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Opinion Poll: Least Useful Unit

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REforever
19 Apr 2015, 15:24 PM
#21
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Posts: 314

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 15:18 PMKatitof

I'll tell you again, now sit tight and focus:

The poll is about least useful units, not the one you are most butthurt about after they got balanced.


Yes, precisely. I listed my choice in my post and gave reasons why; you don't like it because it opposes the Allies. The legitimacy of this poll and topic has been compromised by bias due to the fact that every choice is an Allied one. If the TC wanted this poll and topic to be unbiased, he would've included German units that are rarely used of which there are plenty of, contrary to your statements stating otherwise.
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Katitof
19 Apr 2015, 15:26 PM
#22
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Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

Sure, I agree that some unts shouldn't be there(osttruppen, WC, RETs), some are missing, but if someones anus is bleeding over loosing their IWIN button and attempts to troll hardcore, its hard to pass.

Obers deserve to be on that list as much as guards or LMG paras.
jump backJump back to quoted post25 Nov 2015, 11:09 AM$nuffy
Maybe it's 'cause the Axis players aren't a bunch of forum crybabies, and they keep their cool and fight the uphill battle, unlike some of their "allied" counterparts.
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Brachiaraidos
19 Apr 2015, 15:27 PM
#23
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Posts: 627

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 15:23 PMButcher
Which is the essence of a "troll poll" or a biased poll as i put it.

It´s handpicked options from that guy, not even giving the option "other units" to eventually lead to the impression the handpicked units are the only ones underpowered. What´s even more suspicious is that the units are almost exclusively Allied units. Then a random Axis unit was put as an option to - that´s at least my impression - give an excuse to not being biased.

This is manipulation of the most primitive kind.


Other units is what this huge, open discussion box below is all about.

I've not had any axis units provided for the poll that I've missed. Most of them have been fixed, and the rest are buildables that I didn't include (looking at you, 2cm Flack and your fuel cost).

OST T4 is only bad because of price of entry which only really affects 1v1, and no other axis unit I know of is quite as useless as any of the above options.

Feel free to provide examples, though.

It's hardly my fault that the soviets have so many doctrinal units that are about as scary as a wet rag. Nor does it mean that soviets are UP. Just that they currently have the worst of the worst.
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coh2player
19 Apr 2015, 15:34 PM
#24
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Posts: 1571

Bad units that might as well not be there:

SU-76, 45mm gun, Irregulars.
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Butcher
19 Apr 2015, 15:36 PM
#25
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Posts: 1217

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 15:27 PMBrachiaraidos
Other units is what this huge, open discussion box below is all about.
That is a discussion box, not the poll. It´s similar to the terms and conditions of contracts. Nobody is going to read everything of it.

The poll however is graphic, easy to comprehend and leaves an impression.

Eventually that means: The biased poll influences the reader way more than discussions in the box - probably going over several sides.

If we distinguish between poll and thread, the poll is not representative and thus useless.

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 15:27 PMBrachiaraidos
Feel free to provide examples, though.
Panzerwerfer is pathetic. Even when not considering the tech cost, it misses reliably. Some people like to argue that it´s meant to drive close. But if we are all honest that is a high risk at almost AT gun range. And it´s against the very definition of artillery.

The infrared Halftrack of OKW isn´t even mentioned?
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Brachiaraidos
19 Apr 2015, 15:44 PM
#26
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Posts: 627

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 15:36 PMButcher
If we distinguish between poll and thread, the poll is not representative and thus useless.

Panzerwerfer is pathetic. Even when not considering the tech cost, it misses reliably. Some people like to argue that it´s meant to drive close. But if we are all honest that is a high risk at almost AT gun range. And it´s against the very definition of artillery.


If you don't want to use it in a way that makes it useful, that's your problem. It's different to what you want, not bad.

The infrared Halftrack of OKW isn´t even mentioned?


Indispensable in team games where you lack scout car + spotting scope
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Butcher
19 Apr 2015, 16:02 PM
#27
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Posts: 1217

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 15:44 PMBrachiaraidos
If you don't want to use it in a way that makes it useful, that's your problem. It's different to what you want, not bad.
Having to be borderline suicidal with an expensive unit makes it a bad unit. This isn´t just my preference.

