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Finally a reason for Relic to Nerf that BS

4 Aug 2014, 05:43 AM
#21
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 807



If this is true then how is anyone winning as OKW? How did Hans beat omgpop who is the best USA player and also beat Pi in the tournament? If they are as weak as you cry about all the time, then they should not be able to be able to win games with but clearly people do.

This is not even about faction balance anymore, this is you just playing only one side of the faction, being bad and having some sort of victim complex. Yes the game needs balancing but the amount you whine about it, I don't even understand why you play this game. Its like going to see a movie you hate, whine about 24/7 but keep going to see it.

The game needs balancing but OKW are not as weak as you make them out to be and you should really stop just playing one faction or just quit the game, or maybe just actually get good at the game.


OKW is a strong faction in 1v1. In 2v2 or more... ummm.... they are rather weak. Unlike vcoh, in more than 1v1 games, a coh2 win generally requies alot of powerfull tanks on the field, and mobility, which OKW has not. The only maps OKW is good in 2v2 are the narrow maps, as Road to kharkow, Rails and metal and such. Not to many chances on Hurtgen Forrest, Moscow Outskirts and such. So the best combo must be OKW + OH on 2v2 and OH+OH+OKW in 3v3. OH can help OKW with the fuel income and is versatile,mobile and vehicle based, while OKW is rough, static, and infantry based.

On topic: I think VonIvan's idea for increasing kubelwagon efficiency versus sniper is the only sensible approach.
4 Aug 2014, 05:48 AM
#22
avatar of axeitall

Posts: 3



OKW is a strong faction in 1v1. In 2v2 or more... ummm.... they are rather weak. Unlike vcoh, in more than 1v1 games, a coh2 win generally requies alot of powerfull tanks on the field, and mobility, which OKW has not. The only maps OKW is good in 2v2 are the narrow maps, as Road to kharkow, Rails and metal and such. Not to many chances on Hurtgen Forrest, Moscow Outskirts and such. So the best combo must be OKW + OH on 2v2 and OH+OH+OKW in 3v3. OH can help OKW with the fuel income and is versatile,mobile and vehicle based, while OKW is rough, static, and infantry based.

On topic: I think VonIvan's idea for increasing kubelwagon efficiency versus sniper is the only sensible approach.


I don't see what relevance that has to what I posted. My point was Vetlol makes OKW out to be so bad that they are literally impossible to win with and that he really needs to take a chill pill on the whining.
4 Aug 2014, 05:57 AM
#23
avatar of DarthBong420

Posts: 381



I don't see what relevance that has to what I posted. My point was Vetlol makes OKW out to be so bad that they are literally impossible to win with and that he really needs to take a chill pill on the whining.

considering that the two posts you have on this site are both wining about vetlol i might say that you need to take a chill pill on the wining.
4 Aug 2014, 06:26 AM
#25
avatar of ShadowTreasurer

Posts: 122

It's basically that Soviet T1 is broken. Getting m3s at 2 minutes and being able to load flamers in them like a bunch of clowns is ridiculous. It's a problem for both Ost and OKW, since both can only get counters at maybe 5-6 mins minimum.

This strategy also points out the flaws of soviet "teching". You can get an ISU (counter AT guns, inf and most tanks) out at 20 mins and 2nd at 24-25 mins easily, if you have at least 1 fuel point. It's often better to just rely on guards + T1 + T2 and forget about T3/T4. This can be too strong against opponents who decide to tech... This goes the same for ostheer who skip teching and spam tigers...
4 Aug 2014, 06:29 AM
#26
avatar of VindicareX
Patrion 14

Posts: 312

It's basically that Soviet T1 is broken. Getting m3s at 2 minutes and being able to load flamers in them like a bunch of clowns is ridiculous. It's a problem for both Ost and OKW, since both can only get counters at maybe 5-6 mins minimum.

The strategy also points out the flaws of soviet "teching". You can get an ISU out at 20 mins and 2nd at 24-25 mins easily, if you have at least 1 fuel point. It's often better to just rely on guards + T1 + T2 and forget about T3/T4.


Agree with this. M3 Scout Cars and American T1 AA Half Track skew the balance heavily.
4 Aug 2014, 08:48 AM
#27
avatar of VetLolcake

Posts: 342

Permanently Banned
It's basically that Soviet T1 is broken. Getting m3s at 2 minutes and being able to load flamers in them like a bunch of clowns is ridiculous. It's a problem for both Ost and OKW, since both can only get counters at maybe 5-6 mins minimum.

This strategy also points out the flaws of soviet "teching". You can get an ISU (counter AT guns, inf and most tanks) out at 20 mins and 2nd at 24-25 mins easily, if you have at least 1 fuel point. It's often better to just rely on guards + T1 + T2 and forget about T3/T4. This can be too strong against opponents who decide to tech... This goes the same for ostheer who skip teching and spam tigers...


M3 + flame is ridiculous OP as is Maxim spam. Relic never fix it....
4 Aug 2014, 11:46 AM
#29
avatar of Flamee

Posts: 710

Let's keep it civil here guys.
4 Aug 2014, 11:51 AM
#30
avatar of Cardboard Tank

Posts: 978

The problem is the two man squad the soviet sniper comes in. That´s way too hard to kill. A 222 may seem like a good option, but above a certain level the opponent will spam mines. The pioneers with minesweepers can detect one mine at best and then have to retreat.

