I would suggest a swap for a DP28I kinda expect that would be far worse considering how Penals have a not-insignificant chance of beating LMG42 Grens as it already.
Penal squads flamethrowers
12 Jul 2016, 18:24 PM
#21
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
12 Jul 2016, 23:24 PM
#22
Posts: 1605 | Subs: 1
I find them to be some what of a problem, especially on maps like ellterbrook station. Where city fighting takes place. Not to mention they synch well with guards.
But as for the flame thrower yes it should never be allowed on mainline infantry.
I would suggest a swap for a DP28
No more LMG blobs, please.
12 Jul 2016, 23:36 PM
#23
Posts: 1930
compared to the lmg blob, penal is pretty tame.
they are strong, but not game breakingly so.
they are strong, but not game breakingly so.
13 Jul 2016, 04:52 AM
#24
Posts: 53
They are a little bit like glass cannons. They recieve more accuracy and less RA with veterancy. So flamer don’t benefit from vet. And if you swap flamer with dp28 than you will face insane long range dps.
13 Jul 2016, 15:07 PM
#25
Posts: 6
Riflemen had flamers back when flamers did so much AOE DPS that a squad of penals or engineers in a M3A1 could run down and wipe squads on retreat. It was a different time.
Also, riflemen have access to bazookas, AT nades, smoke, and normal grenades while penals only have access to satchel charges and hooah after they get vet 2.
Also, riflemen have access to bazookas, AT nades, smoke, and normal grenades while penals only have access to satchel charges and hooah after they get vet 2.
13 Jul 2016, 15:14 PM
#26
Posts: 179
The Only thing this thread did for me was bring back the glorious memories of Rifle Flamers and all the QQ and the glorious flares....
AND WHY IS RIFLE COMPANY STILL CALLED RIFLE COMPANY WHEN THERE IS LIKE ONLY 1 ABILITY THAT ACTUALLY AFFECTS RIFLEMEN AAHAAHAHAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH
Now that I cooled off, Penals should keep the flamers, they have no smoke grenades or access to ANY type of smoke in their tier building (T2 has smoke though via mortars). have no reliable grenade that has a 1.25 second fuse. come in a Tier with NO AT to be seen, and not nearly as durable as reefermen
AND WHY IS RIFLE COMPANY STILL CALLED RIFLE COMPANY WHEN THERE IS LIKE ONLY 1 ABILITY THAT ACTUALLY AFFECTS RIFLEMEN AAHAAHAHAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH
Now that I cooled off, Penals should keep the flamers, they have no smoke grenades or access to ANY type of smoke in their tier building (T2 has smoke though via mortars). have no reliable grenade that has a 1.25 second fuse. come in a Tier with NO AT to be seen, and not nearly as durable as reefermen
14 Jul 2016, 05:08 AM
#27
Posts: 168
You could whine about how penals are OP
OR you could use light vehicles and actually L2P
OR you could use light vehicles and actually L2P
Of coursh
14 Jul 2016, 11:11 AM
#28
Posts: 4474
Penal are really strong only if you pair them with guards
katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
Katitof-2018
14 Jul 2016, 14:45 PM
#29
Posts: 284
AND WHY IS RIFLE COMPANY STILL CALLED RIFLE COMPANY WHEN THERE IS LIKE ONLY 1 ABILITY THAT ACTUALLY AFFECTS RIFLEMEN AAHAAHAHAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH
They also called Riflemen, yet they are Terminators with LMGs..
14 Jul 2016, 15:13 PM
#30
Posts: 2742
There is a pretty distinct lack of rifle combat in CoH2.
Everything has MP44s or LMGs.
Everything has MP44s or LMGs.
Strategic Territory Points Mod:
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Classic resource points!
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Classic resource points!
14 Jul 2016, 15:27 PM
#31
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
There is a pretty distinct lack of rifle combat in CoH2.
Everything has MP44s or LMGs.
And then, we have penals and cons.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
14 Jul 2016, 15:45 PM
#32
Posts: 179
They also called Riflemen, yet they are Terminators with LMGs..
Still, they should rename Rifle Company to Combined Arms Company, or Assault Company.
15 Jul 2016, 02:19 AM
#33
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
And then, we have penals and cons.
A year ago I would have responded to this with a
, but it's actually working now. Needless to say, I wouldn't have believed that if you told me.
15 Jul 2016, 02:50 AM
#34
Posts: 247
Short-range upgrades and abilities on a medium-long range unit is just weird design generally, which is why even now that penals are finally worthwhile they still have a bit of an awkward role. Before it felt like penals didn't have a use at any range, now it feels like they don't have a weakness to any infantry bar snipers or Obers.
