British Anvil Churchill, and my thoughts.

In all seriousness, the only way to counter churchill and church croc as ostheer: Is to get triple pak wall; get triple chain stun off them; or die.

There's literally no other way you will survive otherwise. Short of JU anti tank strafe run.

Plus, pak wall is like the only decent counter to most of the UKF tanks.

Crocodile will eat a Pak wall alive. Doesn't matter if there's four or five of them.

Crocodile will eat a Pak wall alive. Doesn't matter if there's four or five of them.

Just gotta get a chain stun off at the right time and they will survive. Just gotta get it going off on max, mid range otherwise you're screwed.

High acceleration doesn't mean shit when it moves like an OKW halftrack.

The tank is some 500 manpower and 150 fuel. On top of the 200/50 Anvil specialization.

Is this the first time Axis only players have had to deal with heavy tanks or something?

Are you kidding me?

The 200/50 tech cost is equivalent to what ostheer pay to get to T4, how in the hell is that supposed to be some kind of martydom for the British?

On top of that they also get FREE ultra engineers that magically gain LMG's and 2 armor, making them more durable than shocks. With double brens these guys are fucking terminators and if they hit vet 3, which is relatively easy to do, they have a reinforce cost of 13MP. They have the long range dps of an ober squad and cost half as much.

So not only does getting the anvil specialization get you the ultimate tank, it gets you the cheapest, and one of the most effective infantry squads in the game. For kicks they even get a -50% reload time in cover. Put them in a building and watch as an entire army can't dig them out.

There is no fucking reason the churchhill should have 1600H and not be put in the same class as a heavy tank. For christ's sake a Tiger only has just over a 1000 and the KT has 1280. Give it a slight price decrease and up its armor while dropping its HP to something that isn't in the realm of insanity. being able to take 10 shots from a panther or AT gun is way over the top and basically makes the tank immortal in the hands of a competent player.

No unit should be able to hardcounter units that are designed to hardcounter it, that's just shitty balance.

I do not agree at all with imposing a limit of one. It isn't a true Heavy Tank. It's an Infantry Support Tank. I would much rather see it's gun penetration or armour adjusted before anything else. Just my opinion.

That's really all I'm asking, is for opinions on the subject, and ways to make it so people don't pump out 3 of the things and use only them. I actually played a game with a guy who built them against a jagdtiger and tiger, and when I suggested he get a firefly or 2 to help counter some of the heavy armor he told me to eff off... Kind of funny my comet and firefly's did been than his 3 Churchills... Ha!

Meant better, damn auto correct...

That's really all I'm asking, is for opinions on the subject, and ways to make it so people don't pump out 3 of the things and use only them. I actually played a game with a guy who built them against a jagdtiger and tiger, and when I suggested he get a firefly or 2 to help counter some of the heavy armor he told me to eff off... Kind of funny my comet and firefly's did been than his 3 Churchills... Ha!

Jagdtiger is about the only thing that will stop mass churchills due to its damage of 320 vs the regular damage of 160. Again its not an issue with penetrating the dam things, its the fact that they take 10 shots to die, and that's if all 10 are successful hits and manage to penetrate. In my experience the RNG does not usually work out that way and they will simply drive up, flank you, and then grenade your paks, and focus down your armor.

+1
Churchill cost should be increased to higher pop,maybe 25 is fine,like the kingtiger.Relic lower the pop for the call-in heavies because they are limited to only one at a time.Relic don't lower the kingtiger 's pop because it's a non-doctrine heavy tank and don't have a number limit.

Or relic should lower the kingtiger's pop to 20 then limit the number to only one at a time.Same to the KT,the Churchill should be limited to only one at a time,without increasing the pop.

If the Churchill is going to get a unit limit and 25 pop cap then it needs a massive buff because its not worth that much, its just a damage sponge.

Are you kidding me?

The 200/50 tech cost is equivalent to what ostheer pay to get to T4, how in the hell is that supposed to be some kind of martydom for the British?

