Panther overnerfed

No, Blitz on the Panther was op. The old Panther without Blitz is fine.

Blitz was OP no doubt about that. stat was wise it was fine

Vet 2 it was definitely not fine. AT nades frequently failed to penetrate the rear and many soviet tanks had issues penetrating it full stop even without vet. It could easily solo 2x T-34/76's without breaking a sweat. This highlights a major problem with only playing one faction, you have no idea what it was like to face a panther and how hard it was trying to kill one.

Especially with buffed Russian tanks, this abomination we call Panther right now, will never ever reach is previous power.

Thats the idea, it was nerfed for a reason, not to get buffed 2 months later. The panther isnt as bad as you make it out to be, stop living in the past.

If the Tiger really receives nerfs and the Panther doesn´t get a buff, I won´t be playing Ostheer any longer and jsut focus on the other three factions.

Still waiting on this source of the Tiger getting nerfed - so far all I've read is the usual Fatherland Fanboys posting about german nerfs and russian buffs.

Kinda stupid that the faction notorious for using superior armor, doesn´t get it.

Been living under a rock the past 12 months?

Exactly if tiger is nerfed and ostheer lategame armor remains as it is nerfed,i'm leaving ostheer for good as well.I'm not going to hide behind a defensive line all match fighting 85s,shermans.isu and is-2 buffed with pz 4s.

Care to link to your sources of soviet buffs?


The Panther might need minor adjustments, but as many people have stated previously, the issue isn't with the Panther but with call ins. The problem with only playing one faction is you constantly think that the grass is always greener but in reality it isn't.

^
2 x panzergrens with panzershrecks instead of paks

^
2 x panzergrens with panzershrecks instead of paks

Only to get 2 shotted by the t-34/85.

Not directly, but have them follow up behind the tanks to support them. The rockets do 120 damage @ 160 to 180 pen each. Eventually they will get shot up, and you'll have to retreat them.

Only to get 2 shotted by the t-34/85.

Makes me wonder how can you win a single game with that attitude.

From your posts it seems that no matter how many units you use or have, there is always a pair of 34/85 shooting at them.

hint:
If 85s shoot at infantry, they don't shoot at panther that can kill them off.

hint2:
If 85s shoot at Panther, AT infantry support can take them down.

T34/85's arent even THAT good vs infantry. They are decent. What really bugs me is the Tiger vs infantry...1 shot 3 models i feel...

everythingopplsnerf
inb4peopleaccusingmebeingfanboy

Makes me wonder how can you win a single game with that attitude.

From your posts it seems that no matter how many units you use or have, there is always a pair of 34/85 shooting at them.

hint:
If 85s shoot at infantry, they don't shoot at panther that can kill them off.

hint2:
If 85s shoot at Panther, AT infantry support can take them down.

HINT:I can't even get a panther for its price and build enough units to remain competitive.

HINT 2;Ur assumption is based on him charging in with his t-34s and nothing else,so i have tanks and support and he doesn't...and also i am on the defnsive advanatge....finally ur 'example' is based on 2 utterly high risk cost ineffective units that people seldom even bother to build in the first place.

So stuff ur snotty little 'advice' and shut it..everyone can see from replays and feel for themselves by playing what the current meta is..and what units are viable and what not.And guess what neither pzgrens,nor panther are.....and no matter how much u cry at the top of ur voice 'COMBINED ARMS' it won't change a damn thing..coz right now this phrase is just a skirt ur hiding ur sov fanboyism behind

T34/85's arent even THAT good vs infantry. They are decent. What really bugs me is the Tiger vs infantry...1 shot 3 models i feel...

everythingopplsnerf
inb4peopleaccusingmebeingfanboy

Ohoho here comes the expert...get the data correct on the scatter of the 85.When t-34 even 76s 2-3 shot german squads ur perfectly fine..but when late game tiger kills half ur 6 man squads..ouch no no no thats bugged.

