Ostheer vs double upgraded infantry

I am having a hard time fighting against USF opponents that use double upgraded riflemen. I came across a player that used double upgraded riflemen very effectively by keeping a squad with double bazookas and a squad with double bars together. He had multiple of these assault groups running around. I had a hard time fighting these groups with my grenadiers, especially when his two m10s hit the battlefield and kept crushing my soldiers. My mg42s felt hopeless since he used smoke all the time and then blew my mg42s up with grenades.

What can I do against such tactics?

This is pretty expensive to always have 2 squads together (2x280mp=560mp). You should counter the fact that he wasted 2 of his upgrade slots on zooks and send two lmg grens against it. They should win if positioned properly and cost less to buy and reinforce (480mp) meaning you win on every engagement. Cheaper price also mean you can sometimes pump 3 grens against him. Eventually it will come down to better micro and positioning.

I wouldn't suggest using mgs against usf on certain level when people know how to smoke. Instead you can buy a sniper, it bleeds usf really hard.

If you feel that you still need an mg you should always use it in a group of two (yeah it's expensive, so its not often a good idea but its much, much better than lone mg). You position them in such way that one is facing opponent and the other is behind covering one flank and the point where the 1st mg is set up. When the 1st one gets smoked you reposition it behind the 2nd one, when opponent comes out of his own smoke he walks right into the second mg. At least one squad is suppressed at this point, the others can smoke more but then you just keep repositioning your mgs behind. The "tentacle blob" of smoking riflmen cant go past that if you do it correctly. Remember to always place your mgs in green cover, or in worst case in yellow one.

This is pretty expensive to always have 2 squads together (2x280mp=560mp). You should counter the fact that he wasted 2 of his upgrade slots on zooks and send two lmg grens against it. They should win if positioned properly and cost less to buy and reinforce (480mp) meaning you win on every engagement. Cheaper price also mean you can sometimes pump 3 grens against him. Eventually it will come down to better micro and positioning.

I wouldn't suggest using mgs against usf on certain level when people know how to smoke. Instead you can buy a sniper, it bleeds usf really hard.

If you feel that you still need an mg you should always use it in a group of two (yeah it's expensive, so its not often a good idea but its much, much better than lone mg). You position them in such way that one is facing opponent and the other is behind covering one flank and the point where the 1st mg is set up. When the 1st one gets smoked you reposition it behind the 2nd one, when opponent comes out of his own smoke he walks right into the second mg. At least one squad is suppressed at this point, the others can smoke more but then you just keep repositioning your mgs behind. The "tentacle blob" of smoking riflmen cant go past that if you do it correctly. Remember to always place your mgs in green cover, or in worst case in yellow one.

Oke I will try this. The problem with the grenediers is that they have 4 soldiers and he had m10s. Those tanks can run over my soldiers and destroy the entire squad. He basically had one m10 per assault group, it was a very smart idea of him.

Oke I will try this. The problem with the grenediers is that they have 4 soldiers and he had m10s. Those tanks can run over my soldiers and destroy the entire squad. He basically had one m10 per assault group, it was a very smart idea of him.

If you keep your grens in pairs they can always double faust the m10 every time it closes the distance. When you start fausting, the soldier holding the panzerfaust will damage the engine even if he gets crushed before shooting. After being double fausted the m10 is unable to do any harm to your soldiers untill repaired. You can try to keep shrecked pgrens or a pak behind your grens to destroy the m10 once it has its engine damaged. Teller mines also often do wonders against M10 spam. If you happen to go t3 stugs deal with m10s pretty well too, you just need to make sure grenadiers or pioneer spot for it.

It's important to remember that when you are against armor company time is on your side. If you keep him engaged and manage to kill some m10s he is not going to have any other armour. Once you get some kind of heavy like tiger or tiger ace his "assoult groups" are not going to do anything against it. Same with m10s unless he builds and keeps alive multiple of them.

If you keep your grens in pairs they can always double faust the m10 every time it closes the distance. When you start fausting, the soldier holding the panzerfaust will damage the engine even if he gets crushed before shooting. After being double fausted the m10 is unable to do any harm to your soldiers untill repaired. You can try to keep shrecked pgrens or a pak behind your grens to destroy the m10 once it has its engine damaged. Teller mines also often do wonders against M10 spam. If you happen to go t3 stugs deal with m10s pretty well too, you just need to make sure grenadiers or pioneer spot for it.