On top of that they also get FREE ultra engineers that magically gain LMG's and 2 armor, making them more durable than shocks. With double brens these guys are fucking terminators and if they hit vet 3, which is relatively easy to do, they have a reinforce cost of 13MP. They have the long range dps of an ober squad and cost half as much.

So not only does getting the anvil specialization get you the ultimate tank, it gets you the cheapest, and one of the most effective infantry squads in the game. For kicks they even get a -50% reload time in cover. Put them in a building and watch as an entire army can't dig them out.

There is no fucking reason the churchhill should have 1600H and not be put in the same class as a heavy tank. For christ's sake a Tiger only has just over a 1000 and the KT has 1280. Give it a slight price decrease and up its armor while dropping its HP to something that isn't in the realm of insanity. being able to take 10 shots from a panther or AT gun is way over the top and basically makes the tank immortal in the hands of a competent player.

No unit should be able to hardcounter units that are designed to hardcounter it, that's just shitty balance.

Actually 200MP/50fuel is much cheaper than the cost ost spend for teching up to T4.After the mediums T3 tech,ost must spend 100MP/45fuel to tech up first,then they have to spend 260MP/75fuel for the T4 building.It's 360MP/120 fuel. And it takes more than 1 minute while it's 30 seconds for the brits.Not to mention ost get nothing for rewards but can build a 800HP Brumbar which cost 10 more fuel than 1600HP Churchill.While the brits gain 3 special skills.

+1
Churchill cost should be increased to higher pop,maybe 25 is fine,like the kingtiger.Relic lower the pop for the call-in heavies because they are limited to only one at a time.Relic don't lower the kingtiger 's pop because it's a non-doctrine heavy tank and don't have a number limit.

Or relic should lower the kingtiger's pop to 20 then limit the number to only one at a time.Same to the KT,the Churchill should be limited to only one at a time,without increasing the pop.

25 pop for Churchill? ........ GG for Brits, How the hell in this universe do ppl think Churchill is as good as a KT that deserve a number limit?

I always say if Relic admits the 1600HP Churchills spam is ok,pls increase the ost brumbar to 1600HP too.Then I would be glad to spam brumbars so this unit will make a real sense to me.Though the ost T4 is much more expensive,I don't care.

The churchill spam has been a pain in the 4V4 games.6-7 churchills really ruin the larger team games which relic don't want to see.For me,I spam churchills every time when I play the brits,JT and elefant will be the counters?lol,they are limited to only one at a time...How to counter so many churchills???

Well this certainly escalated quickly...

Needs a slight health decrease and a fuel cost increase. (150 fuel is too cheap for the field presence it has).

Are you kidding me?

The 200/50 tech cost is equivalent to what ostheer pay to get to T4, how in the hell is that supposed to be some kind of martydom for the British?

On top of that they also get FREE ultra engineers that magically gain LMG's and 2 armor, making them more durable than shocks. With double brens these guys are fucking terminators and if they hit vet 3, which is relatively easy to do, they have a reinforce cost of 13MP. They have the long range dps of an ober squad and cost half as much.

So not only does getting the anvil specialization get you the ultimate tank, it gets you the cheapest, and one of the most effective infantry squads in the game. For kicks they even get a -50% reload time in cover. Put them in a building and watch as an entire army can't dig them out.

There is no fucking reason the churchhill should have 1600H and not be put in the same class as a heavy tank. For christ's sake a Tiger only has just over a 1000 and the KT has 1280. Give it a slight price decrease and up its armor while dropping its HP to something that isn't in the realm of insanity. being able to take 10 shots from a panther or AT gun is way over the top and basically makes the tank immortal in the hands of a competent player.

No unit should be able to hardcounter units that are designed to hardcounter it, that's just shitty balance.

I'm just saying, it's not inexpensive. It's an ultra late game unit and doesn't do a ton of damage all by itself. It absorbs a lot of damage, but it doesn't dish it like other heavy tanks do. A player who buys multiple churchills has zero mobility. Take advantage of that instead of trying to outgun them manno on manno.

