In a 4v4 game with all those Axis blobbers around I would prefer ZIS-3 over Pak-40 If I pick commander without guards. While Pak-40 is much better than ZIS-3 in terms of AT, ZIS-3 have great anti-blob capabilities in form of Barrage ability.
#metacall
PAK 40 is overperforming when compared to other AT guns
16 Oct 2014, 08:32 AM
#101
Posts: 1605 | Subs: 1
16 Oct 2014, 09:22 AM
#102
Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1
We could do this instead. ZIS shoot faster(2-3s?) while Pak shoot slower(4-5s?) with higher penetration and damage per shell(200 damage). You will still need 4 hits to kill a T-34 but this time a panzerfaust can be the death blow instead for any tank that gets hit by 3 pak shots. By doing this a tank hit by panzerfaust won't be killed instantly by 2 fastloading paks because of slower RoF. I think this would be quite balanced and also will be good for players looking for some realism.
Or we could go with the simple 3.5 seconds reload for all AT guns.
And just buff the 57mm already. That thing was powerful enough to kill the Panzer IV consistently yet it's not the case in the game.
Or we could go with the simple 3.5 seconds reload for all AT guns.
And just buff the 57mm already. That thing was powerful enough to kill the Panzer IV consistently yet it's not the case in the game.
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16 Oct 2014, 10:04 AM
#103
Posts: 41
Some building capabilities added to this explanation. Quite realistic and historical accurate in fact, huh?
that's hardly true, unless you've been dominating your opponent, you're not gonna get a big numerical advantage in term of armor.
Also consider population. You'll have maybe 1 more t34/76 than p4, but that's hardly a huge superiority, and they're far from expandable in most cases.
16 Oct 2014, 22:28 PM
#104
Posts: 108 | Subs: 1
OK, PAK is the best ATG. and ZIS is not bad ATG. It has a arty ability and more crews
but, USF ATG and OKW RL... It's sucks... USF ATG -> low penetration, OKW RL -> low range...
OK I know It's cheap. but I think, always expensive thing is better.
Well the issue with the OKW ATG is that it is a tier 0 unit.
That and since it can garrison buildings it kind of needs a real flaw.
16 Oct 2014, 22:49 PM
#105
Posts: 598
Apparently a Zis can fire 25 rounds per minute compared too a PAK 40 which shoots at 15 rounds per minute. Also got to keep in mind that the Soviets built more Zis 3 than the total amount of AT guns the Germans made.
Id perfer the Zis gun to have the same rate of fire as the PAK and be a bit cheaper and take less popcap. (This is to compesate for the lack of bazookas and panzershrecks the Soviets had)
The German mortars should also perform the same as the Soviet mortar and have the same vet 1 ability, unrelated suggestion.
Id perfer the Zis gun to have the same rate of fire as the PAK and be a bit cheaper and take less popcap. (This is to compesate for the lack of bazookas and panzershrecks the Soviets had)
The German mortars should also perform the same as the Soviet mortar and have the same vet 1 ability, unrelated suggestion.
16 Oct 2014, 22:51 PM
#106
Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1
Apparently a Zis can fire 25 rounds per minute compared too a PAK 40 which shoots at 15 rounds per minute. Also got to keep in mind that the Soviets built more Zis 3 than the total amount of AT guns the Germans made.And AoE enlargement for mortars as well so that it can kill with its explosion and not by sniping.
Id perfer the Zis gun to have the same rate of fire as the PAK and be a bit cheaper and take less popcap. (This is to compesate for the lack of bazookas and panzershrecks the Soviets had)
The German mortars should also perform the same as the Soviet mortar and have the same vet 1 ability, unrelated suggestion.
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16 Oct 2014, 23:14 PM
#107
Posts: 971
And AoE enlargement for mortars as well so that it can kill with its explosion and not by sniping.
That would make axis mortar barrage too powerful.
Mortars are fine as they are.
17 Oct 2014, 02:12 AM
#108
Posts: 108 | Subs: 1
Apparently a Zis can fire 25 rounds per minute compared too a PAK 40 which shoots at 15 rounds per minute. Also got to keep in mind that the Soviets built more Zis 3 than the total amount of AT guns the Germans made.
Id perfer the Zis gun to have the same rate of fire as the PAK and be a bit cheaper and take less popcap. (This is to compesate for the lack of bazookas and panzershrecks the Soviets had)
The German mortars should also perform the same as the Soviet mortar and have the same vet 1 ability, unrelated suggestion.
I have no idea where you came up with that. Zis3's reload is 4.425. Pak40's reload at a rate of 2.7 to 3.1
A Pak on its worst day has more DPS than a zis3.
17 Oct 2014, 04:57 AM
#109
Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1
That would make axis mortar barrage too powerful.
Mortars are fine as they are.
Make all mortars fire the same rate. Buff the AoE. All mortars are awesome now. Soviet mortar more accurate. German mortar spread out a bit more.
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17 Oct 2014, 04:58 AM
#110
Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1
He's talking about the RoF in real life. The real ZiS-3 could fired 25 rounds per minute and Pak 40 15 rounds per minute. In the game, they are swapped around.
I have no idea where you came up with that. Zis3's reload is 4.425. Pak40's reload at a rate of 2.7 to 3.1
A Pak on its worst day has more DPS than a zis3.
