[Developer] Map Improvement Poll

Hello everyone,


Back in August we put up a map related post which lead to some great feedback and sparked a series of other topics on maps. we're aiming to get another batch of feedback on maps again this time with a poll to indicate which maps you would like to see improved in the near future.

Please vote on the poll and provide any other feedback you have in your replies, like before the more details the better, screenshots, video's, links to specific games or threads. Anything you can think of which is map related please post it below.


(previous post)

http://www.coh2.org/topic/22385/relic-looking-for-map-feedback


Eagle


please note that we have only listed the automatch maps below for this round

Hello eagleheart. as a 4v4 player, i would like to see faceoff at rostov improved. the map is very problematic as Allies if you spawn at the North. I will list some reasons why the map is imbalanced

1. When spawning on the North, players have to cross bridges in order to get into the city. This slows movement and makes it difficult to move tanks into the city.
2. An OKW player, spawning from the South, can rush Kubelwagens to the bridges, which delays your entry significantly. It can reach your fuel before you have a chance to finish crossing the bridge.
Once you are pushed off the city, it is very difficult to comeback, especially as Allies, since Axis have fortifications they can build to camp the city easier

Hello eagleheart. as a 4v4 player, i would like to see faceoff at rostov improved. the map is very problematic as Allies if you spawn at the North. I will list some reasons why the map is imbalanced

1. When spawning on the North, players have to cross bridges in order to get into the city. This slows movement and makes it difficult to move tanks into the city.
2. An OKW player, spawning from the South, can rush Kubelwagens to the bridges, which delays your entry significantly. It can reach your fuel before you have a chance to finish crossing the bridge.
Once you are pushed off the city, it is very difficult to comeback, especially as Allies, since Axis have fortifications they can build to camp the city easier

It's even easier for allies to spawn from the north. Simply just spam heaps of infantry into forward HQs everywhere = gg

The map is broken though

I'd like to see the blizzard mechanic make a comeback. Right now there's only one map in 1v1 automatch that has them.

I votes Rostov, in my opinion the since the munitions are really the only contested resources players tend to all cram into the city and create a rather congested enviroment. Usually whoever gets this city will win in the long run since it is massively easier to defend than to assault

Creating more contested resource points or at least making it more rewarding to try to go for areas other than the city resource wise would improve this map for me

I'd like to see the fuel point on summer Semoskiy go back to where it is on the winter version, like when the map was first re-released. I never liked it being that close to the base in vCoH, and I don't care for it now.

Stalingrad needs to see improvements, I don't know how since there are no light cover brick walls, but something needs to be done. There are also several areas on the map where airbrone troops can get permanantly stuck. These are:

1. Crater outside smokestack factory on the bottom-left side, AB may land in it and get trapped.

2. Open area in the top left side, the rare open nature of it makes it look relatively low-risk, it isn't. Troops will be trapped on a small 'line' of ground.

3. Control Point in the center-north near the park. Luftwaffe Assault troops can get stuck between the rubble and control point.


Also, in the large building in the center, troops cannot fire to the southern side of the building, making them sitting ducks for the player attacking from the bottom. Recommend the building is either allowed to have that southern facing, or ruin walls are used to block that side.

Nice poll

I voted Langreskaya but I'd be happy with improvements to a ton of maps. That is just the one I'd most like to see changed.

Hurtgen because it can really be a cluster when you need to maneuver. Your mate sometimes accidentally blocks your path and that would sometimes end up in losing the units stuck in the path because of the blocking or the pathing is messed up by the map features itself. Also, Trois Ponts needs to be expanded a bit I think its a bit too small.

Some maps should be made small modifications (open fences,move houses,ect) and some maps great modification (as move the HQs/spawn more forward, resect rivers).

Not all maps need some change. But the vast majority itself.
These maps have a large spend of money, time and effort by mapmaker. Because relic has remove from AUTOMATCH or have veto players. I hope they can recover

Priority list me:
(6-8) Faceoff at Rostov
(6-8) City 17 winter/summer
(4-6) Rzhev Summer (not in the list)
(6-8) Hill_331 (veto map for many people)(not in the list)

90% overall from the list maps need reworking.

Hurtgen for me too.

The map is just terrible for gameplay. Especially light vehicles, which are blocked from large parts of the map. The pathing gets stupid. Narrow paths create easy killzones. Many times you can order a long distance move to help a partner and if your not watching the whole time, your units can take some really stupid paths to get there.

Rostov is very very close second.

I immediately veto Hurtgen, because if you're on the top side, you can completely forget about the left fuel.
No way that you will hold that thing against skilled opponents.

As top player, you have to cross the red-cover-slowing-you-down river, and that's just a major disadvantage. Top side = losing side.

FaceOff can go out of the pool for me, it's not balanced at all and it's just the setting that isn't balanced.
The West players have to cross the rivers and bridges, and once they are pushed back, it's very hard to come back from that because it's just too tricky with all these choke-points (bridges) and ice.

City 17 has such a long retreat, that it's just not funny at all, specially the first engagements. The fuel at the right is too easy to hold for the upper army.