In 1v1 it's not an issue on most maps, a T1 start is still vulnerable as ever to a rush from the luchs or new flame HT and the soviet player needs skill to control fuel and prevent that from happening. In 2v2 it does seem a bit too strong, especially in the early-mid game since the teammate can provide AT. The MG42 offers an effective counter but doesn't always perform that well in the face of current indirect meta or OP US mortar.
In 1v1 it's not an issue on most maps, a T1 start is still vulnerable as ever to a rush from the luchs or new flame HT and the soviet player needs skill to control fuel and prevent that from happening. In 2v2 it does seem a bit too strong, especially in the early-mid game since the teammate can provide AT. The MG42 offers an effective counter but doesn't always perform that well in the face of current indirect meta or OP US mortar.
15 Jul 2016, 04:23 AM
#35
Posts: 276
versus OKW I almost always upgrade all of my penals with flamers, because of volks and sturm stgs.
versus Ostheer though I only upgrade 1 squad(1 more if in urban map) for mg busting purposes. Unupgraded penals are needed versus lmg grens in long range fights, while flamer penals flank
versus Ostheer though I only upgrade 1 squad(1 more if in urban map) for mg busting purposes. Unupgraded penals are needed versus lmg grens in long range fights, while flamer penals flank
I am not responsible for anything I say.
15 Jul 2016, 06:54 AM
#36
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Short-range upgrades and abilities on a medium-long range unit is just weird design generally, which is why even now that penals are finally worthwhile they still have a bit of an awkward role. Before it felt like penals didn't have a use at any range, now it feels like they don't have a weakness to any infantry bar snipers or Obers.
Flamer is mid range weapon.
Penals are effective at all ranges.
From my experience with penals, flamer is not a no brainer choice either, due to low rec acc vet penals don't really want to be at mid range all the time.
And their weakness is suppression, they got nothing on it except for plain flank.
In 1v1 it's not an issue on most maps, a T1 start is still vulnerable as ever to a rush from the luchs or new flame HT and the soviet player needs skill to control fuel and prevent that from happening. In 2v2 it does seem a bit too strong, especially in the early-mid game since the teammate can provide AT. The MG42 offers an effective counter but doesn't always perform that well in the face of current indirect meta or OP US mortar.
The team mate in 2v2 needs to keep the AT for themselves, because axis lights are also considerable threat.
You need to tech to T2 or use AT call-ins.
Soviets don't have USF mortar and USF is not 100% of the time the team mate, so that argument makes completely no sense.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
15 Jul 2016, 07:29 AM
#37
Posts: 247
Soviets don't have USF mortar and USF is not 100% of the time the team mate, so that argument makes completely no sense.
I never said anything about the US mortar always being there, what I clearly meant was that the MG42 struggles to perform as a counter to penals when it is there.
In a 2v2 game the presence of a teammate enables your team to have some AT to cover a soviet player during that vulnerable period after going penals. Of course it doesn't remove the need for the soviet player to get some AT capability but it does prevent a cheeky luchs from ending the game, thus substantially reducing the risk associated with a T1 start.
15 Jul 2016, 07:45 AM
#38
Posts: 284
There is a pretty distinct lack of rifle combat in CoH2.
Everything has MP44s or LMGs.
The double LMG bullsh*t should be removed.. from both UKF and USF
15 Jul 2016, 08:21 AM
#39
Posts: 284
And their weakness is suppression, they got nothing on it except for plain flank.
Suppression is not a weakness... all infantry get suppressed. Penals are no different except they are only lack of direct MG counter tools.
But Penals are not base infantry... conscripts are. Also there are soviet mortars with smoke in case you want to jump those mgs.
Volks however are OKWs main infantry, yet they have no sprint, no smoke grenade, nothing. They dont even have a mortar with smoke. Their MG on the other hand is locked behind teching, while USFs broken piece of sh*t mortar is T0.
15 Jul 2016, 08:32 AM
#40
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Suppression is not a weakness... all infantry get suppressed. Penals are no different except they are only lack of direct MG counter tools.
But Penals are not base infantry... conscripts are. Also there are soviet mortars with smoke in case you want to jump those mgs.
How is that not a weakness to you?
And if you want penal exclusive weakness-light armor. They got nothing on it.
Mortars will not arrive before 8th-10th minute because you need that field presence first, then either T2 or 120mm.
Volks however are OKWs main infantry, yet they have no sprint, no smoke grenade, nothing. They dont even have a mortar with smoke. Their MG on the other hand is locked behind teching, while USFs broken piece of sh*t mortar is T0.
MG34 arrives around 3rd-4th minute if you tech med truck. You also have Kubel, which is excellent at harassing penals and forces soviet into enduring bleed until 2CP or getting M3, which is hardly a reasonable choice currently and becomes completely useless once kubel is dead.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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