lol i used the heat rounds today. it was like taking a club to a gun fight. it was like a slow motion turd hitting the E8. a kingtiger shooting this looked about as good as it worked. fucking retarded ability. why not TUNGSTEN rounds? they are high velocity AT rounds? no can't have something that makes sense for Germans, like the field repairs, they should have been on ost doc not okw, but that would make sense.
the p4's are only good in 3v3 and 4v4 where you can spam like 6 of them. but they WILL fail when you meet up with the heavier medium allied tanks or IS-2. the only succesfull things i have them do is go suicide on a katushka, b4, and flanking ISU while kingtiger takes shots. the flanking ISU is only good after you destroy their defenses, so it really makes these p4's only good for suicide missions at the point they come out. I say lower cp to 7.
Oberkommando West: Elite Armored Doctrine (Feedback)
24 Jul 2014, 18:28 PM
#21
Posts: 381
24 Jul 2014, 22:25 PM
#22
Posts: 129
Indeed "Elite" sounds like some sort of prank after you actually tried it on the field.
I was so disappointed when I realized that by getting commander I have to relinquish the MG, which is my instant upgrade upon callin' on KT.
any battlegroup is nice in theory, so is the Pz4's I guess.. but when will you ever have to extra 200 fuel lyin' around with OKW ?
and HE rounds ?!? they must be bugged no?! First time I activated that ability I almost pissed myself ! It looked like someone left my KT's turret cover open over the rainy night and all my munitions got soaked till complete uselessness lol ;X one word "duds"
I was so disappointed when I realized that by getting commander I have to relinquish the MG, which is my instant upgrade upon callin' on KT.
any battlegroup is nice in theory, so is the Pz4's I guess.. but when will you ever have to extra 200 fuel lyin' around with OKW ?
and HE rounds ?!? they must be bugged no?! First time I activated that ability I almost pissed myself ! It looked like someone left my KT's turret cover open over the rainy night and all my munitions got soaked till complete uselessness lol ;X one word "duds"
25 Jul 2014, 00:01 AM
#23
Posts: 1225
"Elite Armored" sounds hilariously cheesy to begin with, but ye, its that feeling when you were promised a Beemer and got a Fiat 500.
25 Jul 2014, 00:13 AM
#24
Posts: 1637
I like it personally. Because OKW lacks Generalist Armor or any decent AI armor that isnt the massively expensive KT.
As I like the parable OKW is an inversed Soviet faction in alot of ways. Instead of numerous cheap and specialized they are small expensive and specialized.
I feel like I am trying to bring an SU85 to every battle with them. Its great if their is armor but oh crap there is only an infantry blob with Bazookas....sigh....(Panther Puma JP4)
So the P4s fill that gap for me. JP4 behind P4s is excellent Synergy if you can get the fuel for it. And I dont need to tech to every building.
As I like the parable OKW is an inversed Soviet faction in alot of ways. Instead of numerous cheap and specialized they are small expensive and specialized.
I feel like I am trying to bring an SU85 to every battle with them. Its great if their is armor but oh crap there is only an infantry blob with Bazookas....sigh....(Panther Puma JP4)
So the P4s fill that gap for me. JP4 behind P4s is excellent Synergy if you can get the fuel for it. And I dont need to tech to every building.
The PTRS's are fine as they are. Whenever i'm up against Guard Infantry, I always have to be careful with my vehicles or the Guards will completely destroy them. Good range, good damage and fairly cheap; if anything, the PTRS should nerfed since it's ridiculously good for the price. Even in the hands of Conscripts, the PTRS's are extremely potent.
25 Jul 2014, 02:30 AM
#25
Posts: 3552 | Subs: 2
lol i used the heat rounds today. it was like taking a club to a gun fight. it was like a slow motion turd hitting the E8. a kingtiger shooting this looked about as good as it worked. fucking retarded ability. why not TUNGSTEN rounds? they are high velocity AT rounds? no can't have something that makes sense for Germans, like the field repairs, they should have been on ost doc not okw, but that would make sense.