Here comes a very important principle that I just don't see much in maps these days (autopool);

Cut-off's are rare.
Good cut-offs are so rare that it's so easy to hold a fuelpoint these days.
Stahlhagel and me have created some competitive maps now (more info soon), and we always made the map in such a way that holding the fuel is not enough to get the fuel. You have to push on to get the cutoffpoint.
In that way, you can hold the fuel, but not getting the fuel because the cutoff is in hands of the enemy.
Now, you just have your cutoff close to your base, so who actually cares about that? It's absolutely not dangerous because if they decap, you just recap in a few minutes.

Make more cutoffs, make smarter territory placement.
Spread cutoffs and the point that they cut off --> spread the fights instead of always camping the fuel.

Anyhow Eagle, we've got 3 competitive maps 100% balanced, so we're going to contact you about that later, we can have a chat in steam than .

Kind regards,
Peter.

hurtgen forest is really interesting, but i think there is too much forest. especially the two main roads could be wider.

also, some pathways are wayyyy too narrow. the ones that are like 2 models wide.

Im a bit curious how to get my Brummbar to the middle at Semoskiy when I play in the south. Pathing... At the moment you can just use him to guard your own fuel as it seems impossible to cross either bridge.

Trois Ponts. When spawn north, as OKW you can rush fuel point, make wires at the entrance to graveyard and there you go. Whole battle is moving to the left fuel and your fuel is fully secured for 6-8min of even for whole fight since any vehicle allies will get has to be send to defend left fuel.

Im a bit curious how to get my Brummbar to the middle at Semoskiy when I play in the south. Pathing... At the moment you can just use him to guard your own fuel as it seems impossible to cross either bridge.

Working as intended. Brummbar and whole T4 is not designed for 1v1 / 2v2 games

Dear Relic,

I want to love Vaux farmlands, I really do. Sadly I think it's too big and *square* shaped for a 2 v 2. If it was more of a Rails and Metal shape I think it would be a classic, but at the moment it favours OKW retreat-point camping a little too much.

Where Luvnest, he know so many about maps

I voted for Stalingrad, as I think it is the map in the 1vs1 pool that needs the most improvement. It is often said that the map would favour Allies as it is mostly close quarter combat. However, I want to bring to attention that the vehicle movement there is often very suboptimal. Medium tanks can drive into some of the ruins and get stuck for quite some time. It is also difficult to see where tanks can pass through. If I have a tank standing on the middle lane from north to south and want to send it to the left lane, it has to go all the way back to base and then turn into left lane. There are ruins from which it can shoot at left lane, but from them it can not drive to left lane, because the ruins can't be crushed.

When I get home I will try to get some screenshots of it, as it is the main source of annoyance when I am playing Stalingrad.

I also want to note how I feel about Lazur Factory. It is a map that I don't like because of the visuals of the map. It feels very bland as it is 90% ruins and has no special things that make you remember the map, like big buildings or railroad tracks. All it has is this "dried up river" through the middle, with some paths over it. If I see any part of a great map like Vaux Farmlands, I can tell you where it is, relate to it (just look at those apple trees), and see its tactical significance, because any building or little piece on the ground can be interacted with. I think Lazur Factory needs some things like that, as a big part of the fun in the Company of Heroes franchise is that the map looks completely changed after a game. Minsk Pocket suffers from this problem as well, in my opinion.

I would most like to see Langreskaya and Semoskiy improved, because they are both tournament staple maps.

• The recent round of improvements to Langreskaya made a huge difference and we've seen some epic tourney games on that map, but it could get better and more balanced still.
  
  
• For Semoskiy, problems like the OKW truck (living or dead) blocking the bridge need to be addressed immediately.

As an aside, whut's up w/ good ol' Angoville? Will it get a conversion?

The biggest concern for any map should be balance first. Many of the maps may have terrible layouts, but game breaking balance issues with maps must be fixed immediately. Players literally give bad reviews and quit the game because of these priority one issues.

These unbalanced maps include:

• (2) Kholodny Ferma
  Cutoff favors one side over the other. I consider it a balance issue, but maybe it's the good part of the map favored by skilled players. It's a favorite of many.
  
  
• (2) Langreskaya
  Cutoff favors South side over the North.
  
  
• (2-4) Semoskiy
  OKW HQ can be used to block both bridge locations in the beginning of the match. This severely hinders the team that needs to wait a few minutes before they can break through.
  
  This may not be a balance issue but, why are the fuel point so close to the bases?
  
  
• (4-6) Rzhev Summer
  It's not in the list, but it deserves to be brought back improved. As you guys clearly noticed, it favors the Southern side.
  
  
• (6-8) Faceoff at Rostov
  The frozen river favors the Southern side. Southern side opponents can cut off both bridges and the ice with defending units, artillery, explosives, or bunkers.
  
  
• (6-8) Lienne Forest
  This map favors the Northern side. Southern side needs to cross the river to get from South side forest to North side. Munitions point for example can easily be defended with machine guns pointing at the river. Northern side of middle VP point also has access to green cover and a gigantic building.