Fixing Volks - MP40s for shrecks

Whatever they do I would not like to see a snare on Volks, it makes them too much like every other infantry squad.

Tommies be like

(I'm just kidding with ya)

Whatever they do I would not like to see a snare on Volks, it makes them too much like every other infantry squad.

+1 on that

Whilst I don't think snares would be game breaking, Pre-AEC Brits are a prime example of what can happen to a faction without some sort of vehicle CC. They get rekt early-midgame. Hard. Then again, OKW has a cheap, T0 retreatable, cloaking AT gun and base defenses that prevent light vehicles diving.

Would be interesting to see balance preview mod.

Ya 1945 we still have germans using AT rifles. Sorry but no.

Ya 1945 we still have germans using AT rifles. Sorry but no.

I'm pretty sure when it comes to any army in general, esp late war Germany, it'll come down to using whatever's in your arsenal rather than what everyone would love to use

I'm pretty sure when it comes to any army in general, esp late war Germany, it'll come down to using whatever's in your arsenal rather than what everyone would love to use

Dont know why we can't be historical & aesthetic. While also balanced.

Suggestions like these have been floating about a lot, I've made some myself. That being said:
Schrecks on mainline infantry right now are a gameplay, not a balance problem. It makes for some lame mechanics, but its not actually an issue on the competitive plane in my opinion.
Right now there is no other viable squad to give Schrecks to. Schrecks on Sturms or Obers is frankly an absurd suggestion. Obers are already situational as is, come out of T4, and are absolutely needed to do the heavy lifting in the AI department for OKW in the lategame. Sturms are already needed for sweeping and repairs, changing them to an auxiliary AT role in addition to that would overtax them. I think the Op is correct when he says that a change like this would require an additional, dedicated AT squad to be created from scratch.
Just a few random remarks.

-Mp 40s are a downgrade and would be a totally unattractive choice. Have you guys ever tried using assgrens past the 5 minute mark?
-Kiting Schrecks with medium tanks is definetly possible. Heck, its doable with light tanks, within reason.

Make the volk's combat package (schrecks) available after you purchase an upgrade from the med hq for 250 mp & 20 fuel (kind of like soviet AT package), then make the combat package (schrecks) itself cost 100 muni instead of 90 muni. It would make the OKW have to invest more into their schreck blobs of doom, instead of getting rid of it entirely.

Suggestions like these have been floating about a lot, I've made some myself. That being said:
Schrecks on mainline infantry right now are a gameplay, not a balance problem. It makes for some lame mechanics, but its not actually an issue on the competitive plane in my opinion.
Right now there is no other viable squad to give Schrecks to. Schrecks on Sturms or Obers is frankly an absurd suggestion. Obers are already situational as is, come out of T4, and are absolutely needed to do the heavy lifting in the AI department for OKW in the lategame. Sturms are already needed for sweeping and repairs, changing them to an auxiliary AT role in addition to that would overtax them. I think the Op is correct when he says that a change like this would require an additional, dedicated AT squad to be created from scratch.
Just a few random remarks.

-Mp 40s are a downgrade and would be a totally unattractive choice. Have you guys ever tried using assgrens past the 5 minute mark?
-Kiting Schrecks with medium tanks is definetly possible. Heck, its doable with light tanks, within reason.

Could buff the MP40s so they're more useable at short-medium range They are very situational weapons but the option is always there where they will outperform Kars. Usually, assgrens have trouble in the sense that they have to make ground before their MP40s have any effect which means they would tend to lose a few models and a lot of their theoretical DPM as a result. But with a creative use of Truesight, it definitely could have some utility.

Make the volk's combat package (schrecks) available after you purchase an upgrade from the med hq for 250 mp & 20 fuel (kind of like soviet AT package), then make the combat package (schrecks) itself cost 100 muni instead of 90 muni. It would make the OKW have to invest more into their schreck blobs of doom, instead of getting rid of it entirely.

Considering the light vehicle meta that the Allies tend to use, this would mean that it would be ages till you will get schreks and infantry will get run over by all manners of T70s and Light vehicles, I don't think that is an option.

Volk blobs of doom tends to be a problem in the endgame, not early or early-midgame.

Dont know why we can't be historical & aesthetic. While also balanced.

As long as light skinned vehicles are used by armies, AT-rifles can always serve some purpose.

Hell even the Soviets used AT rifles when fighting the Japs and those were quite devastating.

