Real Talk: Panther

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:43 PMFaustCostBulletin

Nobody is saying such a nerf should come without a buff to Raketenwerfer. But your argumentation is extremely forced, think about the tank itself. Allies have a lot of problems on their own and their tank destroyers are still worse. Axis can do the AT without tanks far better because of Panzerschrecks.

Panther is overperforming. If an overperforming unit is nerfed properly, it becomes balanced, not useless.It would then still be built.

Bazooka is utterly useless and not even remotely decent even against Panzer IV. So "bazooka blob" is out of the question.

Panzer IV can fight Soviet tanks effectively and Jackson cannot brute force a Panzer IV with panzerschreck and stunning Pak40 around. It would be the same thing with Panther; you avoid the enemy tank, except Panzer IV stands a far better chance because Jackson is far worse than a Panther and Panzerschreck is far superior to something like PTRS or Bazooka.

If you want T3 to be used more , you should first admit that Panther is overperforming. You would then have a case to make Panzer IV better. As it stands you're supporting the notion that there's no way T3 should ever get a buff when Panther is so good.

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:46 PMJHeartless

There is no such thing as MBT in WWII thats a post war construct. Axis has plenty of AT and have never ever and never will hurt in that department. After all the Pak40 is like a Jackson with Better Pen. Ost can make that in T2.

JP4 DPSwise is almost EXACTLY what a Pak40 is. It just has worse Pen. Its not like anything outside of an IS2 it really matters though.

And then there are Shreks...

OKW won many many games before they buffed the Panthers armor back to prenerf levels. I am sure they would survive....somehow...yknow like they did...

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:47 PMAlexzandvar

The Panther isn't over preforming, rather, it is literally the only turret non-doc Axis tank in the game that we see built anymore thanks to a lack of options.

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:17 PMAlexzandvar

If we are comparing with 240 to 160 it's 66%, but 160 to 240 it's 50%

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:48 PMAlexzandvar

The Pak40 doesn't do 240 damage, the JPIV is the least mobile medium in the game, and the Panther nerf was before OKW was added as a faction.

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:50 PMAssaultPlazma

Faust what do you suggest be done about the Panther if you hypothetically had your way with balance?

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:50 PMKatitof

Apparently you have learned a grand total of nothing from the math lesson I gave you.

When you compare 2 values, you need to make one of them the point of reference.
160 is 66% of 240
240 is 150% of 140, therefore 50% more.

Which makes your post which we can find here:
http://www.coh2.org/topic/32484/real-talk-panther/post/304768
An utter bullshit from mathematical POV.

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:50 PMKatitof

Apparently you have learned a grand total of nothing from the math lesson I gave you.

When you compare 2 values, you need to make one of them the point of reference.
160 is 66% of 240
240 is 150% of 140, therefore 50% more.

Which makes your post which we can find here:
http://www.coh2.org/topic/32484/real-talk-panther/post/304768
An utter bullshit from mathematical POV.

THE RED HERRING AGAIN! See DPS post. The Pak40 has MORE DPS then the Jackson PERIOD. It will kill armor FASTER THEN A JACKSON PERIOD.

If your talking about Alpha strikes thats all that the extra damage will get you. Less Rolls of the RNG dice. So it will either score a Pen and do great or Bounce and totally blow its DPS out the window because it has a SLOW RELOAD TO COMPENSATE FOR THE HIGH DAMAGE PER SHOT.

I think you are just being willfully ignorant here.

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:55 PMJHeartless

I would lower its frontal armor and increase its DPS. Plain and simple. It is no longer LOL bullet proof and will require utilization of its range advantage over Other Mediums and Heavies. It would be rewarded with close to a TD level of damage output.

Making it weak against dedicated AT as it should be.

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:57 PMPorygon

Panther have a very shitty DPS, and someone here tell me it is Ober of panzer, what would you expect what I would expect instead of claiming this post as bullshit and watch the show?

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:17 PMAlexzandvar

If we are comparing with 240 to 160 it's 66%, but 160 to 240 it's 50%

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:37 PMJHeartless

Still trying to understand how I can use any of this in a 1v1 as USF....

Again if you arent chasing down and killing the Light tank that is the Jackson with the Panther every chance you get thats your mistake. For ultimate LOL include Obers to insta whipe any ATGs if the USF player went AB or Captain...since yknow they come in the same building.

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:57 PMAlexzandvar

What AT is it not weak against? It's already weak to dedicated AT, what's OP is Blitz allowing it to moonwalk away.

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 18:59 PMFaustCostBulletin

It has the same damage as T-34/85, better minimum reload time and the same maximum reload time. You're uninformed and you're speaking... Well, all you say is anecdotal, so unless your next post contains level headed discussion, good will and less of this pathethic snark, you won't be getting an answer from me. Come with sound arguments, you're trying to start a flame war and nobody here is going to fall for it.

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 19:02 PMJHeartless

Show me something in the US Aresenal that has more than a 50% chance to Pen the Panther.

Show me something in the USF armor that HAS a 50% chance to bounce any Axis AT.

The Panther already has a high HP pool to absorb alot of damage. It effectivley has 1200 HPs against most AT in the game at Vet 0. 1440 Effective HPs at Vet 2 against 90% of all AT.

The Jackson has effective 480Hps and costs only 30 fuel less. It has greater DPS and not the 20 range it enjoys against Mediums but 10 against the Panther.

The Panther has much less DPS then the Jackson. If the armor were reduced and lowered the Effective HPs of the Panther while trading it off for more DPS the Panther would be just fine. It would also allow AT to vet as there is no Vet reward for constant bounced shots.

Another thing Axis need not worry about.

Jump back to quoted post24 Mar 2015, 19:04 PMPorygon

And T-34 can squad wipe, usually come with mark target, and no teching cost, I would take guard motor everyday instead of pathetic Panther.

Panther starts to be good after vet 2, totally a shit before.