Balance Preview Update 09/09/2015

A single LMG is now more expensive then a LMG42 and does less damage to boot, you have to go 2 if you want to beat a single vet 3 Gren.

So let's see, rifleman are more expensive and need to spend 140 muni to beat Grens.

Imo there's something wrong here.

Edit: and accuracy on the move isn't worth for shit, they won't deal DPs like Obers do when they shoot on the move, they have 0.75 accuracy, while I think it was 0.25 for Paratroopers.

No they're very similar, the MG 42 is negligibly better, in gameplay you will never notice a difference. Placebo and confirmation bias would be stronger than the differences between the two. And most importantly, you can double up.

LMG42: 6.517 - 9.430 - 9.407
M1919: 6.138 - 8.911 - 9.169

And uh, Obers using their LMG on the move is their entire thing since they cost 400 MP + 75 muni

Commandos gammon (which is like satchel) still has timing of normal grenade? It's not good...

And uh, Obers using their LMG on the move is their entire thing since they cost 400 MP + 75 muni

Just like Paratroopers which are 390 MP + 120 muni for there LMG's?

Oh wait, paratroopers deal less DPs, have less DPs on the move and worse vet bonus comparing to obers.

Looks like paratroopers need a buff, oh wait, they don't.

Edit: so LMG's are worse then HMG42s and are more expensive to boot, you just showed us the stats.

Commandos gammon (which is like satchel) still has timing of normal grenade? It's not good...

Thats because its much weaker then satchel.
They use light gammon bomb, which is pretty much pimped grenade.

Normal hammer gammon bombs are like satchels.

And uh, Obers using their LMG on the move is their entire thing since they cost 400 MP + 75 muni

get your numbers right m8, its 60mun

Thats because its much weaker then satchel.
They use light gammon bomb, which is pretty much pimped grenade.

Normal hammer gammon bombs are like satchels.

The point is, I just faced them.
I moved forward as soon as I saw animation - still wiped.

get your numbers right m8, its 60mun

Wow, that's what I call cost effective.

Commandos gammon (which is like satchel) still has timing of normal grenade? It's not good...

As far as I remember, people reported this back in alpha... no fix yet.

Fellow axis players crying about churchhills makes me cringe. Jesus, play allies once in a while. How did they ever deal with axis super tanks? If you're losing to basic AI, you need to redo your strat.

It's called combined arms, something axis is not use to doing, devs don't mention it much, but you SHOULD be doing.

Lay MINES, Panzerfaust, AT, combine that with your panthers. I see so many bad axis (that have great stats) players still rush panthers to allied bases. WHY??? Use it like a jackson and you won't regret it.

You have all the same tools that allies have, just better versions of it. More expensive? Yes, but they live longer and do better. Combine that with good micro, a churchill is toast.

You can't just build 3 AT guns, blob them together, and expect to win like axis always use to do. The game is actually somewhat balanced now. And I don't even play British, and I play a lot of OKW as well as the allied factions. So I'm quite unbiased.

Just because there is change, doesn't mean the game is unbalanced. You just need to learn to adapt, otherwise yeh...everything will seem OP.

Ok man, we all know you payed for the faction, we all appreciate that. But that doesn't give you the right to beat better skilled opponents just because you use an OP faction. Savy?
I don't get why 3 AT weapons should not push back - if not kill - a tank, heavy or not. They do the trick for allied. Why they shouldn't do for axis the same thing? I cannot go and scramble the whole frontline with my KT or Tiger like you do it with your churchill (crocodile or not). It might be a time (a long time ago) when I could do that, and because it wasn't ok, those heavy tanks were nerfed. Got the idea, or should I draw it to you?
I don't know who are these axis players you play against but never in the history of coh2 competent players didn't throw away they panthers like you described. I don't think that axis players are so agressive these days. Bofors, you know. At guns, and british OP tanks that are also cheap for their performance. All games, the same pattern. 2 bofors + hold the line with mg's infantry and AT's untill the ultimate tank arrive. The churchill, the best heavy from WW2. There was no other tank so powerfull as churchill. All brits did, was sending churchill against fritz lines and it stopped at Berlin, in one single push. It's not only unbalanced, it's also embarassing (if we think at history too).
And what is with these OP abominations:
1. Bren carrier with flame thrower. No chance to faust it, you get instafried while closing in. Every shreck shot misses it;
2. Centaur - the instawipe machine. Everything compared to this is a joke, you name it: Panzer 2, Ostwind, etc.
3. One firefly gunshot plus tulips are downing a Tiger to 20% life from front? 'Da fuq...?
4. Bofors? Please. You call that balanced? I can't even imagine what I would read on these forums if (OP) OKW T4 was half good than this doom machine.
5. Not even speaking about off maps and british artillery. From middle game, you will be permanently shelled.

