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Ostheer HMG too strong now

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Phy
25 Jun 2015, 12:37 PM
#42
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 09:39 AMm00nch1ld
Pls. Have you ever heard of flanking, smoke grenades... Have you ever even played coh1? Finally you have to think a little bit in the early game when playing allies.


Did you really play coh1? In coh1 Americans had plenty of different other units in early game to counter mg's (like mortar and snipers) but the most important think is that rifles accuracy while moving was higher than it is in coh2 and the damage received while moving was lower than it is in coh2.

Although I like the new mg's it's obvious that USF early game is weak against mg's and furthermore in late game USF sucks more. But yeah, let the axisfanboys -who cried reading the patch notes before the release- enjoy. But for sake don't compare FLANKING in coh2 with coh1 because it has nothing in common.

BTW, let me remind that in coh1 mg's could not cap territory while set up. So yeah, things were way different from coh2.
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JohnnyB
25 Jun 2015, 12:45 PM
#43
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On a more serious note, increase the damn' thing's price or make it so it won't supress in green cover so easily. After all, green cover is green cover.
BeefSurge wrote:
A lot of people have an image of how they want a faction to play, leading to problems. This is why you have people complaining about lack of Soviet bunkers, why T34/76 sucks, why Cons don't scale, Grens don't get normal grenades, Muricans don't get heavy tank, OKW laser weapons and Die Glock Death Bell, etc.
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Katitof
25 Jun 2015, 12:49 PM
#44
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 12:45 PMJohnnyB
On a more serious note, increase the damn' thing's price or make it so it won't supress in green cover so easily. After all, green cover is green cover.

Incremental accuracy and high model count makes it effective against green cover.

If you have 2 squads nearby, the only green cover that will protect you is garrison.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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aaa
25 Jun 2015, 12:50 PM
#45
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 09:29 AMppsh41
I don't know what's wrong with the hmg last patch, it is too hard for USF to counter OStheer HMG this patch in early game, two HMG can simply shutdown everything it is really frustrating, I feel everyone from German side are playing Ostheer now. something has to be done for the HMG now.


hmgs was OP compared to their counterparts even before this patch.
Now its just absurd. No any total noob with no micro can win early game with that.


I wonder what game-makers are thinking about this new bullshit. They supress and damage units fast and even in green cover.

Swap mgs maxim and dsk would be one decision.












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samich
25 Jun 2015, 12:51 PM
#46
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The mg42 is fine, it needed buffing up to counter blobs harder.

That said USF desperately need some more options for countering them. If only Relic added a USF mortar with these changes... cough cough
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dpfarce
25 Jun 2015, 12:53 PM
#47
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How to counter MG42

1. You get 4 vetoes
2. Use them properly
3. Accept the fact that permanently vetoing 4 maps is a healthy trade off for a mechanic that actually discourages blobbing
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vasa1719
25 Jun 2015, 12:55 PM
#48
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I see the problem 1) very good supression in green cover, so its need try to fix 2) and change the price of mg 3) USF need more early option, not smoke only
So somthing of this need to do. Becouse MG in USF cutoff or hous (Faimontville) its gg.
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aaa
25 Jun 2015, 12:58 PM
#49
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 12:53 PMdpfarce
How to counter MG42

1. You get 4 vetoes


what 4 maps? I guess veto all urban maps including semosky which was OK map prevously.
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Theodosios
25 Jun 2015, 13:04 PM
#50
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What I like about changes regarding MG42 and other HMG is the fact that you cannot run straightforward into them to throw grenades anymore since they suppress quite swiftly and reliably now, a change much needed in my opinion. Blobs can be far better controlled and restricted which forces you to actually split up your forces. You must attack from multiple flanks to break HMGs.

Some maps though do not allow such maneuvers or only in a very restricted, foreseeable manner. Consequently, HMGs overperform heavily on some maps. With this issue you can perceive how poorly balanced some (most) maps are. :foreveralone:
"Nullum magnum ingenium sine mixtura dementiae fuit." - Lucius Annaeus Seneca
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MoerserKarL
25 Jun 2015, 13:07 PM
#51
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people complaining about no blob counters = relic is changing HMG to punish blobbing = people still complaining :foreveralone:
The cry will never ends :bananadance:
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braciszek
25 Jun 2015, 13:13 PM
#52
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 13:07 PMMoerserKarL
people complaining about no blob counters = relic is changing HMG to punish blobbing = people still complaining :foreveralone:
The cry will never ends :bananadance:


Crappy maps are worth complaining about...

