Worst balance ever . soviet domination

I think balance problems are not as big. Mainly TM-35 mines and ISU need a relook.

If the german player plays well and makes good use of combined arms they are able to lock down soviet players quite easily. I have the imperssion german players got used to over extend too much and go for big map control instead of securing 1 fuel and ammo point and setting up a good position.

If you hold on fuel till Pz IV or Stug comes out balance easily flips in favor of the germans, especially if armor is played well with backup of pak, mg and mortar.

I see too many german players just rushing the whole map with gren squads not trying to fortify positions making using of half tracks to reinforce on the go etc.

The only problem now is late game when Soviets get an ISU out you are basically screwed unless you have an elefant. The squad wiping potential on ISU is just too big, especially if you make good use of attack ground and keep the ISU untouchable by german armor.

But those are just my 2 cents...

BS, you want Terminator aka Arnold Schwarzenegger with Mp44 back?

No, but there is a serious problem if a

- 340mp unit with high reinforce cost
- that has to attack close to mid range

has the same survivability as a

-240mp unit with average reinforce cost
- that is designed to stay at long range (usually cover).

That leads to Gren spam. The meta pre patch was about going for two PGs early to mid game. Nowadays for the same cost of two PGs you get two Grens and an ammo cache. A much better investment for your manpower. In fact I didn´t build a single PG in the last 5 games as Germans. Only Grens and Paks.

PGs are a liability atm. They aren´t as good as Grens on long range and never get in close range as they die like flies.

While I'm thinking myself the balance is not as it supposed to be, it's not the unit themselves (with a few exceptions). It's about the fact that it's easier to play with russians, they have so many abuse/spam tactics at hand. Meanwhile, I wouldn't like to have such tactics in the german side. I like to work my matches and earn my victories.
After last patch was implemented, I kind of feel more efficient building a more diverse army, fealding several unit types. My army usual composition in 2v2: grens, mg or field mortar, 1 pzgren squad, 1 SC, 1 PAK, 1-2 stugs/p4s, 1 ostwind, and of course Tiger. I feel more confortable this way and it's a more stabile formula. I don't believe in spam. Not on the german side.

The current metagame is really annoying. German plays Gren Spam into Opel Blitz Pz4 / Tiger Spam or Elefant, Sovjet spams Maxim or Scripts to ISU 152. It's just boring.

I agree with Vindicare, and I might add that in 2v2 the Soviet edge is more pronounced thanks to T1/T2 synergy. That being said, there are also a few issues with the Soviets, ie. the PPSh and its rather underwhelming performance in the hands of conscripts. I feel it should be designed in such a fashion as to keep the Script/Gren fight on an even keel im mid/late game, but LMG Grens will not only pretty reliably win a fight against PPSH cons but also stand a much better chance at wiping their counterparts thanks to their exceedingly better long range performance.

No, but there is a serious problem if a

- 340mp unit with high reinforce cost
- that has to attack close to mid range

has the same survivability as a

-240mp unit with average reinforce cost
- that is designed to stay at long range (usually cover).

That leads to Gren spam. The meta pre patch was about going for two PGs early to mid game. Nowadays for the same cost of two PGs you get two Grens and an ammo cache. A much better investment for your manpower. In fact I didn´t build a single PG in the last 5 games as Germans. Only Grens and Paks.

PGs are a liability atm. They aren´t as good as Grens on long range and never get in close range as they die like flies.

I'm sure they're never supposed to be used at close range, only excelling at medium range (at which they can take on pretty much anything on Sov side). I think the problem is that a lot of people have this preconceived notion that PzGrens are supposed to be running across roads into MG fire in order to get in close where they can then happily kill every guy within 10 feet and that's just not the case.

Whilst I have been playing WFA alpha I've really enjoyed the diversity of some of the commander abilities/ bulletins and the unique abilities they offer (which I will not disclose...). These seem much more varied now and add quite a refreshing wealth of strategies and so I hope some of these can be retrofitted to CoH2 (such as giving PzGrens a movement speed buff to HT's when they are inside them). These kinds of abilities would really help define the PzGrens (and other units for that matter) without them having, like you say, a cheaper unit that is more effective and cheaper to reinforce.

