Time for Statistics

Let's wait with the statistics for another week guys, what do you say??

Some adaptation needs to be performed. And after one week let's see these statistics again. I don't try to say anithyng, let's just wait and see. If these numbers remain the same, then we could have a balance problem.

In clan we give up play as allies, until next patch.

In clan we give up play as allies, until next patch.

Cool

Trying to make statistical analysis when the number of players playing OKW has (around) quadruple in the same time frame can be extremely misleading...


So no it is not actually time for statistics yet...

Do it again and explain us how to use the meta with Brit
After all you are our Strategist in this forum. I'd love to read you about Brit and new meta.

Yes, that why I´m here.

First I will make my assumtions about OKW and brits.

Think you need to notice: Nerf of churchill , nerf of IS , bugged buildings - flak weapons do almost none damage to them and okw only counter to building is flak weaponry or incing nade.
Fast luchs meta . if okw loose flakHQ they cannot produce tanks.

So in first minutes you need to win fight agains mix of volks and pis and posibly kill kubel.
I would recommend mg , IS , mg build order , with posible UC if he make kubel. With UC you can kill kubel , upgrade with flamer (counter to building) and also bait luchs on mine.

You IS will be frontline and mg will be behind them to cover your line with supression.
You will need to focus on your point of map and harrass OKW cut off with IS and mg when he make full reteat - this can slow luchs by a lot.

Now comes mid game you tech for AT gun and engineers and sniper. To place lot of mines and then kill it with AT gun. Or you can go 1 AT squad if you have that commader (if you get drop , but this second strat can work too).

Hope you get sniper to vet 1 before he rush luchs or place lot of mines in are where oyu have sniper mgs and at gun.

Once you have 2 engineers and 2 IS I recommend going 5th squd memeber upgrade , but dont go weapons because you need to use munny on mines.

With good defnsive plan and counterattacks on cut off you will go to late game with tank bonus (he need to backtech for medics , luchs failed , you floated fuel).

No i recommend going 2 cromwells and second sniper so you will constantly bleed him , hold line and attack cut off.

in very late game you can go comet of firefly (depends on his armor)

Hope it helped you .

Recap : cut off play , defensive
mg ,IS , mg (UC)
tech
sniper (or go first at gun and mines if you failed to get half map and sometimes harrass)
engi => mines
AT gun
engi
squad booster
tech
cromwell
weapons (bren guns)
sniper
cromwell
comet/firefly (or AT gun)

Hope it helped you.


Agains ostheer it remains almost the same (except late game) as before
mg , IS
tech
sniper to countersnipe (you need micro)
engineer for mines for fast 222
At gun to finish 222
IS
squad booster
mortar pit(goes well with AVRE doctrine) if he have no mortar halftrack , else another engi
tech
fast centaur / cromwell - depends on ma control
another AT gun
weapons (you spammed mines before)
cromwell
posiblly AVRE to counter pak wall
comets to counter axis stuff.

5 main points
1. defense
2.cut off
3. sniper
4.mines
5.fast mid game tank


HOPE I HELPED YOU

It might have something to do with nobody using emplacements any longer and players actually realizing after wiping all the tears that emplacements aren't that hard to counter

That's exactly why lol. Maybe seeing a rushed luchs becomes all too common and countered more often. Meta changing etc.. Brits were basically same at first.

I think that once the popcap requirement get (hopefully) hotfixed, OKW will be less ridiculous since they won't be able to field 6 Volks for 30 pop anymore.

Yeah, the popcap issue is a large part of many of the problems.

In clan we give up play as allies, until next patch.

Did your clan play only allied before patch? Lel.

Did your clan play only allied before patch? Lel.

Come to think of, when was your last match as Ally Johnny?

Giving OKW side tech as well as linear tech tree would fix a lot of issues. If all we look at is 1v1 win ratios we have another issue but OKW getting 100% resources without tech changes is balance suicide as everyone else was timed to OKW tech.

So pls, we need a patch/hot fix to adjust OKW tech to other factions now that they have 100% resource income.

Ok, lets see. Many people say that game is actually balanced in 1s. I don't know since I mainly play 2s, and in 2s Axis (meaning OKW) are over performing. In 3s and 4s it seems that the condition is even worse.