To conclude, it's ok for a faction to have its strongpoints but the weaknesses should be as relevant, not safe to ignore.
In 1v1 it's more balanced but from 2v2 perspective, the brits are OP like fuq especially if they combo with another allied faction.
Balance is such a mess these days.

Ok man, we all know you payed for the faction, we all appreciate that. But that doesn't give you the right to beat better skilled opponents just because you use an OP faction. Savy?
I don't get why 3 AT weapons should not push back - if not kill - a tank, heavy or not. They do the trick for allied. Why they shouldn't do for axis the same thing? I cannot go and scramble the whole frontline with my KT or Tiger like you do it with your churchill (crocodile or not). It might be a time (a long time ago) when I could do that, and because it wasn't ok, those heavy tanks were nerfed. Got the idea, or should I draw it to you?
I don't know who are these axis players you play against but never in the history of coh2 competent players didn't throw away they panthers like you described. I don't think that axis players are so agressive these days. Bofors, you know. At guns, and british OP tanks that are also cheap for their performance. All games, the same pattern. 2 bofors + hold the line with mg's infantry and AT's untill the ultimate tank arrive. The churchill, the best heavy from WW2. There was no other tank so powerfull as churchill. All brits did, was sending churchill against fritz lines and it stopped at Berlin, in one single push. It's not only unbalanced, it's also embarassing (if we think at history too).
And what is with these OP abominations:
1. Bren carrier with flame thrower. No chance to faust it, you get instafried while closing in. Every shreck shot misses it;
2. Centaur - the instawipe machine. Everything compared to this is a joke, you name it: Panzer 2, Ostwind, etc.
3. One firefly gunshot plus tulips are downing a Tiger to 20% life from front? 'Da fuq...?
4. Bofors? Please. You call that balanced? I can't even imagine what I would read on these forums if (OP) OKW T4 was half good than this doom machine.
5. Not even speaking about off maps and british artillery. From middle game, you will be permanently shelled.

To conclude, it's ok for a faction to have its strongpoints but the weaknesses should be as relevant, not safe to ignore.
In 1v1 it's more balanced but from 2v2 perspective, the brits are OP like fuq especially if they combo with another allied faction.
Balance is such a mess these days.

I agree with many of your points. The problems is, Brits early game MP struggle (which is real and an issue) has become an excuse for clearly Overperforming late game units. This is a bigger issue in 2s and up, since one player can Lock down important sectors while the other maintains field control.

Brits need to be stronger early game, have better map control, cheaper line infantry but also more expensive/less powerful late game units.

I agree with many of your points. The problems is, Brits early game MP struggle (which is real and an issue) has become an excuse for clearly Overperforming late game units. This is a bigger issue in 2s and up, since one player can Lock down important sectors while the other maintains field control.

Brits need to be stronger early game, have better map control, cheaper line infantry but also more expensive/less powerful late game units.

What late game OP units exactly they (Brits) have, that is not gonna be addressed next patch, and axis doesn't have the better version of that?

Er, no. 10 Munitions is the price of being able to double up or equip universally.

bit late on the response here but schrecks, piats, vickers, brens, BARs, and bazookas all charge for the gun, not the ability to equip multiple. my point being that if it preforms like another weapon and there isn't some kind of stupid mechanic like OKW's involved, there should be cost parity.

The point is, I just faced them.
I moved forward as soon as I saw animation - still wiped.

yea commando nade needs a nerf

its like a rifle nade with low range BUT better AOE

I don't know why everyone seems to think Rifle Grenade is some sort of mini-nuke, it's got the lowest AoE of all normal grenades. Except the Volksgrenadier Grenade, which is identical.

I don't know why everyone seems to think Rifle Grenade is some sort of mini-nuke, it's got the lowest AoE of all normal grenades. Except the Volksgrenadier Grenade, which is identical.

I think people are not frustrated by the statistics of the grens rifle nade, like you say nothing above and beyond that which is available to any other faction.

I believe its more to do with how it is delivered within the game mechanics. Its damage and AOE are what kill units by definition, but the cause of losses to a rifle nade are more abstract than simple statistical value of the nade.

Its one of the more subtle animations too look out for, added with the range and speed of the nade, makes them very hard to avoid just one, and impossible to avoid multiple.

With other factions you get a more obvious animation, but also a detonation timer which near triples the time given to react and move compared to the rifle nade

Hey folks, the PAK40 needs major improvements. OR move the puma to T2.

Hey folks, the PAK40 needs major improvements. OR move the puma to T2.

You already made 1 thread about moving pak to T0,.. don't spam your idea after it already has a dedicated thread simply because no one agrees with you

You already made 1 thread about moving pak to T0,.. don't spam your idea after it already has a dedicated thread simply because no one agrees with you

lmao that was someone else bro. PAY ATTENTION SON