With the changes to the weapon profile/ survival mechanics the 'charge all dem guys wid ma Pgrenz and laugh' style of play shouldn't be rewarded and more tactical approaches should be. I completely agree that mines are a bit too cost effective atm, and building 3 M3s off the bat and hunting down retreating German squads with ease is leading to quite a harsh deal for Ost right now. But I'm hopeful however that with the release of WFA they will patch some of these issues

This is so true.

I find PzGens actually very useful, try put them in green cover and see what happens when any soviet forces try to close in on them. The effect is worse then running straight into an MG.

The most important thing seems to have them stop moving because of accuracy penalties.

I see too many people just trying to run up to units with PzGens and keep turning around them, instead they should try moving up the squad, halt it and then let them shoot for a few seconds. The results are often devastating.

BS, you want Terminator aka Arnold Schwarzenegger with Mp44 back?

lol?
What if there is Rambo(s) with M60 coming?

lol?
What if there is Rambo(s) with M60 coming?

What if there is Rambo(s) with MG34?

I agree I am not sure why players keep trying to use panzer grenadiers like they are assault grenadiers. They vanilla grenadiers with a different load oh. They are priced high to stop people from spamming them. They are not line infantry.....

They are not meant to leave cover, they aren´t meant to attack on range and they aren´t meant to attack too close. The only use they seem to have is to park them next to your MG in cover and hope the enemy is dumb enough to charge right into them.

Totally worth 340 mp. Well, don´t complain about Grenadier spam then, buddies.

Cant we keep threads like these on Steam or the Official forums?

I think COH2.org is getting infected and will need a shot of Penicillin.

They are not meant to leave cover, they aren´t meant to attack on range and they aren´t meant to attack too close. The only use they seem to have is to park them next to your MG in cover and hope the enemy is dumb enough to charge right into them.

Totally worth 340 mp. Well, don´t complain about Grenadier spam then, buddies.

Conscript squad deals 4.5 dps at long range.

Penal squad deals 4 dps at long range.

Pgrens deal 4.8 dps at long range.

And it only gets better for pgrens the close the sovs are.
Place LMG grens next to them and they will outgun all sov squads, excluding a pair of DP guards.

@JHeartless
but OP already got banned on official forums and steam forums for endless spamming and whining.

This is so true.

I find PzGens actually very useful, try put them in green cover and see what happens when any soviet forces try to close in on them. The effect is worse then running straight into an MG.

I put a lmg squad in green cover and it wins from any soviet infantry at any range safe for shocks but as soon as critical mass in grens is achieved even that is no longer a problem.

I put a lmg squad in green cover and it wins from any soviet infantry at any range safe for shocks but as soon as critical mass in grens is achieved even that is no longer a problem.

sounds like LMG over performing for cost, rather than pgrens being bad at what they do.

if gren spam is a problem, its not that other units are crap at what they do, LMGs are pretty fricking awesome.

it seems like what people want is german superiority over every, single, aspect. infantry? check, support teams? check, armour? check.

if(unitsNotBetterThanSoviets)
{
cryAtForums(mines, isu152);
}
else
{
unitsNotGoodEnough(pgrens);
}

sounds like LMG over performing for cost, rather than pgrens being bad at what they do.

if gren spam is a problem, its not that other units are crap at what they do, LMGs are pretty fricking awesome.

it seems like what people want is german superiority over every, single, aspect. infantry? check, support teams? check, armour? check.

if(unitsNotBetterThanSoviets)
{
cryAtForums(mines, isu152);
}
else
{
unitsNotGoodEnough(pgrens);
}

You left out the error handling....

and

LOL

The current metagame is really annoying. German plays Gren Spam into Opel Blitz Pz4 / Tiger Spam or Elefant, Sovjet spams Maxim or Scripts to ISU 152. It's just boring.

O'rly ??

Germans are FORCED to get Elephants (even then not all do) to counter the inevitable iWin ISU otherwise they are doomed.


Even then with mark target + concrete ISU can take out elephant while elephant cant do shit to anything except armor.

Save your whining!!! The western front armies are coming

You'll need your whining power fully charged

Yanks OP