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Emplacements currently

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Intelligence209
8 Apr 2016, 21:17 PM
#61
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jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 19:16 PMAustralian Magic


2 OKW players can get 2 stukas easily. Then just force to brace, wait until it's done and 2 barrages will kill any emplacement 3/4 times.


Oh great, now I have to play as double OKW and now I have to get stuka...

One of the worst post I have ever seen
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Intelligence209
8 Apr 2016, 21:19 PM
#62
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jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 20:48 PMAustralian Magic


Ever heard of ISGs? Incendiary nades? Infiltration nades? Jadgpanzer 4? Off maps? Falls? Jaegers? As double OKW where one is going med+rep, second rep+schwerer, try to use the best option which depends on a map and placement of emplacements to force brace, wait until CD and fire 2 stukas.
If you have good micro (you won't let your enemy crush your volks with cromwell) you gonna do fine against it.


You should just stop now. You really should
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Katitof
8 Apr 2016, 21:29 PM
#63
avatar of Katitof

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jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 21:17 PMIntelligence209


Oh great, now I have to play as double OKW and now I have to get stuka...

One of the worst post I have ever seen

You have to build a specific counter to a specific unit!?

*GASP!*

Who came up with such bullshit feature for RTS game?
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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BadHunter
8 Apr 2016, 21:45 PM
#64
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Posts: 13

It's fun to see people coming up with a "for all games against emplacements" strats. I really would like to believe what u guys are saying, but its necessary to notice: you usually have to spend like ~~200+ mun/1000+ mp/150+ fuel in units/abilities and 1/4 of the game just to beat well placed emplacements (eg.: 1 mortar + 1 bofors).

That is A LOT of gameplay!!!

Thinking of another game-changing mechanic like "Emplacements", currently, they only show up around 8 - 10 minutes of the game, IF the player rush for them. (eg.: T-70/Ostwind/Luchs/AA HT/AEC) And that means denying other stuff to achieve the rush, for the desired gameplay benefit. And they can be easily countered in 1-2 minutes. Thinking of emplacement, how many time the enemy player need to counter it effectively? We should consider it. (BOFORS - in 5 min UKF can build it)

Of course: Not taking in consideration the commander brit went for (which scales the time needed to counter it considerably)

The emplacement idea is Ok in a certain view. But currently its mechanic is not well faceted, IMHO.
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Smiling Tiger
8 Apr 2016, 21:48 PM
#65
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Posts: 207

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 21:29 PMKatitof

You have to build a specific counter to a specific unit!?

*GASP!*

Who came up with such bullshit feature for RTS game?


Well the problem isnt that we have to build a counter to emplacements, its that the stuka is much more expensive than the emplacements and it cant even kill an emplacement by itself because they have so much health and they can brace and be repaired so quickly and building a stuka makes us take a tech that severely delays our tanks so the British can roll out their cheap cromwells to crush us and the counter barrage has the ability to counter the counters of the emplacements themselves.
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Carlos Danger
8 Apr 2016, 21:48 PM
#66
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Posts: 362

Truth is that emplacements are pretty much zero-skill noob weapons that require no real micro to use at all. Being static, they should be countered by any sort of artillery, which would be fine. Makes sense that zero-skill noob weapons are easy to defeat. High-skill British players have (or should have) other options.

Problem is that Relic decided that emplacements should still be valid at a competitive level and therefore chose to buff them to a point where they're clearly over-performing for their cost. Yes, emplacements can still be defeated, but doing so requires a disproportionate amount of firepower relative to their cost. EG: two Stukas/massive numbers of LeIGs.

Meanwhile British players can roll out Cromwells when you've put all your resources into 100 fuel Stukas to counter his 30 fuel Bofors gun.
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Australian Magic
8 Apr 2016, 21:54 PM
#67
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jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 21:17 PMIntelligence209


Oh great, now I have to play as double OKW and now I have to get stuka...

One of the worst post I have ever seen


You can always go for OST and MHT.

@click, you have big troubles with reading. Going stuka (only 1 because second will belong to your teammate) does not mean you cant get isg. You get fast stuka, he gets isg, you get schwerer he gets second stuka. Around 15 min you both have stuka and he bas isgs.

No one is saying they are easy to handle but instead of whining because "my volks blob does not work" try different strata, different units, and finally you gonna figure out the your best way to deal with them.

