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Double maxim spam.

14 Mar 2016, 00:34 AM
#61
avatar of Mistah_S

Posts: 851 | Subs: 1

Maxim Spam = MG42 spam.
The allies have been dealing with MG spam since launch. Every game is just a field of MG's. Deal with it. Or if you want them to nerf Maxims, the have to nerf MG42's. Lower suppressions, narrow it's cone of fire, lower range, remove amour piercing rounds. You can't have the best of all worlds. People seem to severely under rate the 180 degree cone of fire and range on the MG42's. The wide cone of fire and long range outweighs and is far more valuable than any amount of suppression, setup, speed and teardown times by far.



Lol, bugger off.
MG42 spam isnt the same. Allies have A LOT more counters to MG's than the Axis do.
Zis, Satchel, Flamethrower, Smoke
Axis have Mortar, smoke dependant on mortar and flame...

That is, if you try and do it with one unit.
A skilled player will either flank, or learn a building's blind points and use it to their advantage.

jump backJump back to quoted post12 Mar 2016, 22:49 PMClick

Again, how is okw supposed to counter this spam?

+1
14 Mar 2016, 00:48 AM
#62
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

Maxim Spam = MG42 spam.

The allies have been dealing with MG spam since launch. Every game is just a field of MG's. Deal with it. Or if you want them to nerf Maxims, the have to nerf MG42's. Lower suppressions, narrow it's cone of fire, lower range, remove amour piercing rounds. You can't have the best of all worlds. People seem to severely under rate the 180 degree cone of fire and range on the MG42's. The wide cone of fire and long range outweighs and is far more valuable than any amount of suppression, setup, speed and teardown times by far.

Axis have superior mortars to allies, plenty of vehicles for dealing with MG's, and flame grenades for when you can flank it.

Dude that's like saying cons spam = volks spam
And about the aa half track 1 can fire on the move the other ....
14 Mar 2016, 16:25 PM
#63
avatar of whitesky00

Posts: 468

An exact copy of this thread exist. https://www.coh2.org/topic/49148/the-maxim-hmg-needs-a-hotfix


Tier0-1 HMGs do not allow a fair gameplay. Vickers is the worst offender.


Case closed.


I see post about maxim and vickers on T0-1 not be equal. How come I don't see you mention mg42.. it's T0 too.

how about just increasing the cost of the maxim to 260mp? mg42 had the same issue and increasing its price fixed it.


No, it did not. The price increase was to justify moving it from T1 to T0.



Lol, bugger off.
MG42 spam isnt the same. Allies have A LOT more counters to MG's than the Axis do.
Zis, Satchel, Flamethrower, Smoke
Axis have Mortar, smoke dependant on mortar and flame...

That is, if you try and do it with one unit.
A skilled player will either flank, or learn a building's blind points and use it to their advantage.



I don't see people using ZiS and Satchels to counter mg42 (satchels for buildings/bunkers, not to mention nobody uses T1 SOV). They use snipers, mortars, grenades, smoke and flanking. Of which all are available to OST. As OKW, it's just a super heavy micro tax to deal with.


Dude that's like saying cons spam = volks spam
And about the aa half track 1 can fire on the move the other ....


One requires you to rear reverse in order to shoot and also requires standstill to fire penetration rounds. The other one has 360 degree firing arc and every shot is the same along with smoke. I think it's fair that both have their differences.

And, this all came about because 2 years ago they nerfed suppression from MGs and after WFA, un-nerfed and gave back the suppression because of the blobby factions USF/OKW a couple of months ago? We'll have to wait and see what happens in the next patch update.
14 Mar 2016, 18:12 PM
#64
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474

one needs to stand still to attack and the other not they both shred LV but from my understanding you are saying dat a Mobil suppression platform is equal to an immobile one ...
Does that mean that the okw aa track can maybe get same hp as Bofors ? (The return of the beast)
14 Mar 2016, 18:21 PM
#65
avatar of whitesky00

Posts: 468

one needs to stand still to attack and the other not they both shred LV but from my understanding you are saying dat a Mobil suppression platform is equal to an immobile one ...
Does that mean that the okw aa track can maybe get same hp as Bofors ? (The return of the beast)


Does that mean you can give bofors 1920 HP of Flak HQ with armor penetrating rounds and suppression?
14 Mar 2016, 18:37 PM
#66
avatar of Stug life

Posts: 4474



Does that mean you can give bofors 1920 HP of Flak HQ with armor penetrating rounds and suppression?