It's important to remember that when you are against armor company time is on your side. If you keep him engaged and manage to kill some m10s he is not going to have any other armour. Once you get some kind of heavy like tiger or tiger ace his "assoult groups" are not going to do anything against it. Same with m10s unless he builds and keeps alive multiple of them.

I tried this and it worked very well. Thanks

Glad this worked well for you, sorry for the slow replay, well done ferwiner.

I think this a good time to remind players to try to keep a squad in reserve when they are going into large scale battles. Even a single squad can exploit any momentary openings in the line and replace suppressed or injured troops. Also keeping AT units just beyond LoS creates a real delima for tanks. Do they push and assume that the unit is not there, risking snare and death? Or do they stay back and are relegated to lower effect on the battlefield assuming the AT unit is just waiting for them around the next corner? In this way a unit out of combat can have a strong influence on the way a battle resolves.

If you can afford to keep 2 or even 3 units just behind the front line to reinforce retreating or injured squads all the better, but don't build up so much behind the lines that you fail to draw your opponents forces into battle. You want him to commit everything he has so you can see all the cards on the table before deciding what to do while you still hold cards.

Glad this worked well for you, sorry for the slow replay, well done ferwiner.

I think this a good time to remind players to try to keep a squad in reserve when they are going into large scale battles. Even a single squad can exploit any momentary openings in the line and replace suppressed or injured troops. Also keeping AT units just beyond LoS creates a real delima for tanks. Do they push and assume that the unit is not there, risking snare and death? Or do they stay back and are relegated to lower effect on the battlefield assuming the AT unit is just waiting for them around the next corner? In this way a unit out of combat can have a strong influence on the way a battle resolves.

If you can afford to keep 2 or even 3 units just behind the front line to reinforce retreating or injured squads all the better, but don't build up so much behind the lines that you fail to draw your opponents forces into battle. You want him to commit everything he has so you can see all the cards on the table before deciding what to do while you still hold cards.

Oke I will try to keep these things in mind. Thank you a lot

Once rifles become vetted and upgraded, conventional OH infantry play - Grens supported by 42s - flat out fall apart against it. Rifles have a potent grenade, an anti suppression/LOS tool, and potentially insane dps with either 1919s or BARs, and with their received accuracy at vet 3 they become very resilient to smallarms fire, quite unlike your grens...
This is why you need to supplement your army composition with a dedicated anti-infantry platform. The two most common options are either the StuG-E, which is still quite lethal against infantry and, being a call in, has no opportunity costs, or the sniper. The latter especially is crucial to the OH/US matchup these days, and most games revolve around OH attempting to maximise its impact and trying to protect it, and US setting up plays to kill it (and more often than not punching their screen in frustration since its quite hard to kill)
The sad fact is: Call ins and snipers are the two things that keep Ostheer competitive, and mastering them is crucial to improving with the faction. And thats my advice in a nutshell. Sic transit gloria mundi.

Once rifles become vetted and upgraded, conventional OH infantry play - Grens supported by 42s - flat out fall apart against it. Rifles have a potent grenade, an anti suppression/LOS tool, and potentially insane dps with either 1919s or BARs, and with their received accuracy at vet 3 they become very resilient to smallarms fire, quite unlike your grens...
This is why you need to supplement your army composition with a dedicated anti-infantry platform. The two most common options are either the StuG-E, which is still quite lethal against infantry and, being a call in, has no opportunity costs, or the sniper. The latter especially is crucial to the OH/US matchup these days, and most games revolve around OH attempting to maximise its impact and trying to protect it, and US setting up plays to kill it (and more often than not punching their screen in frustration since its quite hard to kill)
The sad fact is: Call ins and snipers are the two things that keep Ostheer competitive, and mastering them is crucial to improving with the faction. And thats my advice in a nutshell. Sic transit gloria mundi.

I think I have found my solution to my problem. I tried gren spam

I think I have found my solution to my problem. I tried gren spam

He will spam 2x LMG rifles, dont worry, he will beat you .

He will spam 2x LMG rifles, dont worry, he will beat you .

That indeed happened. I did however do sniper opening, that worked wonders!

That indeed happened. I did however do sniper opening, that worked wonders!

yes, that strat works, but is map dependant, so not valid