Panther can't kill tanks..no no no thats bugged.
Tiger can't kill infantry..nonono thats bugged.

T-34/85 can kill both tanks and infantry,same for sherman...thats perfectly normal ofc.

This highlights a major problem with only playing one faction, you have no idea what it was like to face a panther and how hard it was trying to kill one.

Blabla, everybody who doesn´t share my opinion is a fanboy.

Thats the idea, it was nerfed for a reason, not to get buffed 2 months later.

Because every adjustment that was made is meant to be. Like the ISU-152 adjustments. It´s totally meant to be to destroy the late game.

But let´s stay serious: Russian tanks were meant to receive a bit better late game quality. That was stated in the patch notes. They received that. On top of that the Panther was castrated.

Been living under a rock the past 12 months?

Have you actually played the latest version?

HINT:I can't even get a panther for its price and build enough units to remain competitive.

Exactly. You doesn't equal the entire player base.

HINT 2;Ur assumption is based on him charging in with his t-34s and nothing else,so i have tanks and support and he doesn't...and also i am on the defnsive advanatge....finally ur 'example' is based on 2 utterly high risk cost ineffective units that people seldom even bother to build in the first place.

I see plenty of streamers building Panzer Grens in 1v1 and 2v2 and see them in 2v2 randoms.

So stuff ur snotty little 'advice' and shut it..everyone can see from replays and feel for themselves by playing what the current meta is..and what units are viable and what not

Funny you should say that, because the way you post you give the impression that everything you say is fact and if someone disagrees with you then its instantly wrong.

.And guess what neither pzgrens,nor panther are.....and no matter how much u cry at the top of ur voice 'COMBINED ARMS' it won't change a damn thing..coz right now this phrase is just a skirt ur hiding ur sov fanboyism behind

You seem like a Fatherland fanboy from your posts. Care to post your playercard to prove me wrong?

Blabla, everybody who doesn´t share my opinion is a fanboy.

Your posting style is pretty consistently germans up soviets op. Post your player card and prove me wrong.

But let´s stay serious: Russian tanks were meant to receive a bit better late game quality. That was stated in the patch notes. They received that. On top of that the Panther was castrated.

Russian tanks are finally on a much more level ground compared to German tanks (they have for the most part been inferior to them). Balancing is still going on, but Relic are far more focussed on working on the expansion instead of releasing patches a few weeks before the expansion hits.

Have you actually played the latest version?

I have, but I'm not sure how 2 months is the same as 12 months? Come back in 10 months and we will see if Soviet tanks have been superior for the entire time. Until then quit your whining because Germans have had superior tanks for far longer.

Only a hardcore biased person can say that pzgren and panther are perfectly viable options right now....u say i'm not the entire palyer base?Fine go ahead ..ask the player base.

While germans have had superior tanks for long is correct,so that means for next period soviets should dominate tanks?..fine.But don't at the same time try to convince its perfectly alright for ostheer .

The rest of my post was not directed at u but katitof with whom i have long standing 'friction' in multiple threads from other forum as well.He brings up combined arms then leaves.After the 24 th patch i made threads on m3 quite early..he laughed and said its L2P issue..said the same abt pzgrens..now the truth is unfolded fora ll to see and experience.

You think u can bluff and bark ur way out of the fact that panther and panzergren both suck balls pricewise ...well fine,let it stay this way.Once tiger is nerfed and panther stays the same ostheer will be dead faction unless corresponding changes are made to soviet medium call ins.

And what did you expected?

All your arguments boil down to the fact that either combined arms beat your single unit or 2-3 tanks that costs 280-300 beat single one that costs 175.

To me that is not bad balance, but denial to use equal resources in the skirmish and expectation to come on top based on... what exactly? RL stuff that is not relevant? Old patches that are not relevant? Tier cost that is indicator of WHEN unit hits the field, not how strong it is?