Its not like they can move and attack you, therefore the only pressure is probably VP pressure.
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__deleted__
8 Apr 2016, 21:56 PM
#68
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Posts: 236

Why didn't relic make OKW flak emplacements this good?
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Click
8 Apr 2016, 22:00 PM
#69
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Posts: 139

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 21:54 PMAustralian Magic


You can always go for OST and MHT.

@click, you have big troubles with reading. Going stuka (only 1 because second will belong to your teammate) does not mean you cant get isg. You get fast stuka, he gets isg, you get schwerer he gets second stuka. Around 15 min you both have stuka and he bas isgs.


And I think you have big problem in understanding that such things do not work in games with random. Where a team game is actually 1v1 at 3 different location. So I am along fighting a single sim city opponent. It is 1 okw vs 1 sim city in a team game. Others might be fighting thr side sim city.
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Australian Magic
8 Apr 2016, 22:07 PM
#70
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jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 22:00 PMClick


And I think you have big problem in understanding that such things do not work in games with random. Where a team game is actually 1v1 at 3 different location. So I am along fighting a single sim city opponent. It is 1 okw vs 1 sim city in a team game. Others might be fighting thr side sim city.

Find friends.
Its not like random 3s and 4s were free from bs before emplacemets lel
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Katitof
8 Apr 2016, 22:21 PM
#71
avatar of Katitof

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jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 22:00 PMClick


And I think you have big problem in understanding that such things do not work in games with random. Where a team game is actually 1v1 at 3 different location. So I am along fighting a single sim city opponent. It is 1 okw vs 1 sim city in a team game. Others might be fighting thr side sim city.


You either play random team or competitively.
These two are two separate ends of the spectrum.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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Click
8 Apr 2016, 22:39 PM
#72
avatar of Click

Posts: 139

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 22:07 PMAustralian Magic

Find friends.
Its not like random 3s and 4s were free from bs before emplacemets lel


Game never had a requirement that said I need friends who have to play this game every time I play otherwise I can't enjoy it. Relic should be more clear.
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Katitof
8 Apr 2016, 22:51 PM
#73
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 22:39 PMClick


Game never had a requirement that said I need friends who have to play this game every time I play otherwise I can't enjoy it. Relic should be more clear.

Obviously not, but good luck relying on matchmaking to pair you up with someone who communicates and actually has a clue on what to do.

I admire streamers who go for 2v2 RT as they pretty much always have to carry hard while ally is derping around without the army, waiting for his big unit while sitting on 50 fuel caches(at least cut off is safe, right?).

You can enjoy the game.
Just don't join mm for RT with actual expectation of win, that is side effect of RT games, not expected result.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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Intelligence209
8 Apr 2016, 23:11 PM
#74
avatar of Intelligence209

Posts: 1124

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 21:29 PMKatitof

You have to build a specific counter to a specific unit!?

*GASP!*

Who came up with such bullshit feature for RTS game?


For those of us who actually play

Forcing a faction choice and having both go stuka for 1 brit going sim city shouldn't be how it's done.

Let's remember that 1 stuka is usless,

The other will do damage yes, let's not forget the 1 click heals all structures

My previous sentence is further more with advanced emplacements..

This is when I would call you words but I won't. Ignorance doesn't deserve attention
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aaa
8 Apr 2016, 23:38 PM
#75
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Posts: 1487

jump backJump back to quoted post7 Apr 2016, 23:51 PMm00nch1ld
you get bofors or two covering vps, mortar pit in the back and vickers on cutoff. and ppl still tell you to be patient, wait for late game and go around :hansGASM:
by the time i can get to late game im already down to 100 vps :luvCarrot:

so l2p issue basically :romeoMug:
thats how oh plays on many maps if not most maps.
mg in the house in the center, extra squad to cap whole map. Cheap tech of all kind. Infantry, light vehicles, esp mediums everithing is cheaper. When you get rif of this central mg you HAVE 100 VP and couple of mediums are on the map.

