Open Beta Changelog

Never used it again since it received that range nerf.

Hence it didn't get nerfed


Jadg and ISU got nerfed because people believed them to be wicked op

Elephants on the other hand were considered extinct


All in all I am now taking a hard look at Ostwind spam into Elephants

Also, if the jagtiger and isu-152 stay the same, i predict the isu-152 will still be quite often used.


You can still fairly easily predict infantry movement and oneshot capping squads from afar.
And given the heavy nature of alot of axis tanks, it will still be able to hit the occasional heavy.
And the AT wall will prevent any heavier tank short of maybe the panther of flanking it.

The JT, given the mobily of allied tanks and completely innefective againts infantry, will be forgotten.


Think about it guys, something does indeed need to change.

Well until they do something about the maps, "mobility" is largely irrelevant.

The ISU cannot shoot through walls and the Jagd can, are you leaving out this "small" detail on purpose?

These changes look really, really nice. One small thing I'd like to commend Relic for is improving the readability of their patch notes. They did a fantastic job actually explaining what each change does. Before, I was oftentimes confused about whether a value changing meant it became more or less accurate, for example. Now it's clearer!

Good patch and good work except some old stories.

1.The WC51 car back to CP 0, maybe it's fine, but do you know what time Ostheer can get out a 222? 45 fuel(T2 tech) + 15 fuel(T2 building) + 15 fuel(222 unit cost) = 75 fuel. Ostheer needs 75 fuel and extra 55 munitions to make a usefull 222. Relic you nerfed pak40 and said that "it opens up the use of light vehicles" ?

lol....You just don't know how the 222 will be countered by allies at 5-6 min of games. The usless Ostheer T2 can not become usefull because of the tech cost and the timing. The pak 40 is the only usefull unit they can build now! And Ostheer is the only faction who have no early light viehcles. The other factions have WC51, kubal and M3A1.

2.The Stationary Howitzers change is good. I have not tested the beta so I don't know if the 50KG stuka bomb can destroy the B-4 like before. Obviously, the B-4 is better than soviet 152 and ostheer 105 Howitzers.

Suggestion: ostheer 105 Howitzer and panzerwerfer's counter-attack ability no longer automatically barrage Motars, Zis3 and 105mm bulldozer, maybe they should only counter Katyusha, priest and stationary howitzers. And please make the counter more accurate, compared to soviet 152 howitzer's precision barrage.

The german needs something to counter the mobilizable artilley units like Katyusha and priest. Because Katyusha and priest's range is too long to counter. OKW have nothing to do on large maps. Ostheer have panzerwerfer but its range is short, and the 105 Howitzer's counter is so unaccurate.

I really hope they do something about Company of Callins in the next patch. Keep up the good work Relic!

I don't understand why they just don't revert back to how it was in the early beta where you still had to build the actual tech buildings to get your commander specific tanks. I think this would alleviate a lot of the call-in issues.

I like the changes to the ISU-152 and JT but perhaps relic should have taken it further? I could see both units performing like a Sturmtiger-light with a longer cooldown on their shots (~20-25 seconds) but in return greater firepower.

Also, if the jagtiger and isu-152 stay the same, i predict the isu-152 will still be quite often used.


You can still fairly easily predict infantry movement and oneshot capping squads from afar.
And given the heavy nature of alot of axis tanks, it will still be able to hit the occasional heavy.
And the AT wall will prevent any heavier tank short of maybe the panther of flanking it.

The JT, given the mobily of allied tanks and completely innefective againts infantry, will be forgotten.


Think about it guys, something does indeed need to change.

Hmmmm.... you're damn' right! More than this, engaging from max distance is different for ISU and for JagdTiger.
If we think at JagdTiger engaging from max distance an allied tank, this one can quickly disappear in FOW. Not really the case of an infantry squad that is capping, for instance. If not one-shoted by ISU, they will throw themselves to the ground, then they will try to run. just enough time maybe for ISU to fire again. I think under the new circumstances, ISU got the advantage.

Price never justifies performance

Edit: Im sure there will be more to it later.

Oh, really? So what are you telling me it's that (not reffering to this case necessarely) for a pile of mp and fuel I should get something verry questionable? If so, then thank you, I will chose a cheaper unit that actually can be used even if it hasn't this "performance". It would be much more "echonomical wise".

Oh, really? So what are you telling me it's that (not reffering to this case necessarely) for a pile of mp and fuel I should get something verry questionable? If so, then thank you, I will chose a cheaper unit that actually can be used even if it hasn't this "performance". It would be much more "echonomical wise".

I think you shouldn't bother, they are too busy blobbing double BARs right now and rushing WC51, and are happy that OKW is slightly nerfed. Nobody cares about Wehr, which is now in dire trouble against early WC51. But you know, hey, German players have to shut up. I stopped posting in this forum a while back, when i saw allies crybabies reigning supreme. Not that anyone cares, though. The patch seems good otherwise, quite a few interesting ideas and features. It's just bad that Wehrmacht is impacted by Oberkommando (much needed, i can agree with this) nerfs.

WC51 is really no different from an M3 now and can't have a flamer in the back until CP3....

I think you shouldn't bother, they are too busy blobbing double BARs right now and rushing WC51, and are happy that OKW is slightly nerfed. Nobody cares about Wehr, which is now in dire trouble against early WC51. But you know, hey, German players have to shut up. I stopped posting in this forum a while back, when i saw allies crybabies reigning supreme. Not that anyone cares, though. The patch seems good otherwise, quite a few interesting ideas and features. It's just bad that Wehrmacht is impacted by Oberkommando (much needed, i can agree with this) nerfs.