Currently your best bet is to have a lucky mortar shot and god knows that is a shitty strategy that can´t be relied on. This dual sniper squad ruins games.
4 Aug 2014, 13:11 PM
#31
avatar of steel

Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1

The problem is the two man squad the soviet sniper comes in. That´s way too hard to kill. A 222 may seem like a good option, but above a certain level the opponent will spam mines. The pioneers with minesweepers can detect one mine at best and then have to retreat.

Currently your best bet is to have a lucky mortar shot and god knows that is a shitty strategy that can´t be relied on. This dual sniper squad ruins games.
The sniper team is fine if it didn't steer away from realism too much. From what I remember WW2 snipers were always working alone and never with a mate. To justify for the two men, the Soviet sniper shoots slower compared to his German counterpart. Is this another stereotype of Soviet inferiority. Vasily Zaitsev was one of the best sniper and he was a Soviet. Both snipers should be equal and get better with vet.
4 Aug 2014, 13:17 PM
#32
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

jump backJump back to quoted post4 Aug 2014, 13:11 PMsteel
The sniper team is fine if it didn't steer away from realism too much. From what I remember WW2 snipers were always working alone and never with a mate. To justify for the two men, the Soviet sniper shoots slower compared to his German counterpart. Is this another stereotype of Soviet inferiority. Vasily Zaitsev was one of the best sniper and he was a Soviet. Both snipers should be equal and get better with vet.


Actually, soviet snipers did worked in pairs.
German snipers worked alone and US and brits didn't really used snipers, but sharpshooters.
4 Aug 2014, 13:33 PM
#33
avatar of FrikadelleXXL

Posts: 390

Permanently Banned
The problem is the two man squad the soviet sniper comes in. That´s way too hard to kill. A 222 may seem like a good option, but above a certain level the opponent will spam mines. The pioneers with minesweepers can detect one mine at best and then have to retreat.

Currently your best bet is to have a lucky mortar shot and god knows that is a shitty strategy that can´t be relied on. This dual sniper squad ruins games.


The german sniper has a way better reload time and the special ability is very strong too.
4 Aug 2014, 14:06 PM
#34
avatar of JohnThomas

Posts: 19

Incredible how no one in this thread has said the 2 man soviet sniper squads are a problem due to not being able to counter snipe them. The best way to kill a sniper early on is to counter snipe him, however this doesn't work against 2 man squads.

The problem isn't that soviet snipers are too good, its that they are too hard to kill.

And then for OKW the kubel is terrible at chasing snipers.
4 Aug 2014, 14:10 PM
#35
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 807



And then for OKW the kubel is terrible at chasing snipers.


Which is why improving kubel efficiency against snipers is probably the best solution.
4 Aug 2014, 14:18 PM
#36
avatar of steel

Posts: 1963 | Subs: 1



Actually, soviet snipers did worked in pairs.
German snipers worked alone and US and brits didn't really used snipers, but sharpshooters.
Oh, you're right. I made a mistake regarding the sniper team. Need to find proper sources next time instead of a thin book from the local library. My bad.

Btw, the Brits do use snipers. In Dunkirk, British snipers were the ones who delayed the German advance. British snipers were trained to conceal themselves with camouflage clothing. It's just that they didn't train many men to be snipers.
4 Aug 2014, 14:28 PM
#37
avatar of adrian23

Posts: 87



M3 + flame is ridiculous OP as is Maxim spam. Relic never fix it....



dude please.. just go lock yourself in a basement and never come out we had enough of your bullshit
4 Aug 2014, 14:32 PM
#38
avatar of Katitof

Posts: 17914 | Subs: 8

Incredible how no one in this thread has said the 2 man soviet sniper squads are a problem due to not being able to counter snipe them. The best way to kill a sniper early on is to counter snipe him, however this doesn't work against 2 man squads.

The problem isn't that soviet snipers are too good, its that they are too hard to kill.

And then for OKW the kubel is terrible at chasing snipers.


That is because they were never meant to.
Sov T1 is 100% AI tier, its supposed to be better then wehr T1 for AI duties as all you have is direct infantry counters, 0% AT, even soft one.

Also, its fully possible to counter snipe sov snipers, ger sniper in green cover cloaks faster then sov sniper can aim and vet1 ability can one shot both snipers. You need some micro, but its just wrong to say they can't be counter sniped.

And if you kill one model, its 90mp kill, which is plenty, it also forces his sniper off the field, which allows yours to work freely, then just hold fire and wait for sov sniper again, grenadiers and MG42s will handle conscripts, penals and guards, especially if sniper will be too afraid to shoot, waiting for your.
4 Aug 2014, 14:43 PM
#39
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 1225



Actually, soviet snipers did worked in pairs.
German snipers worked alone and US and brits didn't really used snipers, but sharpshooters.

Nah. German snipers worked sometimes alone, sometimes in pairs, and were in sporadic occassions sometimes used in up to even platoon strength all depending on circumstance, training and preference. The various German sniper schools were rather heterodox in their approaches. Same with the Soviets btw.. The British and some Commonwealth nations had all implemented regular sniper programmes by the closing stages of the war - programmes that were fully up to par with the other main belligerants in this regard.
4 Aug 2014, 14:54 PM
#40
avatar of __deleted__

Posts: 1225

Katitof, yes of course you can countersnipe a Soviet sniper, however no Soviet player worth his salt will only use one pair, and secondly, in the sniper matchup, the Soviet player has the fundamental advantage that while his German counterpart needs to get it right all the time, he only has to get it right once. I've used Soviet snipers alot, and even against good opponents, I can count the instances where I got countersniped on one hand. The German sniper is not an effective counter to the Soviet sniper, a mortar is actually a good deal more dangerous.
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