is.

No it's not, it's only a part of the game. In fact, the game even rewards you with more manpower income if you do lose squads. Losing a few squads here and there throughout your match is just how the game goes.

This is just another one of those "I don't like this playstyle so it should be nerfed" threads. All playstyles should be relevant and relic should and will not nerf units into irrelevancy just so you don't have to deal with them.

Also, who is building multiple artillery units in 1v1. If you you are having any trouble with artillery in 1v1, it's because you aren't putting enough pressure on your opponent because it's real easy to exploit that.

Artillery has been dominant in 2v2s for ages now

Well at least it is not 25-pounder vs Hummel slug fest now when rocket artillery runs dominant.

Yeah, arty everywhere

It only takes one commander with the Stuka dive bomb or the IL2 bombing run ability to ruin any stationary artillery piece on the map. USF, UKF, and OKW don't have those options though

I think the arty fest nature of teams games is in part a result of most of the maps being poorly designed. When the maps are so choke pointed and narrow, it's obvious going to end up in a campy arty fest. More wider, open maps would certainly help.

I think the arty fest nature of teams games is in part a result of most of the maps being poorly designed. When the maps are so choke pointed and narrow, it's obvious going to end up in a campy arty fest. More wider, open maps would certainly help.

This. I've been talking for years about the commonly lacking map design in CoH2.

3 victory points in team games is as stupid as a single victory point would be in 1v1 and it gets worse with player number increases, it results in campy play and waves of units being thrown at each other. I don't understand why that hasn't been changed, obviously if 3 VPs are adapted for 1v1 then team games that have more players must have more than 3 VPs. Then you have not only that but maps like Road to Kharkov, Moscow Outskirts etc. with messed up point placements that "give" each team a fuel point (especially try taking those clusters of near-base points from an OKW flak HQ on those kinds of maps...) and a couple of other points, and then have few points to fight over.

- Team game maps need to have an amount of VP sectors adapted for increased player count
- No "free" points for teams that are practically impossible to cap or cut off, especially not if they are fuel points and/or clusters of points
- Make sure that there are enough points on the map to fight over in no man's land, so that it doesn't settle into each team pseudo-camping on their side because any major attack you launch would have to dislodge and destroy the opponent's entire forces because he has nowhere else to send them anyway, this goes hand in hand with the second point
- No taking of maps that are made for 1v1 and turning them into 2v2 maps

No it's not, it's only a part of the game. In fact, the game even rewards you with more manpower income if you do lose squads. Losing a few squads here and there throughout your match is just how the game goes.

This is just another one of those "I don't like this playstyle so it should be nerfed" threads. All playstyles should be relevant and relic should and will not nerf units into irrelevancy just so you don't have to deal with them.

Also, who is building multiple artillery units in 1v1. If you you are having any trouble with artillery in 1v1, it's because you aren't putting enough pressure on your opponent because it's real easy to exploit that.

I said its the most important rule, not the only rule.

Let me guess- probable culprits.
Calliope-okw stuka ,Mortar pit and ofc usf mortar.

Sadly mortars have become obscene squadwipers atm.

This. I've been talking for years about the commonly lacking map design in CoH2.

WOW, JUST WHY NOBODY HAs LISTENED TO YOU?? JUST WHY??

and that although i've been always saying we should take random guys with no avatar and no playercard much more serious

WOW, JUST WHY NOBODY HAs LISTENED TO YOU?? JUST WHY??

and that although i've been always saying we should take random guys with no avatar and no playercard much more serious

Maybe you can take the arguments I made seriously or you didn't understand anything past my post's first sentence and that's why you cut it out?

Squad preservation is the most important rule in COH2 maybe not in 4v4 plebmode, but in 1v1 it is.

But... in 1v1 artillery is not that popular. And even in 2v2 reasonable people won't spend such huge MP count at howitzers. So - it's actually more problem for 3v3 and 4v4.

Of course, there are not only howitzers, but also rocket platforms. But I'm not also that sure, that in 1v1 a lot of people use them. Maybe they are popular here, I would trust to your sight.

In any case - I think, that arty should be reworked a bit. Rocket platroms should be... maybe less deadly, maybe something else. And static and mobile howitzers should be more effective. Cos right now Rockets are hardly overperforming and Howitzers (which cost more, which are doctrinal only) - underperforming.

Maybe... there should be mechanic, which prevents squads from dying under rocket barrages (and Wuhrframmen too). Not totally, cos it will look a bit wierd - if squad dies under rocket attack, it should be really bad luck. It will turn rocket platforms not into weapons of "mass massacre" (which they were in real, but... here it looks a bit OP), but weapons of "mass forcing opponent to retreat with serious MP damage, but without squad losses". It should only thin out squads, not wipe them from existance.

And Howitzers.... well, they still should wipe squads, since it's already very big luck, when such thing happens + I would add suppression around blast area for howitzers (bigger caliber - bigger radius) and small damagin effects to vechiles from right direct hits (like stun, or turret lock, or engine overheat).

I think, such changes would divide rocket and howitzer artillery in thier roles more effectively, would balance squad wipes a bit. Right now, nobody reasonable will prefer howitzer to rocket platform, cos howitzer is just less effective, and for vanilla factions - doctrinal, while rockets are not doctrinal.

P.S. About mortars - they are fine. Squad wipes by mortars are in 60-70% are really bad luck, when entire your squad prefered to stay close to each other and was punished for that. Or something like that. I wouldn't remove random from that game, cos otherwise - it becomes too boring. But... I would somehow relase in CoH 2 system/mechanic from CoH 1, when infantry models automaticly, without order just runned away from blast area (so fast, it would look like jump), and saved their lifes from that.

Such mechanic would really be helpful in that game in preventing squad wipes from rockets/mortars/howitzers. At least, in CoH 1 that was really helpful, cos right now if you don't move your squads yourself from blast area - they will stand under fire, like idiots. Powerful infantry AI was great achivement of CoH 1, don't understand, why they refuesed so easy from it in CoH 2...