Broken balance - Soviets vs OKW

Rear Echelons have the suppression ability because the Americans don't have tier 1 HMGs.

Yes, but you see the problem?

The game have all this "fixes" for balance, with unreal (too unreal) things...

I never see in real battle 1 or 2 infantry (that make 12 mans) in front (low distance) of the tank with no problem and kill it, but put a panzer4 coh2 versus guards with AT rifle and you see a man winning the tank, but this same rifle dont rip infantry (lol)... Just a example of balance, they make one weapon that use bipod, only for long range get used for stand shots, and low or medium distance too...

MG42 fire rounds go to alien forces in 30 seconds, i put my fire rounds and dont make any shot, but he dissapear... etc etc...

Shocks that are a ultra anti infantry unit, they survive a lot of shots, but put 1 tank and they get ripped fast, but the same tank dont make it versus others infantry with less armor (i think the shocks guys have a big ass, soo is better for tank accuracy lol)... etc etc...

then KV-8 hit the field, had raketenwerfer in building, it barely fired 2 shots and was dead, Volks with shrecks fired once and had to retreat, Puma couldn't penetrate it's front and had troubles with rear

By the way, yesterday i got surprised. After 2 shots from 2 diferent Panzer IV, it couldn't even scratch KV-8 front armor. Is it correct or i got some terrible bug?

Don't upgrade them with G43s. The difference isn't big enough to warrant that. The advantage is they require no build time early on, are cheap/effective, and they see kind of like snipers. All munitions upgrades go to the first 3 x panzershrecks.

https://coh2-stats.herokuapp.com/small_arms

I like FJ's surprise ability but they are so, so expensive to reinforce and to lose.

Panzerfusiliers + Volksgrens with Panzershreck is a good duo to use at least against the USA.

With Luft, you have access to tank traps which is borderline OP against US, rear echelon don't have demo charges, unless US go armor for bulldozer sherman, non of their tank have heavy crush, tank traps have been buffed quite a lot in WFA, tank traps + Jagdpanzer IV = u put a middle finger to US armor as they can't flank your tank, I have caused a rage quit when I tank traps the whole middle sections in Semois and they can only go in the north VP and die there.

^^

I'm still wondering what the use of the Sherman's bulldozer abilites can be in a game. How are the tank traps OP against US? The Sherman's make barricade ability is curious and I don't get its practical use outside of maps like lazur factory.

With OKW special forces (early game),the German Volksgrenadier troops get 10 muni (15 adjusted) Assault grenadier attack with 2 minute timer that is a tremendous bargain and OP IMO. These can clear out support weapons and wipe squads, and lower reliance on sturmpioneers for DPS.

why doesnt OKW get pak. I dont get it. Madness.

They got racket thing. I'd say it's better than PaK.

why doesnt OKW get pak. I dont get it. Madness.

Because they got rocketenwerfer?

Will you stop going full retard and learn to play finally?

here is a replay of soviet vs OKW:

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  1

  VS

  DjeyDjey

  ELDAD

  OKW vs Soviet thread

  by: DjeyDjey map: Langreskaya

  1

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I play whithout M3A1, Maxim and KV-8 but with conscript
It was incredibly hard. The guy ragequit at the end but I was close to ragequit as well. So much rage on each side => rage balance is ok
Cons spam is considered OP, so what can the soviet player do against OKW?

Note : On Lagreskaya North, the flak of the okw base can cover the norh VP...

^^

I'm still wondering what the use of the Sherman's bulldozer abilites can be in a game. How are the tank traps OP against US? The Sherman's make barricade ability is curious and I don't get its practical use outside of maps like lazur factory.

With OKW special forces (early game),the German Volksgrenadier troops get 10 muni (15 adjusted) Assault grenadier attack with 2 minute timer that is a tremendous bargain and OP IMO. These can clear out support weapons and wipe squads, and lower reliance on sturmpioneers for DPS.

