Volks nerf
1 Apr 2016, 04:42 AM
#22
Posts: 139
No nerf needed. I use volks a lot but lately I have been playing USF and blobing like hell because why not? I equip my rifleman blob with zooks and bars and they own opponents from the start to finish. If volks are nerfed then allies should be nerfed too. But as usual this thread will die a slow and painful death like other 1000+ thread on volks and allies infantry.
1 Apr 2016, 04:52 AM
#23
Posts: 1026
It's kind of amazing as to how many balance headaches have been caused by the single decision to equip Volksgrenadiers with Panzerschrecks. In my 2v2 and 3v3 AT games, I can't even remember the last time we faced OKW but didn't have to deal with at least one Volks-Shrek blob. It's not that it's unbeatable, but boy is it stale. It's been stale for over a year now.
1 Apr 2016, 05:05 AM
#24
Posts: 1384
Only if we're talking Vet 0 Volks vs. Vet 0 Cons ( IMO for cost they trade a bit too well when you factor in starting Strumpio vs. Engineer too). Otherwise they are fine and start losing out in the late game when you have Vetted Rifles/Tommys with upgrades.
The late game doesn't matter, they just become mobile AT that never misses. You get Obers or Falls to put out the real damage by that point.
1 Apr 2016, 05:11 AM
#25
Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1
The late game doesn't matter, they just become mobile AT that never misses. You get Obers or Falls to put out the real damage by that point.
So it's fine then, because OKW'll be using two units for combined arms
1 Apr 2016, 07:10 AM
#26
Posts: 372
It's not that it's unbeatable, but boy is it stale. It's been stale for over a year now.
1 Apr 2016, 08:30 AM
#27
Posts: 284
nerf the volks because nerf the volks...
WTF is with relic?! 90MU AT weapon can damage vehicles...
WTF is with relic?! 90MU AT weapon can damage vehicles...
1 Apr 2016, 08:54 AM
#28
Posts: 474
I'm not competent enough to comment on balance, but I find it ironic that these Volksgrenadiers, which were meant to be late war divisions supplemented with old men and teenage boys are superior to the Ostheer's regular grenadiers.
1 Apr 2016, 09:04 AM
#29
Posts: 500
I'm not competent enough to comment on balance, but I find it ironic that these Volksgrenadiers, which were meant to be late war divisions supplemented with old men and teenage boys are superior to the Ostheer's regular grenadiers.
They aren't. Besides, you're thinking of Volkssturm, and not Volksgrenadiers.
1 Apr 2016, 09:17 AM
#30
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Don't want to see faust added to Volks, makes them too much like all the other infantry.
Remove schreck, add 2x Panzerbusche, buff raketen. Keep the faction unique.
They are durable as rifles(not when vetted though, unless we talk ooc heal vs rec acc as both affect staying power).
They are packed with utility like cons(flame nades, possible doctrinal cancer nades, hard at, build sanbags).
They punch like grens(actually, they surpass grens unless grens go LMG).
They only lack cover acc bonus, other then that, they already have something from every other infantry squad, so they are pretty much like all the other infantry in one unit already.
And they definitely won't get weapon that wasn't used for years already.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
1 Apr 2016, 09:29 AM
#31
Posts: 2742
Panzerfausts on Volksgrenadiers that dealt 120 or even 160 damage instead of schrecks would work to retain the apparently necessary tank sniping, but create a continuous munitions bleed. It doesn't even have to snare.
Tank and raketen support would be paramount. Sturms or Obers are still candidates for Panzerschrecks for that reliable infantry AT, and are much less spammable. I personally think Obers are the natural choice, as Sturms have pretty stretched responsibilities as it is, but for some reason people freak at that notion, even if its combined with a powerful volksgrenadier panzerfaust.
Tank and raketen support would be paramount. Sturms or Obers are still candidates for Panzerschrecks for that reliable infantry AT, and are much less spammable. I personally think Obers are the natural choice, as Sturms have pretty stretched responsibilities as it is, but for some reason people freak at that notion, even if its combined with a powerful volksgrenadier panzerfaust.
Strategic Territory Points Mod:
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=604491510
Classic resource points!
1 Apr 2016, 09:50 AM
#32
Posts: 474
They aren't. Besides, you're thinking of Volkssturm, and not Volksgrenadiers.
No, I specifically checked the facts before posting. From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volksgrenadier:
They were organized around small cadres of hardened veteran soldiers, NCOs and officers, and then bulked out with anything the Replacement Army could supply: "jobless" personnel of the shrinking Kriegsmarine and Luftwaffe, wounded soldiers from broken formations returning to duty from hospitals, older men who would have been considered too old or too unfit for the peacetime army and teenagers were recruited into the ranks.
1 Apr 2016, 10:45 AM
#33
Posts: 500
No, I specifically checked the facts before posting. From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volksgrenadier:
Oh, I didn't know that.
Anyway, Volks are still worse yet cost more.
1 Apr 2016, 10:53 AM
#34
Posts: 2693 | Subs: 1
I don't think volks need a nerf.
1 Apr 2016, 10:59 AM
#35
Posts: 260
Volks are the worst OKW unit period, and making more than 2 or 3 is an epic waste of manpower, as you will be reinforcing them endlessly all game after every engagement. Better to spend the manpower on LeIG, Puppchen, IR HT, literally anything else.
So why do people blob them? Because newbs don't know what they are doing with OKW, and the people who can't beat a Volks blob know even less.
When you just start out playing a faction, you don't know your left hand from your right. As you play, you realize you do pretty well as long as you stick to units that are versatile. After all, no matter what situation you are in they will do OK. Units like this for OKW are Volks, P4, Panther and the like.
As you begin to learn something about the faction over time you begin to realize you cannot win against players better than you with the versatile units. You need an edge, something a little stronger. So you start experimenting with specialist units that are very strong but not versatile. These units will give you the edge you need, but you need experience playing the faction before you will understand when and how to use them. Examples of these units are Obers, JP, Puma, Puppchen, Flak Demag.
So in the beginning newbs will mass versatile units of only a few types, and rely on numbers to win the day. Once an expert they will prefer having a few units of all types and use them in a coordinated way for the things they are specialized for.
If you can't beat massed Volks, which competes for the worst mainline infantry in the game, you got problems.
Joseph
I would have thought you would compare stats and come to a conclusion but in the end the entire post is basically calling out players who spam volks as noobs and thosewho struggle against them are just bad. I think it's more persuasive to just post sound evidence to why they should not be nerfed rather than to attack the player base. The majority speaks out for a reason, after all.
1 Apr 2016, 10:59 AM
#36
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
Oh, I didn't know that.
Anyway, Volks are still worse yet cost more.
Worse then what? Call-in elites?
They beat grens for durability and cost effectiveness.
They stand up to rifles at long range.
They murder cons.
Vs tommies is depends on range solely.
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
1 Apr 2016, 11:03 AM
#37
Posts: 500
Worse then what? Call-in elites?
They beat grens for durability and cost effectiveness.
They stand up to rifles at long range.
They murder cons.
Vs tommies is depends on range solely.
They are worse than every other mainline inf other than conscripts. The shreck is the only redeeming factor because it's probably the best non-vehicle at in the game.
1 Apr 2016, 11:08 AM
#38
Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8
if you say so
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
1 Apr 2016, 11:09 AM
#39
Posts: 500
Good Arguments
1 Apr 2016, 11:16 AM
#40
Posts: 1217
Some people here forget that Vet4+5 Volks are supposed to be very strong. The additional Vet is OKWs redeeming factor for not being able to build caches.
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