I know I am not going to win any friends by mentioning "reality", but the Germans were short of tungsten by the time of the late 44/45 battles for a variety of reasons not least that the allies out bid them for the very limited supplies availible
Resident Soviet Whiner and Grand Master Bias Jedi; General Secretary of the Soviet Whine Hydra Collective; Axis Hating Sheeple; Allied Butt Buddy! Collect Them All!
Also the African Branch of TAB Bulletins
PS: The Italian Army fought with courage and skill
Also the African Branch of TAB Bulletins
PS: The Italian Army fought with courage and skill
25 Jul 2014, 02:31 AM
#26
Posts: 3552 | Subs: 2
I like it personally. Because OKW lacks Generalist Armor or any decent AI armor that isnt the massively expensive KT.
Which does beg the question, if that is what you want, why aren't you playing OKH in the first place?
Resident Soviet Whiner and Grand Master Bias Jedi; General Secretary of the Soviet Whine Hydra Collective; Axis Hating Sheeple; Allied Butt Buddy! Collect Them All!
Also the African Branch of TAB Bulletins
PS: The Italian Army fought with courage and skill
Also the African Branch of TAB Bulletins
PS: The Italian Army fought with courage and skill
25 Jul 2014, 02:41 AM
#27
Posts: 1225
I know I am not going to win any friends by mentioning "reality", but the Germans were short of tungsten by the time of the late 44/45 battles for a variety of reasons not least that the allies out bid them for the very limited supplies availible
Since when did "reality" figure prominently in this game? "Reality" is a pretty bizarre notion if you want to have a fun, balanced game.
25 Jul 2014, 03:22 AM
#28
Posts: 4928
I know I am not going to win any friends by mentioning "reality", but the Germans were short of tungsten by the time of the late 44/45 battles for a variety of reasons not least that the allies out bid them for the very limited supplies availible
It wasn't that they were short of Tungsten, it's that they decided it had better industrial applications other than being flung at enemy metal boxes hundreds of meters away.
Gotta say, given the performance of the Puma's 50mm gun, I have to assume they're using Tungsten rounds for that
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
25 Jul 2014, 03:25 AM
#29
Posts: 29
The biggest problem I have with this doctrine is its heavy reliance on munitions. It is an armor-centered doctrine, but everything is so expensive. Besides, the doctrine offers abilities to your armored vehicles, there is no other type of utility (i.e. airstrikes, infantry upgrades, etc.).
I think the costs should be lowered. And I also endorse the fact of scrapping the PIV's (which I know will not happen) and replacing it with a Tiger Ace equivalent, but in a Tiger II form (maybe not with instant Vet 5, however). This may seem overpowered at first, but it makes more sense than sending out lackluster PIV's as opposed to an elite King Tiger, maybe one that comes out with all of the doctrine's abilities that can be used for free as opposed to Vet.
I think the costs should be lowered. And I also endorse the fact of scrapping the PIV's (which I know will not happen) and replacing it with a Tiger Ace equivalent, but in a Tiger II form (maybe not with instant Vet 5, however). This may seem overpowered at first, but it makes more sense than sending out lackluster PIV's as opposed to an elite King Tiger, maybe one that comes out with all of the doctrine's abilities that can be used for free as opposed to Vet.
25 Jul 2014, 03:32 AM
#30
Posts: 4928
You just love heavy tanks, don't you Aces?
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
25 Jul 2014, 03:35 AM
#31
Posts: 2053
What was up with all the F1 panzer IV's in many of the WFA screenshots?
Anyways, for sure HE rounds and the repair ability need to be revised. They are pretty crap abilities. :/
Anyways, for sure HE rounds and the repair ability need to be revised. They are pretty crap abilities. :/
25 Jul 2014, 03:36 AM
#32
Posts: 1637
Which does beg the question, if that is what you want, why aren't you playing OKH in the first place?
No linear tech. More than just grens. Aggressive nature if the faction. Lacking general armor is a weakness not a strength. It's like having a single Sherman call in to supplement soviet T4.
On another note why is that a common retort. Even wit similar unit roster Ost and OKW do not play the same at all.