Cause the US sucks ball at attacking frontly, tank traps + semois base pin = US rage quit after 10 mins max. Soviet can get a mortar or Zis barrage at break point, for US u have to gain the upper hand at early or mid game or you'll die late game. Seriously, pp should try tank trap + trench and put a Rakttenwerfer in it and laugh at the charging Shermans. Trench also works well against US especially if they don't have flamethrowers.

I'm not saying that the balance is perfect but I think Mechanized Regimental Company offers the best options for dealing with this.

I am going to assume that before CP2 you get the tools you need to kill the M3A1. You can get 251/17 up very quickly with resource conversion.

I am also going to assume that it gets vet 1 because it is cheap and does considerable damage. 251's Vet 1 power is a Smoke Screen power that can protect it from Guards buttoning fire. 251 has greater range than Guards. It has far greater range than it has sight. With the right circumstances and with units screening and scouting for the 251/17 it can act as a good fire support weapon and still battle even when Guards are present.

The Puma also gets smoke immediately for OKW so you can escape buttoning fire from them as well. Puma wrecks the M3A1 so Guards cannot use it to chase. It's a fairly potent defense and the Puma scales up against the T-34 pretty well. You don't want to fight it 1v1 but it can easily turn a fight with support.

If you survive until CP 2-3 you now have better options for dealing with Guards as well. You've sunk fuel into your anti-tank and suppression weapons so you can sink manpower into Fallscrimjagers. Fallscimjagers can kill snipers from behind pretty well and I bet they do pretty good against Guards too. I find that Fallscrimjagers are a little inconsistent and much prefer Obersoldaten but I think the early fuel investment will push you away from them. The MG-34 would also help deal with Guards as their immobility makes them a weak flanker.

You might be able to make other doctrinal infantry work as well. I've heard good praise for G43 Panzerfusiliers but if you're converting out of munitions and probably using smoke rounds so I don't think Breakthrough Tactics will offer much aside from the Sturm Offizer.

I've come to rescind this opinion. I was wrong.

I was just wrong:

1) Relying on any weapon team to defeat M3A1s is foolhardy. Snipers offer the perfect counter to every single early game play. Building a Kubelwagon is suicide against Soviets due to how effective the M3A1, Maxims and Conscripts are against it. Early game snipers are very hard to oppose.

2) You can totally lose map control before the 251/17 even arrives. M3A1 + Conscripts + Sniper is enough to force anything off if played well. Flamethrower comes out early and trivializes the DPS of Sturmpioneers against the M3A1. Snipers throw this fight even more out of balance.

3) Only an idiot doesn't go Tier 2 after Tier 1 Soviets. This build is stupid good against OKW. You get the suppression the Maxim covering the Snipers that invalidate elite troops with Conscripts everywhere. Early half-tracks are forced out or killed by ZiS guns. 251/17 can't escape a ZiS gun if it gets caught. The normally high reload time of the ZiS-3 is meaningless thanks to the "unsetup time" of the 251/17.

I had to go against Soviet T1 + T2 into Call-ins twice and I switched between two strategies and absolutely failed to anything with both. Soviet call-ins are stronger than ever with the superior IS-2 now in the battle. You can battle the enemy with your superior manpower force for ~20 minutes and then flatten what pathetic hope they have with mass medium tanks or heavy armor. God forbid he goes with the ISU-152 and you don't have Panther tech. Jagdpanzer doesn't stand a chance and has no flanking power.

Snipers have never really had any good hard counters but for the new side this brings it to a new level.

What fast unit does OKW have that can harry this unit?

Puma has no anti-infantry power except at point blank range. Aggressive actions are easily countered with AT grenades.

251/17 Flak AA Half-track has to setup to fire. You can just retreat early game and then later on it is no good at aggressive flanking actions.

Kubelwagon has joke durability and poor accuracy while moving.

Panzer II "Luchs" was moved to the Tier 4 building so it requires a bare minimum of 130 fuel to bring out! It's still fragile as hell and dies to a mine + AT gun shot.

