Login

russian armor

About the B-4

PAGES (23)down
10 Nov 2014, 18:41 PM
#1
avatar of GustavGans

Posts: 747

The B-4 howitzer seems to be very popular lately and is probably the most useful immobile, onmap artillery in game.

My main concern with it is, that I think it's precision strike is a bit over the top. Oneshotting tanks across the map for a handful of ammo is too much in my opinion.

I would therefore suggest to either town down the precision strikes damage or it's range.
10 Nov 2014, 18:46 PM
#2
avatar of sneakking

Posts: 655

Permanently Banned
It's damage is a little ridiculous, but there's literally only one doctrine with it, and it's pretty obvious when your opponent is using it, not to mention it can be countered by a single stuka dive bomb strike. It's the Soviet's artillery ace.
10 Nov 2014, 18:49 PM
#3
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

If you are having your tanks one shotted across the map, given the amazing B-4 turn speed and shell travel time, well, you might want to consider not sitting with your tanks being immobile for extended periods of time against B-4 user, because this thing have least of all arty pieces chance to shoot at something that is moving.

Precision strike being 90 muni also isn't really spammable.
10 Nov 2014, 18:52 PM
#4
avatar of miragefla
Developer Relic Badge

Posts: 1304 | Subs: 13

Do people even use Stuka dive bomb docs anymore? I haven't seen one in forever.

I think maybe the damage should maybe taper off a little more near the edges.

Main issue is, however, B-4's really the only good static howitzer. The ML-20 suffers from the docs its in which are not particularly great since Soviets rely on call-in tanks, while the Lefh, well, it's the Lefh, it hasn't been that good since its number of shells was dropped with increased cooldown.
10 Nov 2014, 18:55 PM
#5
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

Do people even use Stuka dive bomb docs anymore? I haven't seen one in forever.

I think maybe the damage should maybe taper off a little more near the edges.

Main issue is, however, B-4's really the only good static howitzer. The ML-20 suffers from the docs its in which are not particularly great since Soviets rely on call-in tanks, while the Lefh, well, it's the Lefh, it hasn't been that good since its number of shells was dropped with increased cooldown.


Play with close air support doctrine.

SCAS run one shoots jacksons, wolverines and priests and strafe run pins infantry blobs for grens to a-move them.
Icing on the cake is cheap reckon coupled with stuka.
10 Nov 2014, 19:26 PM
#6
avatar of ludd3emm

Posts: 292

If the B4 is going to get nerfed then Jagdtiger needs to be removed from the game and the King Tiger need to become doctrinal. As simple as that.
10 Nov 2014, 19:42 PM
#7
avatar of GustavGans

Posts: 747

I'm not a big fan of those tabula rasa solutions to be honest. Having only one hardcounter to a unit is extremely limiting and bad for the gameplay, as can be seen with other units (Jagdtiger, ISU, KT etc.) Sure there are many factors contributing to the issue for example map design etc.

Still, I think 90 muni to lob a pinpoint accurate democharge across the map is a steal. Tanks need to stand still to repair and crippled engines are a very common thing to appear too. Also the OKW has no direct counter to the B-4.
10 Nov 2014, 19:42 PM
#8
avatar of somenbjorn

Posts: 923

A handful of Munition? A handful? It is a vetted ability that costs 90 munitions for a single shot.
If you go heavy with the B-4 that means you don't spend anything on muni for the duration of the game.
It's range, and more importantly the range of which it is effective without precision strike is low, like 110-120.

That being said the tripple veterancy damage buff of 50% makes it a tad over the top.

edit: One shotting Jagdtigers and KTs is perhaps more than a "tad". :)
10 Nov 2014, 19:44 PM
#9
avatar of Romeo
Honorary Member Badge
Benefactor 115

Posts: 1970 | Subs: 5

Do people even use Stuka dive bomb docs anymore? I haven't seen one in forever.


There were tons of stuka dive bombs in the SCC, the vast majority of which were used to counter B4s. The B4 is way too powerful and needs a change.
10 Nov 2014, 19:48 PM
#10
avatar of Switzerland
Donator 33

Posts: 545

Waaaaaaaaaaat, so walking Stuka that can just Mario kart into range and strike the B4 and back away long before any response (if your clever enough to launch your strike a safe location)that's not a direct counter? I mean technically it's an indirect fire weapon so i guess it's an indirect counter, my mistake.
10 Nov 2014, 19:51 PM
#11
avatar of somenbjorn

Posts: 923

Waaaaaaaaaaat, so walking Stuka that can just Mario kart into range and strike the B4 and back away long before any response (if your clever enough to launch your strike a safe location)that's not a direct counter? I mean technically it's an indirect fire weapon so i guess it's an indirect counter, my mistake.


