Remove FRP? yay or nay.

Hello.

I do not see the problem with blobbing nor the fear generated. Someone complaining about a blob surely never saw an explosion in this game. I was part of an interesting thread earlier that involve offensive language so i wont drop a "L2P", but still....

Back to the OP, i voted NO. i see the problem prople are pointing with FRP but they tend to forget what it costs and what it involves.

Usually it cost a squad or two, just to be able to retreat less far. It is an impressive cost. i know what i can do with an extra volk squad.
It can also be easily destroyed with the exception of the meditruck for obvious reasons.
It is a mousetrap, thoses FRP are easily targeted by Offmap strike rsulting in even more deaths.
They promote teamplay which is something that doesnt hurt in this game.

The Noob-mass-retreat is not an issue as you spend a whole squad to be able to do this, it compensate for your lesser force.

Creating urban defenses is Cool™.

Kozo.

Well please refer to poll results.

I have "1 less" squad for 1-2 minutes because that's how much manpower I'll get back. All I have to do is play defensively until that happens and now I'm at an advantage for the rest of the game as long as the retreat point exists. There is NO punishment for a forward point because you can disable it with one click.

As SU, I would be forced to use support weapons to contain them. One wrong mistake and those very same weapons will be used against me.
As OST, the same against USF. Lose an MG42 or mortar... and it's not going to be fun for the rest of the game. However, USF doesn't get their FRP until minimum 170 fuel without any other side techs/vehicles.

I agree with thread creator. Forward reinforce point is fine. Forward retreat point is retarded.
What would happen to OKW med truck? It would just be a soft retreat reinforce point. No hard retreats. UKF's the same and it supports their emplacements and gives weapons rack. Major can just be a pathfinder squad or something.

If you look at my playercard, I play as USF and I VOTE for FRP REMOVAL.

Major needs to lose FRP but OKW needs to keep there's, they need it to maintain map presence because of their resource penalty and the fact that 235 MP volks get outshot by all allied infantry.

Major needs to lose FRP but OKW needs to keep there's, they need it to maintain map presence because of their resource penalty and the fact that 235 MP volks get outshot by all allied infantry.

Ah, I thought I was playing coh2 in 2016. My mistake.

OKW med trucks, with retreat point, out right ruin early game fights for Axis vs. Allies in 3v3+. Automatically gives them field presence at no cost before any Allied unit can seriously contest them, snowballs from there. Extremely synergistic with Wehr. Encourages blobs, doesn't add anything to game, two factions don't have them and suffer vs. those that do.

I'll rather have the poll be 1v1, 2v2 an 3v3+. I'm fine with FRP for the first 2 options (90% of the 2v2map pool) but not on 3v3 maps.

I have a GREAT IDEA

Make it's only a 10% chance that the squad retreats to the FRP.

"Every retreat tells a story" would be proud

Ah, I thought I was playing coh2 in 2016. My mistake.

Maybe he is using irony (not sure on this forums although)

It needs to go imo, no army should have the advantage over another for being able to deploy droops on the front line in no time. It kinda ruins the pace of the game, some armies have to really fight to hold territory with bigger risks of losing ground, while others can just bounce back in.

I'll rather have the poll be 1v1, 2v2 an 3v3+. I'm fine with FRP for the first 2 options (90% of the 2v2map pool) but not on 3v3 maps.
...

that's what i thought but i don't consider any other 2v2 maps than Vaux and others similar in size as true 2v2 maps i.e. minsk or kharkov.

Major needs to lose FRP but OKW needs to keep there's, they need it to maintain map presence because of their resource penalty and the fact that 235 MP volks get outshot by all allied infantry.

lol, are you trolling? sarcasm? or just... plain (insert offensive words here).

First, you'll remove USF FRP but not OKW... bias straight out
Second, OKW does not have a resource penalty...
Third, volks cost 250 MP...

Moderators need to remove troll posts or those that are just flat out wrong please...

Will do

Lol. You are going to ignore me cos a stranger told you to. Think for yourself much?
This guy pugzii is just pissed because he couldn't perceive sarcasm in a thread I made about rifle blobs that was an exact cut and paste of an anti volks thread.

I'd remove them, I don't think they bring anything interesting to the table.