It seems to be arbitrary to claim the SU-76 is underpowered, yet the Panzerwerfer is meant to be used "in that specific way". Both units are crap. Yet only one is available in the poll.
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Seeker
19 Apr 2015, 16:11 PM
#28
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Posts: 83

I think that the Sturmtiger could go on there, perhaps the ISG.

ISG seems a bit too random, I'm not sure, I have yet to see it supress unless it actually snipes a squad member.

Sturmtiger is a troll unit, and I also despise gimmicks, it's the prime One-Trick-Pony

Anyhow I vote Irregulars, atleast Partisans can deploy behind lines.
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Brachiaraidos
19 Apr 2015, 16:14 PM
#29
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Posts: 627

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 16:02 PMButcher
Having to be borderline suicidal with an expensive unit makes it a bad unit. This isn´t just my preference.

It seems to be arbitrary to claim the SU-76 is underpowered, yet the Panzerwerfer is meant to be used "in that specific way". Both units are crap. Yet only one is available in the poll.


The werfer is a more reliable indirect unit that moves faster, turns better, and doesn't have a fixed turret facing. It has a single alpha payload rather than a painfully long barrage. It has a smaller target size. They both miss completely at max range and have reasonably good scatter at mid.

Is it amazing? No. Is it substantially better than the SU-76 as a barrage tool? Yes.

Given that the SU can't shoot anything bigger than a car and penetrate, not much point judging it by any other metric.
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kamk
19 Apr 2015, 16:17 PM
#30
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jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 15:44 PMBrachiaraidos

If you don't want to use it in a way that makes it useful, that's your problem. It's different to what you want, not bad....

By this logic you would need to remove nearly all poll options. I use half of these units quite regularly, and see people use the other half nicely, i guess it's just your problem that you can't use any of them :P



jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 16:02 PMButcher
...It seems to be arbitrary to claim the SU-76 is underpowered, yet the Panzerwerfer is meant to be used "in that specific way". Both units are crap. Yet only one is available in the poll.

Exactly.



I would throw in Sturmtiger, 2cm Flak emplacements, PWerfer.
Maybe even stuff like light AT mines, or Urban Defense booby traps, etc...
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Vuther
19 Apr 2015, 16:19 PM
#31
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Posts: 3103 | Subs: 1

Panzerwerfer is pretty bad

SU-76 however is completely fucking awful and I would certainly consider the competition of which is worse to be an easy choice.
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Brachiaraidos
19 Apr 2015, 16:24 PM
#32
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Posts: 627

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 16:17 PMkamk

By this logic you would need to remove nearly all poll options. I use half of these units quite regularly, and see people use the other half nicely, i guess it's just your problem that you can't use any of them :P


I never voiced my opinion on the majority of these units, to be honest. I just put up what, from what I see, are the most commonly picked up on units in the forums.

I would throw in Sturmtiger, 2cm Flak emplacements, PWerfer.
Maybe even stuff like light AT mines, or Urban Defense booby traps, etc...


I left out buildable things, but if you actually read my accompanying post to the poll three of those things I gave an honourable mention to.

Also, booby traps? Sure, they're a bit more expensive than a demo if you're soviets (or substantially less if OKW), but they're still a demo charge explosion style mine that aims itself.


And for the Pwerfer, it's not god awful like partisans. Sure, it's in a cost prohibitive tier and not as good as some of its contemporaries, but it's not terrible.

Admittedly I'd have probably put it in the poll at the time if it hadn't slipped my mind, but I'd still disagree with it being terrible. Much like I personally enjoy ostruppen.
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MoerserKarL
19 Apr 2015, 16:30 PM
#33
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I vote the SU-76, because he sucks hard and needs some love
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kamk
19 Apr 2015, 16:35 PM
#34
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jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 16:24 PMBrachiaraidos
I never voiced my opinion on the majority of these units, to be honest. I just put up what, from what I see, are the most commonly picked up on units in the forums.

Well, that doesn't mean they aren't any less useless. Nobody i know builds 2cm flak emplacements, except "for the lulz", still you rarely ever see a topic about them. I actually have never seen one yet.

Also, booby traps? Sure, they're a bit more expensive than a demo if you're soviets (or substantially less if OKW), but they're still a demo charge explosion style mine that aims itself...