Sure if it would wipe the B-4 everytime. But it doesn't for the most time. It will decrew it with a good hit. But you can just repair it quickly and recrew it.
10 Nov 2014, 19:51 PM
#12
avatar of WingZero

Posts: 1484

B4 is perfectly fine. Why do we need to nerf something that is SO inaccurate and relies on dumb luck and opponents micro? Soviets needs some love which they haven't received since last year.
10 Nov 2014, 19:58 PM
#13
avatar of braciszek

Posts: 2053

It is very useful, but the Soviets have it, so it must be removed. :guyokay:
10 Nov 2014, 20:09 PM
#14
avatar of elchino7
Senior Moderator Badge

Posts: 8154 | Subs: 2

You know why this is the only good static artillery on the game? Because the other 2 were nerf with the amount of shells they fired while the B4 remain to shot only 1 powerful shell.

It also use to live on a world where you would have face every single game a double OH. If you combine that with a meta of ISU vs Elephant, it's mostly assure you would have a hard counter to it. You would mostly have a recon and some offmap between the 2 or more teammates.

With the addittion of OKW and the nerf on the Elephant, you are seeing less straight hardcounters, specially in double OKW (Vanilla OKW commanders doesn't have an offmap to destroy it). Take into consideration the medic/repair HQ from OKW and you have some juicy targets to shoot at.

Static artillery lives on a black and white world, where you either have the direct hardcounter or you pray to make a push so powerful that you are able to YOLO your tanks into the enemy base.

PD: if we add that you can cheaply recrew the B4 with lowpopcap after the first shot...
10 Nov 2014, 20:34 PM
#15
avatar of GustavGans

Posts: 747

You know why this is the only good static artillery on the game? Because the other 2 were nerf with the amount of shells they fired while the B4 remain to shot only 1 powerful shell.

It also use to live on a world where you would have face every single game a double OH. If you combine that with a meta of ISU vs Elephant, it's mostly assure you would have a hard counter to it. You would mostly have a recon and some offmap between the 2 or more teammates.

With the addittion of OKW and the nerf on the Elephant, you are seeing less straight hardcounters, specially in double OKW (Vanilla OKW commanders doesn't have an offmap to destroy it). Take into consideration the medic/repair HQ from OKW and you have some juicy targets to shoot at.

Static artillery lives on a black and white world, where you either have the direct hardcounter or you pray to make a push so powerful that you are able to YOLO your tanks into the enemy base.

PD: if we add that you can cheaply recrew the B4 with lowpopcap after the first shot...


Very well put!

I think the B-4 and all the other static artillery pieces need to be reworked, so they fit the game post WFA.


B4 is perfectly fine. Why do we need to nerf something that is SO inaccurate and relies on dumb luck and opponents micro? Soviets needs some love which they haven't received since last year.


It's about the precision strike if you cared to actually read my initial post.

Waaaaaaaaaaat, so walking Stuka that can just Mario kart into range and strike the B4 and back away long before any response (if your clever enough to launch your strike a safe location)that's not a direct counter? I mean technically it's an indirect fire weapon so i guess it's an indirect counter, my mistake.


The B-4 heavily outranges the Walking stuka, add an ISU to the equation or a map like minsk or semoski and you won't get anywhere near firing range with the Wurfrahmen.

A handful of Munition? A handful? It is a vetted ability that costs 90 munitions for a single shot.
If you go heavy with the B-4 that means you don't spend anything on muni for the duration of the game.
It's range, and more importantly the range of which it is effective without precision strike is low, like 110-120.

That being said the tripple veterancy damage buff of 50% makes it a tad over the top.

edit: One shotting Jagdtigers and KTs is perhaps more than a "tad". :)


Saving up that amount of ammo ain't no effort. 90 Muni is nothing when you can point/click/boom tanks,vehicles, buildings pretty much everywhere on the map.
10 Nov 2014, 20:47 PM
#16
avatar of braciszek

Posts: 2053

Ill agree that Static Artillery needs a rework. Like it was said, you either counter it hard, or you cant counter it at all. ML-20, Lefh, and B-4 all need to be useful if a commander containing them is chosen, but they also have to be able to be properly countered by the enemy in some way every game. Static artillery played a massive role in the east, and its a shame that their feature in this game is underdeveloped, and shoved in the corner.
10 Nov 2014, 20:57 PM
#17
avatar of Cardboard Tank

Posts: 978

It's damage is a little ridiculous, but there's literally only one doctrine with it, and it's pretty obvious when your opponent is using it...
The old Tiger Ace was in literally only one doctrine and it was obvious when your opponent was using it... thus it was balanced.

An OP unit is going to be OP no matter in how many docs it is.

jump backJump back to quoted post10 Nov 2014, 18:49 PMKatitof
If you are having your tanks one shotted across the map, given the amazing B-4 turn speed and shell travel time, well, you might want to consider not sitting with your tanks being immobile for extended periods of time against B-4 user.
You can´t repair while moving your tanks around... good players will just wait until you repair (you can hear that through the fog of war, or someone uses a recon) or not fire the gun at all to make you nervous about repairing. Thus once a B4 is on the field repairing is way too risky. Versus good opponents its even impossible.
10 Nov 2014, 21:01 PM
#18
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8


You can´t repair while moving your tanks around... good players will just wait until you repair (you can hear that through the fog of war, or someone uses a recon) or not fire the gun at all to make you nervous about repairing. Thus once a B4 is on the field repairing is way too risky. Versus good opponents its even impossible.