Did it feel good to get that out of your chest?

I care about Wehr, but you don't seem to care that Gren LMG's are a bit.. crazy in this current build? Without counting the beta patch.

Also how is Wehr in trouble with WC51? They have fausts from the beginning (also MG). As said above, it's not a different situation from M3.

WC51 is really no different from an M3 now and can't have a flamer in the back until CP3....

I do not know exact stats of the two units but if what you are saying is correct, wc51 should come out a little later. Remember when m3 could come out at like 1 min mark? Then it was considered too strong and got higher fuel cost so it comes out later.

If same is the case for the new wc51, it should get a recharge timer when the game begins, like the elite riflemen, and not moved to 1cp

Did it feel good to get that out of your chest?

I care about Wehr, but you don't seem to care that Gren LMG's are a bit.. crazy in this current build? Without counting the beta patch.

Also how is Wehr in trouble with WC51? They have fausts from the beginning (also MG). As said above, it's not a different situation from M3.

Well I honestly don't understand why people are so scared by lmg grenadiers. The base squad, the grenadiers, are so easilly killable. Yes, they have abilities, they can fight infantry, light vehicles and faust tanks but why are they so scarry? Lmg or not lmg equipped they are quite fragile and will disappear in a second if not carefully baby-sitted. Not the case of cons and rifles! Even if you are a bit careless you will still remain with 1 or 2 goofies in the squad that you can say "oh shit!" and quickly retreat when you finally see they are in trouble. Same thing with the volksgrenadiers. But poor grenadiers, they are the big loosers among main infantry squads.

Ok, so, having messed around a bit, I think I can confidently say that the manual fire actually improves the ISU's performance significantly. The ability to choose where and when to place your shells allows for far more consistent squad wipes. Plus, I now know precisely when I have another shot ready to go, which is a huge advantage in tank battles.

Well I honestly don't understand why people are so scared by lmg grenadiers. The base squad, the grenadiers, are so easilly killable. Yes, they have abilities, they can fight infantry, light vehicles and faust tanks but why are they so scarry? Lmg or not lmg equipped they are quite fragile and will disappear in a second if not carefully baby-sitted. Not the case of cons and rifles! Even if you are a bit careless you will still remain with 1 or 2 goofies in the squad that you can say "oh shit!" and quickly retreat when you finally see they are in trouble. Same thing with the volksgrenadiers. But poor grenadiers, they are the big loosers among main infantry squads.

Probably because they get the LMG upgrade relatively early and then absolutely shit out damage which causes squad wipes on the allied side if they stop paying attention for a moment. They really aren't that weak either - at least against other infantry (and, to be honest, with the way inf behaves in cover now, they really aren't that much weaker vs AoE either).

Probably because they get the LMG upgrade relatively early and then absolutely shit out damage which causes squad wipes on the allied side if they stop paying attention for a moment. They really aren't that weak either - at least against other infantry (and, to be honest, with the way inf behaves in cover now, they really aren't that much weaker vs AoE either).

It's true I didn't test them in Beta yet, I only tested USF and OKW. This new green cover system may reduce a little of their handicap, maybe.

Well, for JT and ISU. I think that a simple lockdown would be a very decent "fix".
Let's say a JT, he will have little smaller range AND cant shoot trough buildings until u lock the unit in place, and to "unlock" it again to get it moving it will need like 5-6 seconds, and while unlocking it can't shoot or rotate. While locked it act's normal like before. For ISU lets say that if u don't lock the unit in place then u need to press reload after every shot and it cant move while reloading, or it reloads a lot slower. With lock it is "normal" and to unlock it u need 5-6 seconds... And that would be a decent start for adjusting this two unit... So guys what u really think about this?

Hi Cynthia_RE . Please give soviet enginer and penal troops this gun http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybz1q9Wce-E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XLYjCTmEHs

more about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PPS_submachine_gun
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AHf1kRkujhQ

Good patch and good work except some old stories.

1.The WC51 car back to CP 0, maybe it's fine, but do you know what time Ostheer can get out a 222? 45 fuel(T2 tech) + 15 fuel(T2 building) + 15 fuel(222 unit cost) = 75 fuel. Ostheer needs 75 fuel and extra 55 munitions to make a usefull 222. Relic you nerfed pak40 and said that "it opens up the use of light vehicles" ?

OMG, it's not like OKH main infantry have Panzerfausts is it?

lol....You just don't know how the 222 will be countered by allies at 5-6 min of games. The usless Ostheer T2 can not become usefull because of the tech cost and the timing. The pak 40 is the only usefull unit they can build now! And Ostheer is the only faction who have no early light viehcles. The other factions have WC51, kubal and M3A1.

Panzergrenadiers?

222?

251?

All far from useless.

Did it feel good to get that out of your chest?

I care about Wehr, but you don't seem to care that Gren LMG's are a bit.. crazy in this current build? Without counting the beta patch.

Also how is Wehr in trouble with WC51? They have fausts from the beginning (also MG). As said above, it's not a different situation from M3.

Because it ads additional strength to usf to an already very painful early game in the usf vs ost matchup. usf starts stronger then the soviets and have access to the very powerful m20 and quad. combine this extremely expensive tech of the ost and you are are going to once again see massive issues.

Basically the only way ost can survive early game is the use of mg42 and snipers then along comes the dodge and fucks that plan up.

OMG, it's not like OKH main infantry have Panzerfausts is it?

Last time i checked the okw have volks with shreks pupchen and much easier access to puma's and flacktracks then the ost has to 222.