It's like Fallscrimjager flank is the only way. You can't control what exit of the building your Fallscrimjagers get out of so even when you do have the right building access there's good way to do it. This is assuming you even have a building for the flank!

here is a replay of soviet vs OKW:

•  
  

  1

  VS

  DjeyDjey

  ELDAD

  OKW vs Soviet thread

  by: DjeyDjey map: Langreskaya

  1

  -

I play whithout M3A1, Maxim and KV-8 but with conscript
It was incredibly hard. The guy ragequit at the end but I was close to ragequit as well. So much rage on each side => rage balance is ok
Cons spam is considered OP, so what can the soviet player do against OKW?

Note : On Lagreskaya North, the flak of the okw base can cover the norh VP...

You use cons spam and wanna easy win? With 1 Maxpin that is better than MG42, MG34 and .50

If you doo more maxpin's, m3, mortar and shock: will be easy!

Anyone win any games with Soviets against OKW lately against better opponents? I cant win single game anymore. Will just wait for another patch. Soviets are totaly useles against experienced opponents.

Anyone win any games with Soviets against OKW lately against better opponents?

So you just win with an easy mode soviets and now that you are playing "better" opponents you should be able to beat them with the op faction and no skill on your part?

Most reliable AT for 1v1 so far for me is just one rocket AT, one shrek and then a Jagdpanther. That gives pretty nice protection for the tank hunter vs flanking. Compliment with fusiliers for their fausts.. Works a charm.

So you just win with an easy mode soviets and now that you are playing "better" opponents you should be able to beat them with the op faction and no skill on your part?

Sorry but I dont spam anything (MGs or M3A1), so please GTFO with this crap.

Sorry but I dont spam anything (MGs or M3A1), so please GTFO with this crap.

Not saying you are spamming anything. However, you are saying that because you are Soviets you should automatically win against "better" opponents. Maybe because you have failed to adapt to the new patch?

They got racket thing. I'd say it's better than PaK.

I don't know, I prefer ostheer pak if you ask me.

How are the tank traps OP against US?

The Luftwaffe Ground Forces are able to build tank traps that come with wire at 2CP and unless the US get a a airborne squad close to the with a demo charge then there is very little the US can do about that wire/tank trap combo. On a open map its only annoying but on some like Semois you can block off sections of the map with ease if you drive away the US player for a while...

I've been using a similar strat to what Corp Shephard mentioned to fight OKW and have had some success.

Basically my build order is T1, engineers, cons, scout car (put the engineers in the scout car and try to micro the bastard so he doesn't get killed).

Depending on what my opponent is doing I'll either get double sniper or another scout car, or if I see he's building up critical mass and blobbing (lots of blobbing going on these days) I'll go for T2 and get out a maxim or two followed by a Zi's.

I'm basically not building T3 or T4 if I can help it and using call ins (Guard Motor is best). If I do build one of those, it's normally T3.

Getting loads of kills with 120 mortar as well. Sometimes I'll get two if I feel like I'm ahead and it's a small map where I can easily reach his medic truck.

A lot of this relies on not making mistakes early and not losing expensive units like Sniper etc so keep an eye on your flanks and don't over commit your troops. I find that you have to adapt your fighting to more of a creeping forward approach to the usual fast paced flanks against Wehr. That's what's worked for me, but others will no doubt have a different opinion.

Cons spam just doesn't seem viable as the drop like flies and don't do well at all late game. Maxim spam can work too (depending on the map) but I try to avoid Maxim spam on principle. And if they have any units that can deploy in buildings Maxim spam gets owned quick.

Don't forget to place mines at every opportunity.

I have lost back to back games against OKW as Soviets against the same players I beat with wehr, even using tier 1-2 build or maxim spam, their infantry used aggressively is the key, it is extremely powerful, LOL at people saying Soviets attack move, with OKW infantry you don't have to, you can just march right through everything without even looking at your screen to see what it is.

I find it hilarious when people complain about the IS2, yes its now a heavy tank instead of a hopeless fuel eating glorified T34, I don't think either Axis side can really complain about late game units.