But you aren't rooted for the repairs and can move away if you were spotted or reckoned.
10 Nov 2014, 21:04 PM
#19
avatar of Doomgunner

Posts: 74



Sure if it would wipe the B-4 everytime. But it doesn't for the most time. It will decrew it with a good hit. But you can just repair it quickly and recrew it.


You still have to get to Vet 1 with that recrewed B-4, the likelyhood of that happening before Stuka wipes it again is very low.
10 Nov 2014, 21:04 PM
#20
avatar of Switzerland
Donator 33

Posts: 545

Gustav,

By saying that the ISU152 could be a factor your talking team games (as the b4 does not share this call in) to which I'd like to say the axis have the most uncounter-able combo of flares and off map. And in 1v1 if you can't find a single spot to hit the b4 on the small boards that you typically play on with the walking Stuka that's confusing. The b4 on 1v1 boards is overkill on range and the Stuka is also more than sufficient on them for base harrament considering it can mid/late game take refuge in the forward defensive pocket created by the flak equipped SWS.
PAGES (23)down
0 user is browsing this thread:

SHOUT IT OUT!

No ProfanityNumber of ShoutsRefresh Shout Box
Lady Xenarra: @Willy Pete The lack of April Fools this year is odd lol
Last Wednesday, 01:34 AM
Willy Pete: @Rosbone not dead yet. when that happens the font will switch to Papyrus :*(
Last Wednesday, 00:16 AM
dasheepeh: it was an honor guys :guyokay:
Last Tuesday, 20:34 PM
aerafield: yeah I already prepared my "Can't believe there's comic mode for the 10 daily visitors even on this April 1st" :guyokay:
Last Tuesday, 20:29 PM
Rosbone: @dasheepeh I guess that means this site is officially dead :guyokay:
Last Tuesday, 20:19 PM
dasheepeh: no comic sans font for april 1st this year?
Last Tuesday, 19:56 PM
Willy Pete: @Lady Xenarra this you? https://i.imgflip.com/3e4thi.jpg
Last Tuesday, 02:53 AM
Lady Xenarra: Does anyone else think that USF needs buffs? It feels like they’re on life support sometimes
Last Tuesday, 02:36 AM
Willy Pete: @Rosbone Ahh I missed that memo. I still think its a bad decision though. Adds frustration for players and isnt gonna make them that much money
27 Mar 2025, 15:46 PM
Rosbone: It is also good they left it free until after the free to play weekend. Points for that.
27 Mar 2025, 09:34 AM
Rosbone: But I agree, the cost to get a full decent Coh game pushing $115 US is not the best idea. Especially when it needs so much more work for casuals.
27 Mar 2025, 09:32 AM
Rosbone: To be fair, it was a thank you to early fans right? They said it was not free for long and it would become a pay DLC at some point.
27 Mar 2025, 09:30 AM
Willy Pete: Re-releasing free DLC so they can charge new players money for it. Brilliant marketing strategy :clap:
27 Mar 2025, 04:31 AM
Soheil: Coh2 still broken server ?
25 Mar 2025, 18:27 PM
Rosbone: Congrats to Relic. Looks like Coh3 has finally usurped Coh2 s the popular Coh. You smell terrific. :snfQuinn:.
24 Mar 2025, 02:46 AM
Nickbn: and again someone else replies. I mean come on guys. Give @adamírcz a chance
22 Mar 2025, 14:00 PM
Willy Pete: @Nickbn you didn't ask a question, and this is a chat box...
20 Mar 2025, 13:11 PM
Nickbn: @Rosbone it's incredibly rude to speak on someone elses behalf, especially when a question is directly adressed to them. I understand your passion for the subject at hand but I want to hear from him.
20 Mar 2025, 10:16 AM
Rosbone: @Nickbn No, I am just saying people should not be using any Relic owned forum since they have proven they ban anyone who says true things about Coh3.
18 Mar 2025, 19:01 PM
Nickbn: @Rosbone do you speak on his behalf? I didn't know. In that case keep us updated please.
18 Mar 2025, 16:47 PM

Ladders Top 10

  • #
    Steam Alias
    W
    L
    %
    Streak
Data provided by Relic Relic Entertainment

Replay highlight

VS
  • U.S. Forces flag cblanco ★
  • The British Forces flag 보드카 중대
  • Oberkommando West flag VonManteuffel
  • Ostheer flag Heartless Jäger
uploaded by XXxxHeartlessxxXX

Board Info

371 users are online: 371 guests
1 post in the last 24h
15 posts in the last week
75 posts in the last month
Registered members: 53211
Welcome our newest member, ta88ing1
Most online: 2043 users on 29 Oct 2023, 01:04 AM