And for the Pwerfer, it's not god awful like partisans. Sure, it's in a cost prohibitive tier and not as good as some of its contemporaries, but it's not terrible.

It's about what they do. It's a waste of 100 ammo to kill 1-2 models max. Any basic mine is way better, demos anyways.

Partisans are "worse" due Soviet callin gameplay, they're not that utterly awful. VonIvan seems to like them a lot, and actually causes quite some havoc with them, so do others. While whenever i see someone build a Pwerfer, he can be lucky to gain 1 kill on average per barrage, if even.
Partisans can be a fun unit to troll around, PWerfer ends up in insta regret IMO and doesn't even offer any sort of "fun / troll bonus".



A bit less one sided / biased poll might be better - just my 2 cents...
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elchino7
19 Apr 2015, 16:42 PM
#35
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Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

Stop feeding the trolls.

Irregulars, haven't seen them for like 6 or more months.
My controls weren't working
And if they were, you were playing dishonorably,
And if you weren't, you were playing without skill,
And if you were, it's not fun to play that way,
And if it is, you only care about winning.

Bible of Scrublord, Psalt 3:16.

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Brachiaraidos
19 Apr 2015, 16:44 PM
#36
avatar of Brachiaraidos

Posts: 627

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 16:35 PMkamk
Well, that doesn't mean they aren't any less useless. Nobody i know builds 2cm flak emplacements, except "for the lulz", still you rarely ever see a topic about them. I actually have never seen one yet.


As I have said repeatedly, this poll didn't include any buildable guns. Or abilities, for that matter, or traps or terrain. And I brought up the 2cm flack for sucking right there in the first post.

Partisans are "worse" due Soviet callin gameplay, they're not that utterly awful. VonIvan seems to like them a lot, and actually causes quite some havoc with them, so do others. While whenever i see someone build a Pwerfer, he can be lucky to gain 1 kill on average per barrage, if even.
Partisans can be a fun unit to troll around, PWerfer ends up in insta regret IMO and doesn't even offer any sort of "fun / troll bonus".

A bit less one sided / biased poll might be better - just my 2 cents...


We have different opinions on both the werfer and partisans, then. I'd very much coin them as being the other way around in terms of usefulness, but that is, in the end, just my opinion.

Regardless. A little less biased? I left off the panzerwerfer and now it's a completely biased poll? Good to know.
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VenstreDjevel
19 Apr 2015, 16:47 PM
#37
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Posts: 55

More options would be nice, is it a question of for faction or price. I dare say if OKW had partisans or su76 they would not be called useless for cost. And which gaming mode are we talking here, Panzerwerfer might be good but in 1v1 it will never be seen.
So if there is no restriction on mode then there needs to be alot more units up on that list.
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Brachiaraidos
19 Apr 2015, 16:52 PM
#38
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Posts: 627

jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 16:47 PMVenstreDjevel
More options would be nice, is it a question of for faction or price. I dare say if OKW had partisans or su76 they would not be called useless for cost. And which gaming mode are we talking here, Panzerwerfer might be good but in 1v1 it will never be seen.
So if there is no restriction on mode then there needs to be alot more units up on that list.


Units as is. Considered across all modes.

Feel free to put up the missing units, though. So far all I've heard is endless harping on the PWerfer :P
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G4bb4_G4nd4lf
19 Apr 2015, 17:08 PM
#39
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jump backJump back to quoted post19 Apr 2015, 16:35 PMkamk
It's about what they do. It's a waste of 100 ammo to kill 1-2 models max. Any basic mine is way better, demos anyways.


I wouldn't call them a waste. It's a guaranteed hit and they protect your territory quite nicely.

Booby traps are actually quite strong. Most Axis squads will lose 3 men or get wiped depending on their formation.
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Mortar
19 Apr 2015, 17:21 PM
#40
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Posts: 559

Its hard for me to give any infantry a "least useful" status. Even the crappiest infantry is indispensable for capping territory.

Now I voted for the SU76 because its a Tier 4 unit that costs quite a bit of fuel, MP, and of course time to even get to the point you can build it which also costs fuel, MP, and time. And what do you get for your large investment?

Frustration.
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