And being surppressed while in green cover.
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(>-_-<)UFO
25 Jun 2015, 13:16 PM
#53
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Well, as a matter of fact you can't run into a HMG42, wipe the crew and steal it anymore. You have to build your own HMGs which are much better: 50cal and DshK.


It is still vulnerable to oorah+Lolotov, Smoke+Getting overrun, AAHT and M20.
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aaa
25 Jun 2015, 13:22 PM
#54
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 13:04 PMTheodosios

Some maps though do not allow such maneuvers or only in a very restricted, foreseeable manner. Consequently, HMGs overperform heavily on some maps.


As a good player what do you think what can be done to counter hmgs early game. Realisticaly without trash talk about smoke grenades and flanking from 8 directions.


May be you can get fast M5 somehow. No? Or realy veto 4 urban maps
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__deleted__
25 Jun 2015, 13:26 PM
#55
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Realistically, flanking (2 directions suffice) and grenades make MGs largely a non-issue in all stages of the game. Thats not trash talk.
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Theodosios
25 Jun 2015, 13:32 PM
#56
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 13:22 PMaaa


As a good player what do you think what can be done to counter hmgs early game. Realisticaly without trash talk about smoke grenades and flanking from 8 directions.


May be you can get fast M5 somehow. No?


I played only once USF and some only Ostheer 2v2 AT this patch.

The one USF game me and Thanatos (playing as Soviets) encountered double Ostheer on Bystraya Voda. I played in the south and tried to capture the fuel point but early Pioneer push to lay down wire and double MG 42 start pushed me away. After a while my opponent got a 3rd MG42 and chose Close Air Support whilst producing flame Pioneers. Since your flank possibilities are kind of limited versus 3 MG42s in Bystraya Voda south 2v2 I upgraded grenades and smoked. This is one of the reasons for my comment regarding "poorly balanced maps". :(

As Ostheer I never had serious problems dealing with Maxims or Cal .50 since you have Snipers, Mortars, Rifle Grenades, etc.
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Theodosios
25 Jun 2015, 13:34 PM
#57
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 13:26 PM__deleted__
Realistically, flanking (2 directions suffice) and grenades make MGs largely a non-issue in all stages of the game. Thats not trash talk.


Exactly.

If only more maps allowed flanking maneuvers... :foreveralone:
"Nullum magnum ingenium sine mixtura dementiae fuit." - Lucius Annaeus Seneca
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Rollo
25 Jun 2015, 13:35 PM
#58
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 10:20 AMKatitof


I always laugh at all the "like in coh1" replies.
Pink shades so much that it hurts.


Don't worry, I'm sure the majority of the forum are always laughing at your replies
Click for depression

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QueenRatchet123
25 Jun 2015, 13:41 PM
#59
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 13:32 PMTheodosios

As Ostheer I never had serious problems dealing with Maxims or Cal .50 since you have Snipers, Mortars, Rifle Grenades, etc.


All of which USF lack...
jump backJump back to quoted post17 Aug 2015, 14:01 PMJohnnyB

There is no recording in all WW2 history of a piat actually knocking off a vehicle. Yes, it was THAT bad.
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Katitof
25 Jun 2015, 13:43 PM
#60
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jump backJump back to quoted post25 Jun 2015, 13:26 PM__deleted__
Realistically, flanking (2 directions suffice) and grenades make MGs largely a non-issue in all stages of the game. Thats not trash talk.


Practically, you're forced for hefty early game investment of fuel just to counter basic, menpower only unit.

Given CoH2 narrow maps, roads and cutoffs it makes it exceptionally difficult to pull a proper flank without circling half of the map. CoH1 also had much more open maps, hell comparing CoH1 semois to coh2 version speaks for itself.

That happens when relic doesn't implement all the changes required for the patch to actually work.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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