So, what if they simply add the resource handicap to OKW again for team games. Judging by the comments, main issues are:

1. OKW low popcap and upkeep cost
2. Fast light, medium, heavy and super heavy armor (11-15 minutes KT)

Wouldn't a resource penalty for team games fix this?

PS: This is just hypothetical since Relic has already said that they won't do such thing (balance game modes separately).

Side upgrades may go a long way towards helping things. Then people can still choose to rush out a tank hard, but then they won't be throwing flame nades, etc... This will give the other person something to notice and react to.

#SmokeandFlank

But seriously I don't understand the argument that "Number of people playing OKW is inflated so wait for it to drop before looking at win rates"

Win rates is win rates which is dictated by player skill and faction strength. Unless someone has insider knowledge of higher OKW search % resulting in lopsided ELO matching in OKW's favor (which doesn't make sense because more Axis players = a wider range of ELO to properly match against) then a higher win % suddenly generally suggests that faction strength is at least partially the cause.

Okay, yes you expect an increase in win % due to lack of adaptation to new OKW strategies and unit timings early on but the current win % increase is rather large AND its's against all 3 Allied factions AND its in all 4 game modes (so it's not like OKW is inflating their wins against an overnerfed UKF in 1v1 or whatever you want to argue).

If you hear hoof beats think horses not zebras. Inflated win % generally would suggest that OKW is overperforming. Let'll all be honest with ourselves here.

#SmokeandFlank

But seriously I don't understand the argument that "Number of people playing OKW is inflated so wait for it to drop before looking at win rates"

Win rates is win rates which is dictated by player skill and faction strength.

IF 1000 games are played with axis and 500 are played with allies in the top 150 players, that means that axis played 500 games against players who are outside that skill bracket. Which means that axis will have an inflated win rates because they are playing against weaker skilled players.

IF 1000 games are played with axis and 500 are played with allies in the top 150 players, that means that axis played 500 games against players who are outside that skill bracket. Which means that axis will have an inflated win rates because they are playing against weaker skilled players.

Doesn't that mean you are assuming that all 1000 and 500 are seeking concurrently? RL doesn't work that way. The raw number of games played doesn't say anything about when they were played or what the Allied skill level was like when it was played.

You're making several assumptions including that the pools of top 150 Axis and Allied players is mutually exclusive and that all the top 150 allied players are all hoping on the OKW seek bandwagon. How can we know that the top 150 Allied players are seeking in such short supply that the top 150 Axis demand always exceeds the Allied supply? It's also possible that the playtimes of Axis and Allied top 150 varies enough ELO matching is still close enough.

Even if we concede that Axis Top 150 demand is indeed exceeding supply then ELO matching still applies and we would assume that the person matched is still as close as possible in skill level. Are we going to argue that the skill set of a top 150 player vs. say a top 250 or 300 player is such a wide gap that it precludes OKW faction strength as being a contributing factor if not the main factor?

I don't think so.

Doesn't that mean you are assuming that all 1000 and 500 are seeking concurrently? RL doesn't work that way. The raw number of games played doesn't say anything about when they were played or what the Allied skill level was like when it was played.

I was simplifying it a bit to make my point clear. In reality we assume that both factions have an equal chance of playing better skilled, equally skilled and lesser skilled players. However if there's 1000 axis games in the top 150 and 500 in the allied top 150, that means that there's a lot more axis games in the lesser skilled player category than the better skilled/equally skilled. It's simply impossible otherwise: axis always have to play against allies.

The difference between a top 150 player and a top 300 player is enough to account for a 10% difference in win rate.


I just think that using this site as any sort of evidence of balance is stupid. It can help indicate trends, but it's not absolute. The reality is that OKW playing quite a bit differently will throw players off at a high level of play. And they will lose more games to OKW because of it. Likewise, Brits being changed is enough to make people who had a very simplistic playstyle before struggle because the things they relied on were changed. Most players are strict metagame followers and don't have an adaptive bone in their body.

Check todays stats, its even worse the okw win rate has skyrocket while again while the UKF and US are still in a nose dive.

http://coh2chart.com/

I am skipping this patch. This game is not even competitive when you have OP OKW running around. Relic could've at least tested this for months with beta like system and throw in the new commanders. There was no need to release 2 new commanders right when we got Pershing and Hetzer.

Nice presented OP, good work !

I really hope Relic will listed to us and fix the OKW opness and UKF poinlessness.

Thx.