Well if it cost 120 fu and no barrage yes
14 Mar 2016, 18:55 PM
#67
avatar of voltardark

Posts: 976

Problem with maxim spam is :
-Lack of any AT option in T1
-Countering blobing

How to counter maxim spam : one of many solutions :
OKW : Sandbags, bunkers + leIGs , fall or infiltration tactic
Wer : mortars.

Thx.
14 Mar 2016, 20:06 PM
#68
avatar of Bulgakov

Posts: 987

Problem with maxim spam is :
-Lack of any AT option in T1
-Countering blobing

How to counter maxim spam : one of many solutions :
OKW : Sandbags, bunkers + leIGs , fall or infiltration tactic
Wer : mortars.

Thx.


How to reply like Voltardark:

Play only allies (not a crime in itself)

Talk as if you know both perspectives. Be as glib as possible (check dictionary for definition of glib)

Ignore any information that contradicts with your narrow-minded viewpoint.

Write thanks at the end even when (especially when) you don't mean it.

Thanks.
14 Mar 2016, 20:09 PM
#69
avatar of Bulgakov

Posts: 987

Maxim Spam = MG42 spam.

The allies have been dealing with MG spam since launch. Every game is just a field of MG's. Deal with it. Or if you want them to nerf Maxims, the have to nerf MG42's. Lower suppressions, narrow it's cone of fire, lower range, remove amour piercing rounds. You can't have the best of all worlds. People seem to severely under rate the 180 degree cone of fire and range on the MG42's. The wide cone of fire and long range outweighs and is far more valuable than any amount of suppression, setup, speed and teardown times by far.

Axis have superior mortars to allies, plenty of vehicles for dealing with MG's, and flame grenades for when you can flank it.


I'll bet you 50$ I can find more Maxim spam replays than MG42 spam replays.

Feel free to check VonIvan's replays as Ostheer to see how much he does it. Then watch as he blindly spams 6-8 Maxims and creates very difficult and boring games vs very good players.

Maxim > MG42
14 Mar 2016, 20:18 PM
#70
avatar of voltardark

Posts: 976



How to reply like Voltardark:

Play only allies (not a crime in itself)

Talk as if you know both perspectives. Be as glib as possible (check dictionary for definition of glib)

Ignore any information that contradicts with your narrow-minded viewpoint.

Write thanks at the end even when (especially when) you don't mean it.

Thanks.


I pity you for having such a black heart. I'm just trying to have a fun game, that it. Stop your bullshit.

In 4vs4, i don't see people maxim spamming a lot, because of the counters i posted.

I wandering if top players who have long OKW win streak find that double maxim opening that strong ?

It boring but not that strong.

I'm not that close minded as you may think either. Rather the opposite. See the other post to understand why.

Thanks for your comment anyway !
15 Mar 2016, 05:11 AM
#71
avatar of Mistah_S

Posts: 851 | Subs: 1


How to reply like Voltardark:
Play only allies (not a crime in itself)
Thanks.

I kek'd.
Especially the thanks at the end.


I pity you for having such a black heart. I'm just trying to have a fun game, that it. Stop your bullshit.

In 4vs4, i don't see people maxim spamming a lot, because of the counters i posted.


Lol, this is the internet dude. You are bound to find more bullies than IRL.
Best to ignore them.
And to be frank, you only provided 1 viable counter to Maxim spam as WER, which lead me to believe you only play Allies

15 Mar 2016, 15:49 PM
#72
avatar of voltardark

Posts: 976


I kek'd.
Especially the thanks at the end.