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17 Oct 2014, 04:59 AM
#111
Posts: 665
I have no idea where you came up with that. Zis3's reload is 4.425. Pak40's reload at a rate of 2.7 to 3.1
A Pak on its worst day has more DPS than a zis3.
He means in real life rate of fire, I think.
17 Oct 2014, 05:08 AM
#112
Posts: 2053
Apparently a Zis can fire 25 rounds per minute compared too a PAK 40 which shoots at 15 rounds per minute. Also got to keep in mind that the Soviets built more Zis 3 than the total amount of AT guns the Germans made.
Id perfer the Zis gun to have the same rate of fire as the PAK and be a bit cheaper and take less popcap. (This is to compesate for the lack of bazookas and panzershrecks the Soviets had)
The German mortars should also perform the same as the Soviet mortar and have the same vet 1 ability, unrelated suggestion.
I like this idea.
But what of the USF AT gun? At least when Ostheer gets overrun by tanks, their pak40 penetrates and damages tanks, scaring some tanks off. When USF gets charged by a KT after losing their last tank, spamming AT guns seriously will fail as they bounce like crazy AND get one shot (instead of simply being one shot like the pak). It has only one job, and it is pathetic that it does a crap job of it. Give it a price increase as long as it can actually do its job of being anti-tank.
Well, i often find the r43 to not be effective as well, but it is extremely difficult to completely eradicate OKW of its AT as to have them rely on the r43 (while despite its shorter range at rank 0, has higher penetration and faces tanks with overall less armor)
17 Oct 2014, 05:10 AM
#113
Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1
The 57mm definitely needs a buff in penetration. Right now I see no reason to take a 57mm over a pak unless you're really desperate for an AT gun.
I like this idea.
But what of the USF AT gun? At least when Ostheer gets overrun by tanks, their pak40 penetrates and damages tanks, scaring some tanks off. When USF gets charged by a KT after losing their last tank, spamming AT guns seriously will fail as they bounce like crazy AND get one shot (instead of simply being one shot like the pak). It has only one job, and it is pathetic that it does a crap job of it. Give it a price increase as long as it can actually do its job of being anti-tank.
Well, i often find the r43 to not be effective as well, but it is extremely difficult to completely eradicate OKW of its AT as to have them rely on the r43 (while despite its shorter range at rank 0, has higher penetration and faces tanks with overall less armor)
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17 Oct 2014, 08:18 AM
#114
Posts: 4928
I like the idea someone tossed out before, of the M1 57mm having higher penetration but doing 120 damage instead of the standard 160. That way, it's still inferior, but not useless.
AP rounds can increase penetration further and raise damage to 160 or more, to be worthwhile.
AP rounds can increase penetration further and raise damage to 160 or more, to be worthwhile.
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17 Oct 2014, 08:21 AM
#115
Posts: 1221 | Subs: 41
The 57mm definitely needs a buff in penetration. Right now I see no reason to take a 57mm over a pak unless you're really desperate for an AT gun.
Well...let's be honest here, there is no reason to pick up any atgun instead of PaK, because PaK does everything best. As long as you're airborne so you get access to 57mms on demand without the deadbeat Captain tier, the 57mm is definitely the second best ATgun in the game right now.
17 Oct 2014, 12:16 PM
#116
Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1
QFT.
Well...let's be honest here, there is no reason to pick up any atgun instead of PaK, because PaK does everything best. As long as you're airborne so you get access to 57mms on demand without the deadbeat Captain tier, the 57mm is definitely the second best ATgun in the game right now.
I cannot agree more. Germans have the best AT gun to counter cheap tanks. Allies have mediocre guns (teching cost, RoF, blah blah blah. except Airborne 57mm) to counter awesome German tanks. It's an obvious mess in how things work so far.
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17 Oct 2014, 15:34 PM
#117
Posts: 1595 | Subs: 2
QFT.
I cannot agree more. Germans have the best AT gun to counter cheap tanks. Allies have mediocre guns (teching cost, RoF, blah blah blah. except Airborne 57mm) to counter awesome German tanks. It's an obvious mess in how things work so far.
Double QFT. They also get the best hand held A/T (Shrek).
The views and opinions expressed in my posts and topics are solely those of the Napalm. These views and opinions do not necessarily represent those of Relic, the developers, The Angry Bears and/or any/all contributors to this site.
17 Oct 2014, 15:40 PM
#118
Posts: 2070
Double QFT. They also get the best hand held A/T (Shrek).
Triple QFT. They also get the best infantry
Axis doesn't have the best AT options in the game
17 Oct 2014, 15:50 PM
#119
Posts: 1605 | Subs: 1
Well...let's be honest here, there is no reason to pick up any atgun instead of PaK, because PaK does everything best. As long as you're airborne so you get access to 57mms on demand without the deadbeat Captain tier, the 57mm is definitely the second best ATgun in the game right now.
/disagree
I mean, yeah, Pak-40 best *AT* gun hands down, but ZIS-3 barrage rocks. It helps a lot against all those blobbers around. Name it metacall if you wish
I like it when AT gun is able to defend itself against infantry or even dislodge opposing weapon crews like MG-42.
17 Oct 2014, 17:07 PM
#120
Posts: 2070
I enjoy the barrage ability as well, but I do wish for a ZiS buff
Axis doesn't have the best AT options in the game
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