All they do, is enable your blob to be back in action faster. This is an especially huge advantage in team games with large maps.

for those who voted no,

what would you think of:

1) a munition cost for each usage of a FRP, that way they are not gone, but actually have a true "cost", because right now, its hella cheap for what it does, and teh benefit it gives.

2) pushing it down the tech tree

3) re-buying it after usage, MP bleep for the convenience.

any of those work for ya?

for those who voted no,

what would you think of:

1) a munition cost for each usage of a FRP, that way they are not gone, but actually have a true "cost", because right now, its hella cheap for what it does, and teh benefit it gives.

2) pushing it down the tech tree

3) re-buying it after usage, MP bleep for the convenience.

any of those work for ya?

what about man power keep up? 10 pop?

The bigger the maps are, the more FRPs are a problem and the more SU/OH are in a disadvantage. Please remove them.

Ye especially Hill 331. 4 OKW can be unbeatable.

what about man power keep up? 10 pop?

upkeep would actually be pretty nice, wouldnt want it to be bypassed with the toggle though. you could hotkey it and avoid the bleed pretty easy.

cant speak on popcap, as i dont know the values until i have none left

I have "1 less" squad for 1-2 minutes because that's how much manpower I'll get back.

(Sorry if i dont quote your whole text, dont take it as a cherrypicking i just want to refer to something)
I fail to see how you can get your MP back, what is spend is lost. At equal ressource generation, youll have 1 less squad than your opponent. I find that huge. Makes you bleed and use that FRP more than you want to. The very few times i make the upgrade on a okw truck, i dont want to use it, it is a security net. I prefer retreat-walking and have an additional volkgrenadier.

To be fair, i d'ilke to see at least five replays where there was a FRP, it was uncounterable, uncoutered and was the obvious reason of the unevitable victory (no stuka army-whipe involved equal tactics and talent).


Kozo.

(Sorry if i dont quote your whole text, dont take it as a cherrypicking i just want to refer to something)
I fail to see how you can get your MP back, what is spend is lost. At equal ressource generation, youll have 1 less squad than your opponent. I find that huge. Makes you bleed and use that FRP more than you want to. The very few times i make the upgrade on a okw truck, i dont want to use it, it is a security net. I prefer retreat-walking and have an additional volkgrenadier.

To be fair, i d'ilke to see at least five replays where there was a FRP, it was uncounterable, uncoutered and was the obvious reason of the unevitable victory (no stuka army-whipe involved equal tactics and talent).


Kozo.

it is not one squad less because a "squad" or "unit" cost popcap. So Conscript is 240mp + 6 popcap.

this is one of the problems with FRP and caches alike. 30sec - 2min off the retreat time or guaranteed resource income is a very delicate thing to put a price on, therefore hard to balance. this is especially true if you try to balance it with one time payment as in 300mp for okw and 200mp for brits. major technically have popcap but its like a free thing for teching.

Oh you mean that the popcap not used while upgrading will cover the addition of a squad later. I admit i do not have any clue about the time it takes to "compensate".

Kozo.

I think that FRP is not bad, it just simply TOO EARLY.

By the time FRP is accessible, NO EFFECTIVE COUNTER is available.

It's the same as german facing Soviet Forward Headquarter in the past.

So there are actually two solutions:
- Make FRP available at very late, when rocket artillery is accessible.
- OR make rocket artillery access more earlier.

And one more thing: give Land Mattress to brit. They are the only faction which lack of rocket artillery.

yeah, its loss of time.

FRP allows the player to make critical mistakes and not get penalized for it. retreating a squad for Ost or Sov is a critical decision because you will lose that unit and potentially map control for 3 minutes.

with FRP it is a no-brainer, hit retreat, come back in 25 seconds.

FRP: "oh a squad is suppressed? retreat and return instantly."

No FRP: "oh a squad is suppressed? can i flank the MG? can i save enough of that squad before the MG gets them?"

it just becomes an easy button for making a mistake, which not only saves the FRP player, but takes away the reward for whoever made the right play.


Poll should change to:

remove
nerf
keep

FRP should stay. Closer the enemy FRP is the easier it is to arty with whatever you have at your disposal. People need to learn to time on-map arty with retreats tbh.