Lol, this is the internet dude. You are bound to find more bullies than IRL.
Best to ignore them.
And to be frank, you only provided 1 viable counter to Maxim spam as WER, which lead me to believe you only play Allies



For sure i'm playing Allies and mostly 4vs4 : I also said that i will start playing the Axis when their average win ration get lower the Allies one.

I really love Axis Units, but i'm just used to play the underdog since Vcoh... and usually, it's the allies that are on the losing side so i'have played them for a long time.

I'just want a closely enough balanced game to be fun.

Maxims spam:
Best counter for any Hmgs are smoke, mortars smoke,mortar shells, arty, flame nades, flanking, pio flamers, demo charge + smoke, infiltrations tactics. Puma smoke.

Try to veto maps where there is no possibility of flanking. (in 4vs4, the map are large, so maxims spam is less a problem.)

Finally, sure OKW don't have much smoke, (exct. Puma). But like molotovs, flame nades can block los sometime.

Thanks :)
15 Mar 2016, 16:29 PM
#73
avatar of A big guy 4u

Posts: 168

Absurd.

Do you have any idea that soviet early game pretty much revolves around the maxim?

Cons have no non-doctrinal weapons, and will get slaughtered by grenadiers with MG42s.

Also, MG42 is already better than the maxim. It has the best MG special ability while maxim gets a useless sprint.

And in case you didn't notice, MG42 has a much higher fire rate, and german mortars are now absurdly more accurate compared to soviet one.
15 Mar 2016, 16:42 PM
#74
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

Absurd.

Do you have any idea that soviet early game pretty much revolves around the maxim?

Cons have no non-doctrinal weapons, and will get slaughtered by grenadiers with MG42s.

Also, MG42 is already better than the maxim. It has the best MG special ability while maxim gets a useless sprint.

And in case you didn't notice, MG42 has a much higher fire rate, and german mortars are now absurdly more accurate compared to soviet one.


Relic is aware and from what they said, they won't nerfing maxims without buffing something in return.

Relic always intended maxim to be soviet LMG squad with suppression, this is how it ends up.
15 Mar 2016, 16:50 PM
#75
avatar of Jadek

Posts: 80

Maxims are fines. What an outrage that a MG actualy supress inf. Cons and penals need some love, that's all.

But, i think SU need a rework. This faction is very predictable atm.

EDIT: And snipers arn't viable, so nobody use them, it's a shame for a SU faction. Lack of possibilities in early. Especially against OKW.
15 Mar 2016, 17:26 PM
#76
avatar of Australian Magic

Posts: 4630 | Subs: 2

Yesterday I a-moved 2 maxims to attack HMG42 behind green cover. I red-suppressed HMG and force it to retreat :foreveralone:
15 Mar 2016, 17:57 PM
#77
avatar of Thamor

Posts: 290

Maxim > MG42 period.

Green cover don't usually work, because of model pathfinding to cover vs incoming fire. One is holding his pinky behind the cover, so everyone is suppressed :)

The easiest fix to maxims, is just make it have longer set-up / tearing times.
15 Mar 2016, 18:08 PM
#78
avatar of Drink

Posts: 27

AOE supperession ignores cover. This is a problem.
So the problem is NOT in maxims.
And remove those annoying U-turns and "death loops". Its annoying as hell.
15 Mar 2016, 18:11 PM
#79
avatar of zarok47

Posts: 587

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Mar 2016, 18:08 PMDrink
AOE supperession ignores cover. This is a problem.
So the problem is NOT in maxims.
And remove those annoying U-turns and "death loops". Its annoying as hell.


So buff the maxim more?

Sure go ahead, i always wanted a top 10 spot.
15 Mar 2016, 18:30 PM
#80
avatar of Drink

Posts: 27

jump backJump back to quoted post15 Mar 2016, 18:11 PMzarok47


So buff the maxim more?

Sure go ahead, i always wanted a top 10 spot.


Im asking about fixing AoE suppression first.
This thing is even worse than maxims' U-turns and death loops because it affecs core gameplay mechanics.
Right now any mg has hard time shooting at squard in green cover BUT if mg shoots at nearbly squad in neutral cover that squad in green cover will be pinned in no time.
Thats why volks' sandbags don't help against maxims.
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