The PTRS's are fine as they are. Whenever i'm up against Guard Infantry, I always have to be careful with my vehicles or the Guards will completely destroy them. Good range, good damage and fairly cheap; if anything, the PTRS should nerfed since it's ridiculously good for the price. Even in the hands of Conscripts, the PTRS's are extremely potent.
25 Jul 2014, 03:41 AM
#33
Posts: 4928
Gotta say with so many PIV's with schurzen in OKW screenshots, I was very disappointed to learn that OKW's main tank wasn't a Panzer IV Ausf. H, and that it in fact did not have a main tank despite being the tank army.
Oh well, shit happens. What needs to be done is simply buff Elite Armoured so that it may be as viable as any other Doctrine.
Oh well, shit happens. What needs to be done is simply buff Elite Armoured so that it may be as viable as any other Doctrine.
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
25 Jul 2014, 03:44 AM
#34
Posts: 29
You just love heavy tanks, don't you Aces?
Yeah I do. It's just great the kind of effects that the heavies can have on a battle. It's also fun to watch and come up with ways to counter them and take them down, almost like some sort of boss battle.
25 Jul 2014, 07:11 AM
#35
Posts: 4928
Anyways, as for the doctrine, well here are my ideas.
Signal Relay, not sure how it works so I won't really comment on changes.
Critical Repair is bad. It costs more than Vehicle Repair and the US Counterpart, which is also instant. Vehicle Repair is not only cheaper, but the arbitrary thread of decrew isn't there. Reduce the cost, and possibly get rid of the decrew threat.
HEAT Rounds, make 'em passive, and more accurate. This would have the side-effect of making the Panzer IV's more worth it, or making the Commander more favorable overall.
Panzer Commander, decrease the cost of his artillery, and increase his sight range. Currently it's hard to justify getting him over an MG 42 mount.
Panzer IV call-in, reduce to 7 CP's. They're comparable to a Sherman Tank with none of it's abilities and worse anti-infantry, they are not worthy of 9CP like the T-34/85 is.
Alternatively, buff the Panzer IV's, perhaps in armour, health, or penetration. This call-in has to compete with the Panther, which is a staple of OKW play.
Signal Relay, not sure how it works so I won't really comment on changes.
Critical Repair is bad. It costs more than Vehicle Repair and the US Counterpart, which is also instant. Vehicle Repair is not only cheaper, but the arbitrary thread of decrew isn't there. Reduce the cost, and possibly get rid of the decrew threat.
HEAT Rounds, make 'em passive, and more accurate. This would have the side-effect of making the Panzer IV's more worth it, or making the Commander more favorable overall.
Panzer Commander, decrease the cost of his artillery, and increase his sight range. Currently it's hard to justify getting him over an MG 42 mount.
Panzer IV call-in, reduce to 7 CP's. They're comparable to a Sherman Tank with none of it's abilities and worse anti-infantry, they are not worthy of 9CP like the T-34/85 is.
Alternatively, buff the Panzer IV's, perhaps in armour, health, or penetration. This call-in has to compete with the Panther, which is a staple of OKW play.
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
25 Jul 2014, 07:28 AM
#36
Posts: 320
The P4 call in would make sense if it would be the Panzer IV Ausf. H directly with armored skirts, better gun (L48) etc. The HEAT should be replaced with a passive buff like in COH1 with maybe 20% more penetration.
25 Jul 2014, 07:44 AM
#37
Posts: 4928
Agreed, especially since it's already modeled after an H, and not a J. I wouldn't mind a 230 Fuel Cost if we got 2 Panzer IV Ausf. H's that came with 200 Frontal and 150 Rear, with 150 Penetration (30 higher than standard).
On the other hand, a J for a fuel starved faction makes sense, they just need to make it more worthwhile, which currently, it isn't. Much to my disappointment, being a fan of the Panzer IV.
On the other hand, a J for a fuel starved faction makes sense, they just need to make it more worthwhile, which currently, it isn't. Much to my disappointment, being a fan of the Panzer IV.
all you filthy hotchkiss lovers need to l2p #TeamPanzerIII
> Kriegsbeute Doctrine|Partisan Rework|British Infantry Rework|Soviet Assault Squad <
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