This is honestly only remotely an issue in shitty 3v3/4v4 games.

Actually 200MP/50fuel is much cheaper than the cost ost spend for teching up to T4.After the mediums T3 tech,ost must spend 100MP/45fuel to tech up first,then they have to spend 260MP/75fuel for the T4 building.It's 360MP/120 fuel. And it takes more than 1 minute while it's 30 seconds for the brits.Not to mention ost get nothing for rewards but can build a 800HP Brumbar which cost 10 more fuel than 1600HP Churchill.While the brits gain 3 special skills.

Brits spend 115 or whatever it is + the 50 fuel for anvil specialization.

Total teching I believe is 180/30, 280/115, 200/50 ignoring squad counts, grenades or weapon racks. So 660/195 total before being able to purchase a Churchill for 540/150. Probably still cheaper than Germans, but that's the price you pay for better units. They also don't have many options for mid game vehicles other than the armoured car or valentine, which makes them vulnerable to early tank pressure like the luchs or ostwind as long as you don't drive into an AT gun.

If the churchill is going to be nerfed (which isnt too bad since its super tanky) then I feel like the firefly needs to be more than just a tulip carrier. Reduce the tulip cost and damage by 66% and give the main gun on the firefly better reload, even if it is around 6-7s. The reason for this is obvious the churchill is the best late game counter for heavy tanks since it outlasts most tanks but if the firefly was more consistent then people can make them for panthers/tigers/KT and not rely on spamming heavies (didnt even know that was a thing).

This topic is in regards to big team games isn't? I haven't seen 3 Churchills in 1v1 or 2v2 game even once.
If that's the case there was nothing stopping you from getting a Panther and 2 PaK each or even better Panther and a StuG each to counter them.
Why are we even going with this? I understand Croc but regular Churchill got nothing but its HP pool. You take this and there is nothing left. Don't start with this "the best acceleration" bullocks became it's nonsense. It's a slow tank and this suprime acceleration doesn't change that.

You guys should really consider that it cost 50 fuel to specialize into anvil, before buying the churchill. (Which is also expensive on man power.)

It also is stupid slow, meaning that it's only chance of escape is to pop smoke.

It's tough, but if you isolate it from the rest of the british army it's very easy to mop it up.

It cost 120 fuel to tech up to ost T4, before buying the brumbar,also the brumbar is slow,so will we increase the brumbar HP to 1600?

I'm just saying, it's not inexpensive. It's an ultra late game unit and doesn't do a ton of damage all by itself. It absorbs a lot of damage, but it doesn't dish it like other heavy tanks do. A player who buys multiple churchills has zero mobility. Take advantage of that instead of trying to outgun them manno on manno.

This is honestly only remotely an issue in shitty 3v3/4v4 games.



Brits spend 115 or whatever it is + the 50 fuel for anvil specialization.

Total teching I believe is 180/30, 280/115, 200/50 ignoring squad counts, grenades or weapon racks. So 660/195 total before being able to purchase a Churchill for 540/150. Probably still cheaper than Germans, but that's the price you pay for better units. They also don't have many options for mid game vehicles other than the armoured car or valentine, which makes them vulnerable to early tank pressure like the luchs or ostwind as long as you don't drive into an AT gun.

How about tech up to the ost T4 when they must build T3 for medium tanks?80/10,100/40,200/20,100/45,260/75,100/45,260/75,it's 1000MP/310fuel before you being able to purchase a panther or a brumbar(490/160).Still cheaper than Germans?No...Absolutely the brits can tech more easily than ost. Relic gives brits 3 special skills when you tech up to Anvil,but what does they give to ost when they tech up to T4?

The Churchill should only have a limit of 1 if it's replaced by the Black Prince

+1

It cost 120 fuel to tech up to ost T4, before buying the brumbar,also the brumbar is slow too,so will we increase the brumbar HP to 1600?

Compared to churchill, brummbar is race car.
Also, Ost gets three units with the tech, Brits a single one that locks out the other one.