I'm pretty sure when it comes to any army in general, esp late war Germany, it'll come down to using whatever's in your arsenal rather than what everyone would love to use

Germany has an excess of Panzerfausts, it was the most common infantry anti-tank weapon in the German arsenal and responsible for most of Allied tank losses. Compared to that, I only know of one recorded use of an AT Rifle by Volksgrenadiers.

I would say there needs to be a 15-25 muni non-snaring panzerfaust variant that hits like a panzerschreck, unlocked when one truck is down.

When two trucks are down, a 180 muni 2 panzerschreck upgrade for volks.

Investing munitions in early fausts would delay reliable and cost efficient schrecks. It's easy for light vehicles to be overwhelmed by multiple schrecks, but they still have a chance against fausts.

If an allied player doesn't press OKW to use fausts enough with their light vehicles early on, they suffer the wrath of a dedicated AT squad.

Currently, being able to spread schrecks out across multiple 5 man squads keeps schrecks in relative safety. Five man squads are much harder to wipe than 4 man squads, and purchasing schrecks at 90 muni intervals allows for steady production of handheld AT while still maintaining AI strength. It's also harder to drop schrecks on the field, as the likelihood that the model holding a schreck dies is less compared to squads holding two.

I would say there needs to be a 15-25 muni non-snaring panzerfaust variant that hits like a panzerschreck, unlocked when one truck is down.

When two trucks are down, a 180 muni 2 panzerschreck upgrade for volks.

Investing munitions in early fausts would delay reliable and cost efficient schrecks. It's easy for light vehicles to be overwhelmed by multiple schrecks, but they still have a chance against fausts.

If an allied player doesn't press OKW to use fausts enough with their light vehicles early on, they suffer the wrath of a dedicated AT squad.

Currently, being able to spread schrecks out across multiple 5 man squads keeps schrecks in relative safety. Five man squads are much harder to wipe than 4 man squads, and purchasing schrecks at 90 muni intervals allows for steady production of handheld AT while still maintaining AI strength. It's also to drop schrecks on the field, as the likelihood that the model holding a schreck dies is less compared to squads holding two.

180 muni? please. no. God no.

The exact equivalent of getting it on two squads currently. How about some of that sense of resource starvation for the faction that it's supposed to be all about.

so what? geting vet isnt that hard and 1-2 shreks squads are just what you need to push tanks back.

*scoffs* By the late game those volks are going to be at the most vet 2 and have to kill more infantry to get to vet 3 lol

Tommies be like

(I'm just kidding with ya)

Sniper walked into my section today. Sniper scoffed at them and ran away 0.5% of health.

1. Sure so now you have to upgrade them to make them useless to fight in range combats, so you just give free vet to all allied infantry that fight on range.
2. Okay volks get faust and the Raketens range doesn't let you kill the vehicle then.
3. Lel no.

Pls doggy no one is that stupid to send a volk(s)/sturmpio(s) into a rifle blob at long range. Unless you would do that.

Use them like you would use sturmpios durrrr.

Also not saying upgrade all your volks with mp40s lol. Then you have no ranged units to fight with except obers and call in units.

A look at CoH1 for example. Do you ever walk Vet 3 MP40 Volks up to Vet 3 BAR Rifles? No you straight up lose when you walk up. You have to use a long range unit and coordinate a flank with your other units. And it has always worked out.

I recommend Panzerbusche at rifles.

They are already in the game so Relic doesn't have to do any extra work besides moving some numbers around to make them work like the other at rifles.

These would be a mostly defensive weapon for early game to survive the light vehicle pushes. Late game they can already rely on their Raketen, Puma, Jagdpanzer, and panther for strong AT presence.

Whatever they do I would not like to see a snare on Volks, it makes them too much like every other infantry squad.

I like this idea. Buff some OKW support weapons while youre at it

I am a fan of the PanzerJager squad that spawns with AT rifles and can acquire shreks at a later time (muni cost or vet)
it would allow the okw to have a better counter to lights but still retain powerful AT for later

Adding side munitions cost to various OKW abilities and you'll get ride of your shreckvolks blob of doom.

Isn't it evident that if you make OKW pay munition for unlocking the healing/FRP reinforcement, repair station, T3 gun, the shreck blob will naturally be less powerful? And if it is not enough make them pay the shreck/flamnade package in mp/fuel.

If you have to select between early shreck or early healing, what will you chose? If you have to select between your second shreck and FRP ability, what will you chose?
there is no good or bad answers, but whatever you select you'll not be able to get everything at the same time.

volks must have 2 upgrade: MP40 package (doctrinal) and pnzschreck
pls relic we need balance preview

Give them only 2, so they are on the like with ppsh conscripts