Vet 2 it was definitely not fine. AT nades frequently failed to penetrate the rear and many soviet tanks had issues penetrating it full stop even without vet. It could easily solo 2x T-34/76's without breaking a sweat. This highlights a major problem with only playing one faction, you have no idea what it was like to face a panther and how hard it was trying to kill one.

killing 2 t-34's solo is its job as is killing 2 t-34's 85 solo (it should be a close fight) a Dedicated TD should be absolutely be effective against tanks and beat between 2 to 2.5 times its worth in generalist tanks. and vet was ok.

killing 2 t-34's solo is its job as is killing 2 t-34's 85 solo (it should be a close fight) a Dedicated TD should be absolutely be effective against tanks and beat between 2 to 2.5 times its worth in generalist tanks. and vet was ok.

Apply micro, use 50 range on fausted 34s.

And what did you expected?

All your arguments boil down to the fact that either combined arms beat your single unit or 2-3 tanks that costs 280-300 beat single one that costs 175.

To me that is not bad balance, but denial to use equal resources in the skirmish and expectation to come on top based on... what exactly? RL stuff that is not relevant? Old patches that are not relevant? Tier cost that is indicator of WHEN unit hits the field, not how strong it is?

Ok guys, we have talked long time about the theory. Now I want to see the praxis. Katitof, you say you understand how the panther works, that's okay. Why don't show us a 1 vs 1 replay where you can show us all how to use it correctly. I'm sure this would be a good proof for your thesis.

Exactly let katitof show us panthers are used vs t-34/85s.Since i'm obv noob and admit can't.Maybe puppetmaster can too.

To have it instantly disregarded for not being top 10 player or fighting a noob opponent or whatever you'll come up with as excuse to keep blinders on your eyes and rain excuses on why you refuse to support your tanks with other AT means?

Been there, done that. I might post a rep when I'll get a gg, but putting an effort just to have it shot down instantly by likely worse players(yes, this is an assumption) isn't something I consider worth of spending time.
If being on coh2.org taught me something, its that unless you are top 10 your reps do not matter and if you are, they still doesn't matter(recent VonIvan replays in maxim spam thread, showing its counterable anyone?).

Even unsupported Tiger will go down to a pair of 34/85s and it still isn't bad balance.

What I can do however is point you out in the direction of players like HelpingHans who do actually go for T4 and succeed.

That is, if you are willing to see a player who actually uses combined arms properly(there is obviously more streamers like that, but they sometimes play soviets).

To have it instantly disregarded for not being top 10 player or fighting a noob opponent or whatever you'll come up with as excuse to keep blinders on your eyes and rain excuses on why you refuse to support your tanks with other AT means?

Been there, done that. I might post a rep when I'll get a gg, but putting an effort just to have it shot down instantly by likely worse players(yes, this is an assumption) isn't something I consider worth of spending time.
If being on coh2.org taught me something, its that unless you are top 10 your reps do not matter and if you are, they still doesn't matter(recent VonIvan replays in maxim spam thread, showing its counterable anyone?).

Even unsupported Tiger will go down to a pair of 34/85s and it still isn't bad balance.

What I can do however is point you out in the direction of players like HelpingHans who do actually go for T4 and succeed.

That is, if you are willing to see a player who actually uses combined arms properly(there is obviously more streamers like that, but they sometimes play soviets).

in short your all talk. some people can even make shit into gold but that doesnt mean its balanced they are simply better players.

Only a hardcore biased person can say that pzgren and panther are perfectly viable options right now....u say i'm not the entire palyer base?Fine go ahead ..ask the player base.

OK, I understand my playercard is Soviet biased but my ladder ranking is double that as Ostheer... Panzergrenadiers are a great unit that only need a *minor* buff...

Panther is also a wonderful unit that is performing well but is unattainable in any evenly matched 1v1 game since Ostheer tier four is prohibitively expensive.

I would be very surprised if the tiger wasn't nerfed on WFA launch.
I would be very surprised if IS-2 wasn't buffed on WFA launch.