Emplaicments at least cost some money and you cant move them out of danger axis mgs costs nothing in comparision
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SteamId is set to private for user id aaa. Set it to public if you want to link to your playercard via your user id.
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Svanh
8 Apr 2016, 23:56 PM
#76
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Posts: 181

It's almost impressive that we can have several entire threads on emplacements without anything approaching actionable balance suggestions. ^_^

Emplacements in General

Mortar Pit:

- Mortar Pit Auto-fire range reduced from 115 to 80
- Mortar Pit cost reduced from 400mp to 350mp
- The 2nd mortar weapon used for the barrage now has the same kill radius as the other mortars (bugfix)

The auto-fire change means that you must actually use micro to use the Mortar Pit to its fullest and the cost reduction helps offset the new micro requirement.

Bofors:

- Health reduced from 1000 to 720
- Suppressive Barrage range reduced from 80 to 60

The Bofors is currently slightly too cost efficient at 280/30 and it really shouldn't be able to barrage mortars.

17 Pounder:

- Pop cost reduced from 20 to 15

I think this change speaks for itself.


Advanced Emplacement Regiment:

Improved Fortifications:

- 30% health bonus removed
- Cost reduced from 75 munitions to 45 munitions

The armour bonus is significant enough on its own, requiring you to use grenades or artillery against emplacements if you don't have tanks. At the same time, 75 munitions is slightly too much for just the armour boost.

Counter Battery:

- Counter-Battery initial delay increased from 0-5 seconds to 10 seconds
- Counter-Battery cooldown between salvos increased from 4 seconds to 10 seconds
- Counter-Battery range increased from 250 to 1000
- Counter-Battery now reduces munitions income by 10 per minute when active

These changes will equalise Counter Battery performance across all map sizes while ensuring artillery has sufficient time to move before and between salvos and there's an actual cost to Counter-Battery.

UKF Indirect Fire

Infantry Sections

- Infantry Section flare range increased from 20 to 40

Sniper

- Sniper flare range increased from 30 to 50
- Coordinated Fire (Sniper/IS/Concentration Barrage) scatter angle reduced from <unknown> to 5.6
- Coordinated Fire (Sniper/IS/Concentration Barrage) max scatter reduced from <unknown> to 12
- Coordinated Fire (Sniper/IS/Concentration Barrage) gun rotation increased from <unknown> to 50
- Coordinated Fire (Sniper/IS/Concentration Barrage) AOE increased to 8 from 6 with distances 2/4/6 from 1.5/3/4.5 (Now matches ML20)

Both the Infantry Section and Sniper changes improve UKF indirect fire to entice players away from emplacements. I'm aware that <unknown> stats aren't helpful but Relic doesn't have the exact changes in their changelog and they haven't updated the tools.
I think a good rule for balance suggestions is this:

"If you can't personally mod it in and you haven't met anyone who has, don't suggest it."
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Intelligence209
9 Apr 2016, 00:19 AM
#77
avatar of Intelligence209

Posts: 1124

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 23:38 PMaaa
thats how oh plays on many maps if not most maps.
mg in the house in the center, extra squad to cap whole map. Cheap tech of all kind. Infantry, light vehicles, esp mediums everithing is cheaper. When you get rif of this central mg you HAVE 100 VP and couple of mediums are on the map.

Lol you made my day with this joke. Thanks bro keep em coming.

Emplaicments at least cost some money and you cant move them out of danger axis mgs costs nothing in comparision

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Intelligence209
9 Apr 2016, 00:20 AM
#78
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Posts: 1124

When the joke is too strong
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PanzerGeneralForever
9 Apr 2016, 00:55 AM
#79
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Posts: 1072

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 16:22 PMJadame!
Gardening remove them and buff brits accordingly, i am sick of losing full health lmg grens to one shots from mortar pits.


Or give them a 5th man and need each entity accordingly. Grenns get wiped by all AOE weapons too easily cuz there only 4 men who like the hold hands in battle.

Also spread out the dmg of mortar pits. Larger overall AOE, smaller lethal AOE.
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Dullahan
9 Apr 2016, 02:01 AM
#80
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Posts: 1384

jump backJump back to quoted post8 Apr 2016, 22:00 PMClick


And I think you have big problem in understanding that such things do not work in games with random. Where a team game is actually 1v1 at 3 different location. So I am along fighting a single sim city opponent. It is 1 okw vs 1 sim city in a team game. Others might be fighting thr side sim city.


There's a chat function where you can discuss strategy with your teammates in the early stages of the game.
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